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lazland View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 23 2022 at 14:46
Originally posted by Jared Jared wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

 I'll go with a dumbass bar if it has some good beer.

If it doesn't sell at least a couple of good quality real ales (preferably local), then it isn't worth walking in to...

Word!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 23 2022 at 15:27
Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Wonderful stuff so far Steve, and I'm really enjoying all aspects of it. Especially the ale house expos, which has me pining for old Blighty in order to get a decent pint. This American piss doesn't cut it for me anymore, which is why I've turned to hard spirits. Well, that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it. Cheers.
Generally I think European beer is far better than US, but recently two US beers came out that are not too bad. They are both dark winter time brews.
Breakfast Stout by Founders and
Dragons Milk by New Belgium
Not quite European standards, but still very good.
This is hooey. There are plenty of craft brewers in The States that have better beer than Europe/UK. Founders brewery was mentioned - try the KBS series. WinkGreat Divide brewery is superb. Granted, you won't get the charm and smells that an old ale house provide, but most of the craft beer I partake in is excellent.

BTW, cool website. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 24 2022 at 01:54
It’s a matter of taste, and so long as we recognise that it is a subjective opinion of what is better, it’s not hooey. I find British beers more to my taste than US beers, so I can say I find them better. That doesn’t mean I don’t like US beers, and obviously because I don’t live in the US, what US beers I have tried is only a small percentage of what is available.

But I have had a lot of NZ craft beers, and a lot of NZ brewers tend to take after the US style of craft brewing than the UK, which does give me a little more basis on which to feel more confident about saying I prefer UK style beers to US style beers.

The best beers I have tasted are either UK beers, or NZ beers in the UK style. I have tasted some mighty fine US beers, and NZ beers in the US style - but the best UK beers beat the best US (or US style) hands down.

The funny thing, to me, about UK and US beer styles is that it is similar to so much else between the two countries. The UK conforms to the stereotype of being subtle, and the US to the stereotype of being in your face. Depending on what flavour you like, and how you want to taste it, has a lot to do with whether one prefers UK or US beer.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 24 2022 at 05:03
Interesting conversation. I am a huge fan of classic real ale in the UK, but I am not particularly fond of many of the trendy “hipster” craft beers which have sprung up in recent times. My son very kindly purchased half a dozen of these from Cardigan for my Christmas present, and at least three of them were undrinkable. 

I like the beers of Malta a great deal, both the lager-like Cisk (perfect in the midday sun) and the more hoppy Hopleaf, a rather good ale and the only decent one I have had outside the UK.

My experience of American beer is very limited. I have never been there. All I will say is that I hate the corporate “beers” such as Budweiser and that bloody awful Canadian goose piss whose name I forget. However, I am absolutely confident that my very learned and tasteful friends here on PA will be drinking proper beers, brewed in proper ways.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 24 2022 at 05:30
Craft beer can mean quite different things in different countries. Certainly, in the UK, anything labelled craft, I tend to approach with a great deal of caution. There are a lot of UK craft beers that are not at all to my liking. It’s entirely possible (perhaps even probably) that people on either side of the Atlantic have vastly different ideas of what craft beer is.

Brewers have always experimented and innovated, but the difference between craft beer or not in the UK is often a similar difference between subtlety and over the top flavours that I already alluded to in the difference between many UK and US brewers. That doesn’t mean I don’t like it, by the way. There are some craft brews in the UK that I love, but they also tend to be the ones that may well have crossed the line, but haven’t left it too far behind.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 24 2022 at 05:50
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

My experience of American beer is very limited. I have never been there. All I will say is that I hate the corporate “beers” such as Budweiser and that bloody awful Canadian goose piss whose name I forget. However, I am absolutely confident that my very learned and tasteful friends here on PA will be drinking proper beers, brewed in proper ways.
If you ever make it to The States, I'm confident there are many brews you would enjoy. Those that say it tastes like piss aren't looking hard enough. There is enough variety to satisfy all tastes. I have never been to the UK, but I have drank plenty of Samuel Smith's, and Newcastle imports. Both good. I have been to several places in Europe, and drank several world renowned German, and other beers at the pub. All good, but nothing special to me. Tastes change and I stopped drinking IPA'S for many years but now enjoy them again. Stouts have always been a favorite to me. And now I'm enjoying several Burbon Barrel aged (minimun three years) ales that are amazing.

Anyway, cheers to good beer and good health.

Edited by Grumpyprogfan - April 24 2022 at 07:04
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 24 2022 at 07:15
Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Craft beer can mean quite different things in different countries. Certainly, in the UK, anything labelled craft, I tend to approach with a great deal of caution. There are a lot of UK craft beers that are not at all to my liking. It’s entirely possible (perhaps even probably) that people on either side of the Atlantic have vastly different ideas of what craft beer is.
Craft beer to me is a brew with flavor, one that makes you notice and appreciate the art taken in the brewing process. I'm curious to know what brands of USA import beer are available in the UK? And of course beer, like everything, is subjective. One person's nectar is another's poison.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 24 2022 at 10:03
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Craft beer can mean quite different things in different countries. Certainly, in the UK, anything labelled craft, I tend to approach with a great deal of caution. There are a lot of UK craft beers that are not at all to my liking. It’s entirely possible (perhaps even probably) that people on either side of the Atlantic have vastly different ideas of what craft beer is.
Craft beer to me is a brew with flavor, one that makes you notice and appreciate the art taken in the brewing process. I'm curious to know what brands of USA import beer are available in the UK? And of course beer, like everything, is subjective. One person's nectar is another's poison.

When people speak about US beer tasting like piss, they tend to mean the mass-brewed lagers like Bud - which do tend to be pretty gosh darn awful. I’m yet to taste one of those that I like. But lagers brewed by micro-brewers and craft-brewers tend to be full of flavour.

I’ve met a lot of US craft beer drinkers that find a lot of UK real ales flavourless and/or bland, simply because their palate is used to the full on flavours of so many US craft beers. When you say craft beer to you is a brew with flavour, then you seem to be leaning towards what I already said is the difference between UK and US tastes, when it comes to beer. Craft brewers definitely make you notice and appreciate the art taken in the brewing process - but UK drinkers tend to like subtlety, and US drinkers in-your-face. All taste for beer is subjective by nature, but that subjectivity can be affected by a number of things outside an individual’s control, and the brewing trends of where in the world one drinks is one such thing.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 10:56
Site updated with Top Ten Albums of 2016, new video of the week (classic Bowie), and beer of the week.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 12:07
Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Wonderful stuff so far Steve, and I'm really enjoying all aspects of it. Especially the ale house expos, which has me pining for old Blighty in order to get a decent pint. This American piss doesn't cut it for me anymore, which is why I've turned to hard spirits. Well, that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it. Cheers.
Generally I think European beer is far better than US, but recently two US beers came out that are not too bad. They are both dark winter time brews.
Breakfast Stout by Founders and
Dragons Milk by New Belgium
Not quite European standards, but still very good.
This is hooey. There are plenty of craft brewers in The States that have better beer than Europe/UK. Founders brewery was mentioned - try the KBS series. WinkGreat Divide brewery is superb. Granted, you won't get the charm and smells that an old ale house provide, but most of the craft beer I partake in is excellent.

BTW, cool website. 
Don't take me too seriously. I just needed an excuse to switch to Irish whiskey. Wink

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 12:09
More primo stuff, Steve. Your blog has a become an early morning favorite!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 12:51
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

More primo stuff, Steve. Your blog has a become an early morning favorite!

Thanks Steve, very much.

I think you will enjoy later this week my report of our”taproom takeover” by the founder of Evan Evans brewery. This was supposed to be last week, but somebody cocked up the beer delivery. Anyhow, we will be sampling five ales. I will be asking the missus to keep copious notes in case I become incapable of doing so! LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jared Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 12:55
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

I will be asking the missus to keep copious notes in case I become incapable of doing so! LOL

Can't help feeling you've got a good one there, Steve! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 13:09
Originally posted by Jared Jared wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

I will be asking the missus to keep copious notes in case I become incapable of doing so! LOL

Can't help feeling you've got a good one there, Steve! 

Absolutely Jared. In all seriousness, I count my blessings each and every day.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 25 2022 at 16:26
Sometimes I wish I was into this beer stuff more......Never was a big beer or alcohol guy, I have not a clue what all the jargon means. All I know is I tried a beer that was really dark colored and I about puked my innards, hideous tasting.....Dead

I can only drink beer that is very pale in color and that does not measure an 11 in bitter taste scale of 1-10. LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 26 2022 at 00:47
Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

Sometimes I wish I was into this beer stuff more......Never was a big beer or alcohol guy, I have not a clue what all the jargon means. All I know is I tried a beer that was really dark colored and I about puked my innards, hideous tasting.....Dead

I can only drink beer that is very pale in color and that does not measure an 11 in bitter taste scale of 1-10. LOL

You’d quite possibly like some more UK-style beers. Definitely a lot of US brewers tend to focus on the hops and bitterness, and there are a fair few beers out there measuring at least 11 on a scale of 1-10.

But regardless of where you are drinking, there is an enormous difference in flavour profiles both between the various types of beer, and even within them. That difference is even greater when seen between geographic regions. Generally speaking, for example, I don’t particularly like UK brown ales, but I almost always love Belgian brown ales.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 26 2022 at 01:48
Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

Sometimes I wish I was into this beer stuff more......Never was a big beer or alcohol guy, I have not a clue what all the jargon means. All I know is I tried a beer that was really dark colored and I about puked my innards, hideous tasting.....Dead

I can only drink beer that is very pale in color and that does not measure an 11 in bitter taste scale of 1-10. LOL

You’d quite possibly like some more UK-style beers. Definitely a lot of US brewers tend to focus on the hops and bitterness, and there are a fair few beers out there measuring at least 11 on a scale of 1-10.

But regardless of where you are drinking, there is an enormous difference in flavour profiles both between the various types of beer, and even within them. That difference is even greater when seen between geographic regions. Generally speaking, for example, I don’t particularly like UK brown ales, but I almost always love Belgian brown ales.


And to add to this, I cannot abide stouts or porters, the really dark ales. Guinness disagrees with just about every cell in my body. I will drink Newcastle Brown Ale if there is nothing else on tap, only the utterly undrinkable and disgusting keg creamflow processed bitters.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nick_h_nz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 26 2022 at 02:51
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

Sometimes I wish I was into this beer stuff more......Never was a big beer or alcohol guy, I have not a clue what all the jargon means. All I know is I tried a beer that was really dark colored and I about puked my innards, hideous tasting.....Dead

I can only drink beer that is very pale in color and that does not measure an 11 in bitter taste scale of 1-10. LOL

You’d quite possibly like some more UK-style beers. Definitely a lot of US brewers tend to focus on the hops and bitterness, and there are a fair few beers out there measuring at least 11 on a scale of 1-10.

But regardless of where you are drinking, there is an enormous difference in flavour profiles both between the various types of beer, and even within them. That difference is even greater when seen between geographic regions. Generally speaking, for example, I don’t particularly like UK brown ales, but I almost always love Belgian brown ales.


And to add to this, I cannot abide stouts or porters, the really dark ales. Guinness disagrees with just about every cell in my body. I will drink Newcastle Brown Ale if there is nothing else on tap, only the utterly undrinkable and disgusting keg creamflow processed bitters.

I love stouts and porters, but not Guinness. But then again, the Guinness you get in bars is nothing like any stout you’d get from a real ale brewer. Like the creamflow bitters, it has nitrogen added (to give it the creamflow), and it just tastes….meh. Newky brown disagrees with me as much as Guinness does with you. It’s the most horrendous example of a brown ale, and almost put me off the style entirely.

Probably because of what I grew up drinking, some of my favourite beers are UK ales brewed with NZ hop varieties, giving me flavours of the beers of both countries. Shepherd Neame makes some really nice beers using NZ hops, and one of them tastes very similar to one of my favourite NZ beers.

But really, I am no great connoisseur. I like loads of different beers from loads of different breweries across the country. So long as they don’t experiment too much with flavour (I don’t need a hazy ipa flavoured with guava, thank you very much), I tend to find some degree of enjoyment. What I do find frustrating, is when one brewery is bought up by another. My most local big brewer, Greene King, is the worst for this. As much as they might claim that the taste is the same, it never is. GK make some alright beers, and some of the beers they brew under the name of the breweries they’ve taken over aren’t too dissimilar - but there are some beers I really enjoyed before they became GK, that really don’t taste the same at all now.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 26 2022 at 04:23
Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

Sometimes I wish I was into this beer stuff more......Never was a big beer or alcohol guy, I have not a clue what all the jargon means. All I know is I tried a beer that was really dark colored and I about puked my innards, hideous tasting.....Dead

I can only drink beer that is very pale in color and that does not measure an 11 in bitter taste scale of 1-10. LOL

You’d quite possibly like some more UK-style beers. Definitely a lot of US brewers tend to focus on the hops and bitterness, and there are a fair few beers out there measuring at least 11 on a scale of 1-10.

But regardless of where you are drinking, there is an enormous difference in flavour profiles both between the various types of beer, and even within them. That difference is even greater when seen between geographic regions. Generally speaking, for example, I don’t particularly like UK brown ales, but I almost always love Belgian brown ales.


And to add to this, I cannot abide stouts or porters, the really dark ales. Guinness disagrees with just about every cell in my body. I will drink Newcastle Brown Ale if there is nothing else on tap, only the utterly undrinkable and disgusting keg creamflow processed bitters.

I love stouts and porters, but not Guinness. But then again, the Guinness you get in bars is nothing like any stout you’d get from a real ale brewer. Like the creamflow bitters, it has nitrogen added (to give it the creamflow), and it just tastes….meh. Newky brown disagrees with me as much as Guinness does with you. It’s the most horrendous example of a brown ale, and almost put me off the style entirely.

Probably because of what I grew up drinking, some of my favourite beers are UK ales brewed with NZ hop varieties, giving me flavours of the beers of both countries. Shepherd Neame makes some really nice beers using NZ hops, and one of them tastes very similar to one of my favourite NZ beers.

But really, I am no great connoisseur. I like loads of different beers from loads of different breweries across the country. So long as they don’t experiment too much with flavour (I don’t need a hazy ipa flavoured with guava, thank you very much), I tend to find some degree of enjoyment. What I do find frustrating, is when one brewery is bought up by another. My most local big brewer, Greene King, is the worst for this. As much as they might claim that the taste is the same, it never is. GK make some alright beers, and some of the beers they brew under the name of the breweries they’ve taken over aren’t too dissimilar - but there are some beers I really enjoyed before they became GK, that really don’t taste the same at all now.


Yes, Bass has not been the same since it was taken over by Marstons. 

Re Shepherd Neame, the only one we see around here is Spitfire, which I have always liked. We did have a holiday in Kent a few years ago and sampled some different brews from them which were great.

With regard to nitrogen infested sh*te,absolutely. In fact, this will be the only question I will ask of politicians who come to m6 door grubbing for my vote in future - when will you ban this awful crap? Dead
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 26 2022 at 04:26
Steve, I enjoyed the VM&J review. While not strictly prog, I enjoyed your take on this outside genre and it got me interested. Any chance of you doing a few non prog reviews in future. I'd love to read your take on an artist like Saxon. Wink
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