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Posted: September 14 2021 at 19:22

SteveG wrote:

Atavachron wrote:

Then what's the point of the law? If it's just symbolic, what is it a symbol of? Suppression and the mixing of church & state? And if it's to scare women to not have abortions, that's even worse. Thinking, hoping and assuming it probably won't happen is a feeble solution.

Goofy Gov. Abbot pledged to end all violent rape in the state of Texas so unwanted pregnancies by forced insemination will no longer be an issue. Now, doesn't that make you feel better?

I know I'm late to this party, but he said he'd "prosecute" rapists, not "prevent. The guy's a huge douchebag !

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 05:36

omphaloskepsis wrote:

Mirakaze wrote:

omphaloskepsis wrote:

Biden contradicts himself. Which is it?

1. The vaccine works, ergo, fully vaccinate people don't need to worry about unvaccinated folks.

2. Or, the vaccine does not work, therefore it does not matter if you are vaccinated... or not unvaccinated.

This is wrong for two reasons:

1. It's not a question of the vaccine working 100% perfectly or not at all: some people aren't as affected by it as others and some still have a higher risk of being hospitalized than others if they catch it.

I agree it's not a question of the vaccine working 100%. Where did I say that? I did not say that. You just restated what I said that Biden said, in a slightly different from. Higher risk of hospitalization? Biden quantified it. According to Biden, a 1 in 160,000 risk of hospitalization. Is that a good reason to lockdown the country? Biden has bungled almost everything he's touched. We got major inflation, immigration problems. (Biden's administration lost track of thousands of immigrant children. Many sold into human trafficking.) Biden blew the Afghan withdrawal. Biden claimed he killed the ISIS bombers, but that was a lie. Biden ordered the bombing that blew apart an Aid Worker Volunteer and children. That's worse than what a mafia don would do. Maybe I shouldn't have compared Biden to a Mafia Don?

https://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-conservative/2021/09/war-criminal-biden-blows-up-children-family-biden-admin-blew-up-aid-worker-families-with-no-terror-ties-in-latest-democrat-horror-3598205.html

Furthermore, each Covid death had an average of three comorbidities. Why don't we talk about that? Most the comorbidities are caused by obesity. Why don't we talk about obesity? Should Biden mandate diets or lap band surgery for obese people? Might save more lives than seatbelts? I'd wager that stopping obesity would save more lives than covid vaccinations. Unless you are over 65 and obese, the odds of you dying from covid are very low. I live in a metroplex of over two million people. Nobody under 28 has died of Covid in my area. Not one death.

A HUGE POINT- Biden does not have the legal right to mandate vaccines. Vaccine mandates are under the State Domain. Maybe they do things different in the Netherlands? That's cool. But, that is not the way we do things in the USA. Biden threatened governors of states who refused to cooperate with his vaccine mandate. Biden said he would use his power to get the governors Out Of The Way. Over half the states oppose Biden's Vaccine Mandate. Majority of Americans oppose Biden's mandate.

https://conventionofstates.com/news/poll-americans-say-no-to-biden-s-covid-19-mandate

2. Even if the vaccine did work perfectly in all cases, as long as enough people are left unvaccinated, hospitals and intensive care units remain at a risk of becoming overburdened by Covid patients and having their ability to provide adequate care to others impaired.

The stories you have been hearing are false.

1. ICU's are not overburdened. First off, the only hospital ICU's that the government counts are "County Hospitals". County hospitals are always crowded because that where the poor people go to get free heath care in America. All other hospitals are NOT counted and they are not overburdened because of covid. I'm a professional RN (Registered Nurse). Here's what's happening. A boy breaks his leg. He goes to the hospital. He tests positive for Covid-19. The hospital counts him as a Covid patient, even if he is asymptomatic. Why would a hospital do such a thing? Because the federal government pays the hospital thousands of dollars per covid patient. More if they put the patient on a ventilator.

What else is happening? Because of forced vaccinations, Nurses everywhere are quitting or getting fired. Biden's vaccination mandate is stressing the healthcare system more than Covid. Anti-Covid-Vaccination Nurses in Houston were fired. Check out this hospital story- Where they closed the entire Maternity Ward because Anti-Covid-Vaccination nurses quit in masse.

https://focuswashington.com/2021/09/13/ny-hospital-to-close-maternity-ward-after-jab-mandate-caused-staff-resignations/

omphaloskepsis wrote:

In Biden's speech, he said, "We've been patient. But our patience is wearing thin. Their refusal has cost all of us!"

It's not just the medical costs he's referring to but also the cost of society still needing to be under lockdown, as opposed to a country like Denmark which is poised to relieve all lockdown measures because the vaccination rate is at such a level that the virus is no longer deemed able to pose a national threat. A core tenet of liberalism is a commitment to freedom as long as one doesn't infringe the freedom of others, and the freedoms of vaccinated people are hindered by the risk that their unvaccinated peers pose to society.

Granted, I don't know if an outright vaccine mandate is really the best or even the fairest solution; my preference goes out to the French "pass sanitaire" system where people aren't allowed to enter public places unless they've been vaccinated, have tested negatively or have recovered from the virus within the past 6 months (the Netherlands are set to introduce a similar system soon and I for one welcome it). Regardless, I believe that governments are in their right to implement some sort of coercive measure to this end if they are to protect their own citizens. Your mafia accusation is completely ridiculous; as a member of society, one has both rights and duties. Would you call someone a mafia don for forcing citizens to pay taxes? Or wear seatbelts? Why don't you speak with a political dissident from Belarus before calling someone a dictator?

If it's true, as Biden says, only 1 in 160,000 vaccinated people will be hospitalized...Why must America suffer a lockdown? The vaccinated people are safe. Let the unvaccinated folks take the risk. The unvaccinated are OK with the risk. We do not stop Obese people from eating. We let them risk their life. That's life. Benjamin Franklin said, "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

How will the vaccinated feel when they find out that an endless stream of booster jabs will be required? How will they feel when their vaccination subscription expires every six months or so? Many will suffer through painful immune system side effects. Certainly more than 1 in 160,000. As an undergraduate, I took immunobiology. It's no surprise that the second jab causes more side effects than the first jab. Imagine the third, forth, fifth ad infinitum... Same thing happens to folks who are allergic to bee stings. The first bee sting makes them sick. A year later? They're stung again and suddenly their throat is swelling in an anaphylactic shock reaction. Some die. Who is looking forward to booster shots?

Not Congress and their staff. Congress is exempt from Biden's vaccine mandate. Congress and their staffs don't have to take Covid vaccines. Congress just takes millions of dollars from the Big Pharma Companies that produce the vaccines. Companies like Pfizer, Johnson & Johnson, and Moderna. It's good work if you can get it.

Not illegal aliens. More than a million illegal aliens have crossed the border since Biden took office. Perhaps the Covid virus can't infect illegal aliens? Seriously, if Biden really cared about stopping Covid with a vaccine mandate...how come Congress and illegal aliens are exempt? I really would like to know the answer. Meanwhile here come the Booster Jabs!

https://www.aol.com/covid-19-booster-jabs-millions-115318086.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly9zZWFyY2gueWFob28uY29tLw&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAK5TGkqxkLEUDi6iZU7nvrsEghYIbU3AXwl6BIRtTHjsR58QAV92Q3EYSiraCABMVY0ojxud-14XaqH7jp5HK3NqKTVl9un03xQ04TXKip2GehOnZEaS99eyFPx_Ys504wpnpXtC7LjgtdFAa72c547St9yYlm8qzagBNUDSnY6M

First off, can you back up your claim of booster shot increased reactions? I'm not saying that it's not possible, but coming from you it's highly suspect. Secondly, the difference between the brain dead anti vaccine crowd and illegal immigrants is that the latter will gladly take the shots if offered to them. And third, the more brown people in this country the better. With the decrease in future Republican voting due to dying off, as a result of not being vaccinated, and the eventual increase in brown Democratic votes, it looks like a Democratic dynasty is in the making.

Edited by SteveG - September 15 2021 at 05:45

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 06:44

^I also don't believe her comments on ICU beds in the U.S. I can't find any reputable source anywhere that makes such a claim and don't feel like wasting my time further on this.

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SteveG

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 07:02

progaardvark wrote:

^I also don't believe her comments on ICU beds in the U.S. I can't find any reputable source anywhere that makes such a claim and don't feel like wasting my time further on this.

That's the smart thing to do. But you've always been more sensible than me.

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omphaloskepsis View Drop Down

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 07:57

[/QUOTE] First off, can you back up your claim of booster shot increased reactions? I'm not saying that it's not possible, but coming from you it's highly suspect. Secondly, the difference between the brain dead anti vaccine crowd and illegal immigrants is that the latter will gladly take the shots if offered to them. And third, the more brown people in this country the better. With the decrease in future Republican voting due to dying off, as a result of not being vaccinated, and the eventual increase in brown Democratic votes, it looks like a Democratic dynasty is in the making.[/QUOTE]

Outstanding Steve! You've decreased personal attacks to a minimum, while making salient political points. I'll address your questions in reverse order.

1. I agree yet disagree. A Democrat dynasty has already occurred. The Overton will continue to move left for the Democrat and GOP parties. The Overton window will also continue to Down towards total government control.

https://www.mackinac.org/OvertonWindow

2. You've hit upon the real reason that Biden and the Democrats support illegal immigration. MORE DEMOCRAT VOTES! The Covid virus has been highjacked for the Authoritative Globalist Movement. If Covid was as dangerous as They say it is...Biden would not have exempted Congress and Illegal aliens.

Next thing? We'll see vaccine passports pop up around the world. Australia and Canada are the Globalist guinea pig countries. If you want to see the direction that Billionaire Class/ Industrial class wants America to head...just look to Australia and Canada for a peek at America's future.

3. Your Booster shot question is basic immunobiology. The Antibody-Viral relationship is like a lock/key relationship. It's based on shapes. Most folks bodies contain all the possible antibody shapes. But only a few of each for bio-economical purposes.

So a virus or non-self/vaccine/protein spike (vaccine is an non-self body or carries RNA that produces non-self bodies) The Johnson & Johnson vaccine introduces non-self materials directly into the body. Pfizer and Moderna vaccines use RNA to make the spike proteins which the body's immune system recognizes as non-self bodies. What happens next? I won't go into T-cells and B-cells, however I'll explain it, since I've written papers on the immune system.

Just know that there are several types of antibodies. One type locks up the Key/Spike protein. After contact with a non-self protein spike the lock-key initiates a replication process. The lock-killer antibody replicates in mass. ( I skipped the RNA replication process using cellular machinery because of limited time and space) Anyway, the body makes billions of anti-bodies to combat the non-self covid spikes which in turn are attached to the rest of the covid virus. Eventually the anti-bodies overwhelm the covid viruses. That's the first interaction between the body and the Covid vaccine.

The second interaction is different. How? Like a home that has been burgled, the body shores up it's defense mechanism against the non-self covid vaccine spikes. How does it do this? Another type of antibody (B-cell antibody) replicates itself. This particular anti-body is like a factory that makes the lock-killing antibody. This is Cell memory. So the second jab introduces more "RNA covid non-self making protein spikes". This time the body is ready. The anti-body factories have been making lock-killer anti-bodies. Now the factories ramp up replication of lock-killer antibodies. The immune system responds quickly to overwhelm the the covid vaccine non-self spikes.

Funny thing about the covid protein spikes. They tend to accumulate in body organs like the testes, ovaries, heart, ect. When the anti-bodies rush in to lock up and kill the Covid virus protein spikes... the organs can swell with inflammation. People under 50 are particularly vulnerable because their immune systems are stronger than 80 year old invalids. That's why many young men are suffering from myocarditis (inflammation of the heart). Myocarditis has a 50% mortality rate after five years. 20% in the first year.

Booster shots do what they say they do. They Boost the immunes system response. Let's backtrack.

1. Vaccine Virgin- has only a few lock-killer anti-bodies that are covid spike specific.

2. After first vaccine the body produces covid specific lock-killer antibody factories. (B-cell Anti-bodies)

3. After the second vaccine the body produces even more lock-killer antibody factories.

4. After the third vaccine the body produce even more lock-killer antibody factories than before. Thus, the immune system response is quick and BIG. This in turn causes inflammation in many ways. At shot site. Body organs, and other areas such as the face (Bell's Palsy)

Repeated introduction of vaccine (non-self viruses or protein spikes) in turn produces more B-Cell anti-body factories, which in turn increases the intensity of the body's immune system anti-body cascade. The danger? The immune system can damage your body with an overreaction.

Edited by omphaloskepsis - September 15 2021 at 08:24

omphaloskepsis View Drop Down

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 09:30

Did you read about the nurses quitting or being fired? I'll provide links for your perusal.

Would you agree that less nurses puts strain on healthcare system?

Perhaps you've read articles about hospitals turning away patients? My husband was a profession firefighter and paramedic. Sometimes he would ride the Box (Ambulance). It's always been common for a hospital emergency room or ICU to overflow at a hospital.

In route, the hospital would call the Ambulance and say something like, "Memorial Hospital is full. Please reroute to Methodist General or South Community Hospital." Pre-covid, this sort of thing happened all the time. Just the way things are and were.

Recently, the media published an article saying that Oklahoma hospitals were turning away gunshot victims because of Ivermectin horse de-wormer overdoses. Several things were wrong with this story.

1. Although Ivermectin is used on horses, it's also used on humans. Ivermectin is a drug that treats multiple viruses. Ivermectin has been so successful that it won it's inventors- the 2015 Nobel Prize in Medicine.

2. The story was blatantly untrue. Although media from Rolling Stone Magazine to Rachel Madow reported it as fact. The actual Emergency Room doctors refute the story. They said that they have treated every single patient and that there was no overflow. Rolling Stone had to recant the story. Last I heard, Madow had not recanted the false story.

https://reason.com/2021/09/06/ivermectin-overdoses-oklahoma-hospitals-rolling-stone-hoax/

3. The Pharmaceutical companies don't want a successful treatment against Covid. Notice I said treatment and not vaccine. The vaccines were released without sufficient experimentation under Emergency Use of Authorization. If successful treatments such as ivermectin are acknowledged, then Big Pharma can't release vaccines under Emergency Use of Authorization. Big Pharma would have to go the old fashion route of years of experimentation. Plus the politicians could not wield the vaccines as a weapon to control the public. If Covid was a true emergency, Biden would not had made ANY vaccine mandate exemptions for illegal immigrants and Congress. If Covid was an imminent danger then the nurses would not be require to get vaccinated by November. They would get vaccinated...NOW! People would by dying left and right. And the nurses would know the danger. The nurses would quickly agree to get vaccinated Yesterday.

4. Evolution. All parasites (that includes viruses) tend to reach a golden equilibrium with host organism. As time goes on the virus becomes more contagious but less deadly. Why is that? Because the #1 thing that all organisms do is pass on their genetic material. If the virus always kills the host, the virus will quickly go extinct. Take bird flu as an example. Birds, pigs, and humans are reservoirs for the flu viruses. The flu virus jumped from birds to pigs to humans. Birds have had the flu much longer than humans. Consequently, birds and the flu virus reached golden equilibrium long ago. The flu is extremely contagious between birds. However the flu doesn't even make birds sick anymore.

The same thing has already started happening with Covid. The Delta variant is more contagious than original Covid-19. However, the delta variant is 4x's less deadly in unvaccinated people than original Covid-19. That is why CNN no longer posts a Death Counter. Instead CNN only posts a Case Number counter.

Think about it. An August 10, Oxford Study published in the Lancet Medical Journal found that fully vaccinated people carry 251Xs the Delta variant viral load of unvaccinated people. Remember a vaccine is suppose to alert the immune system to replicate viral killing antibodies. Yet these people carry 251Xs the Delta viral load. Yet, Delta doesn't made them sick. The reason that they are NOT getting sick is because the vaccine killed the original Covid but does nothing against Delta. If the vaccine worked against Delta variant, there would be very little Delta viral load. If they carried 250x's the viral load of original Covid-19 they would be very sick. Over 90% of cases in America are Delta. I've heard as high as 98%.

If a person dies in a hospital from cancer but they tested positive with Covid...Death Certificate is marked because of Covid. Federal government pays Hospital thousands of dollars per Covid patient. If an obese 60 year old strokes out, obliterating 60% of his brain and dies with Covid positive (w/ no covid symptoms) that 380 pound stroke victim gets Covid death on their death certificate. I saw that happen to an obese stroke victim. We nurses see it all the time. That's one of the reasons tens of thousands of nurses are more afraid of the jab than of covid.

Nurse keep quitting because they refuse the jab. Some hospitals have shut down entire wards because of nurses quitting.

New York

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/571895-hospital-says-it-will-stop-delivering-babies-after-maternity-ward

Houston-

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-26/covid-vaccine-mandates-drive-some-nurses-to-leave-america-s-hospitals

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/more-than-150-houston-hospital-workers-were-fired-or-quit-after-refusing-covid-19-vaccine/ar-AALkAnT

Cincinnati

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2021/09/01/survey-shows-nurses-quit-over-uc-health-covid-19-vaccine-mandate/5680714001/

California

https://calmatters.org/health/coronavirus/2021/08/california-nurses-shortage/

Oregon

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/nurses-choosing-fired-rather-vaccinated-041607781.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

Nationwide

https://www.oom2.com/t76560-critical-nursing-shortages-hit-hospitals-nationwide-as-nurses-quit-or-are-fired-over-covid-vaccine-mandates

Edited by omphaloskepsis - September 15 2021 at 09:44

SteveG

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 09:36

omphaloskepsis wrote:

Outstanding Steve! You've decreased personal attacks to a minimum, while making salient political points. I'll address your questions in reverse order.

https://www.mackinac.org/OvertonWindow

Booster shots do what they say they do. They Boost the immunes system response. Let's backtrack.

1. Vaccine Virgin- has only a few lock-killer anti-bodies that are covid spike specific.

2. After first vaccine the body produces covid specific lock-killer antibody factories. (B-cell Anti-bodies)

3. After the second vaccine the body produces even more lock-killer antibody factories.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[/QUOTE] I was expecting you to back up your claim with clinical data from a reputable source, not musings from your fractured memory. Once again you gave another BS answer. The Aardvark was right. A discussion with you is a waste of time.

Edited by SteveG - September 15 2021 at 09:38

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 09:59

Steve Said- [/QUOTE] I was expecting you to back up your claim with clinical data from a reputable source, not musings from your fractured memory. Once again you gave another BS answer. The Aardvark was right. A discussion with you is a waste of time.

Pardon my faux pas. I did not think you would understand the clinical data. My source is Harvard Medical School. This is layman's edition. Enjoy.

https://onlinelearning.hms.harvard.edu/hmx/immunity/

Edited by omphaloskepsis - September 15 2021 at 10:05

SteveG

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 10:15

I will read it in my leisure time. I'm sure it's chock full of contradictions to your statements. That I will enjoy.

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 10:47

SteveG wrote:

I will read it in my leisure time. I'm sure it's chock full of contradictions to your statements. That I will enjoy.

Hey Steve, I curious why you love the Deep State so much.

Is it because you know the Deep State/Industrial Comples will win?

Since this is a political thread, please share your political views. What platform policies do you ascribe to?

You always say what you are against. Please, share what you are for. I know you vote democrat. Please tell me why?

I promise, I will not criticize your political, cultural, and social viewpoints.

I won't be able to respond for a week at least. I got a triple shift coming up. Plus, I still attend college classes.

SteveG

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 10:51

I'm for the opposite of what I'm against. But to make it clear to you, make your presence known when you get back to earth and I'll tell you in detail.

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 10:54

Could you point to the sweeping phenomime of multiple hospitals flooded with masses of unvaccinated folks. So many unvaccinated folks, that hospitals have turned away patients. Substantiation works both ways. Please supply the hospital names and validated proof.

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 11:36

omphaloskepsis wrote:

I still don't believe you. You haven't proven anything to me. I'm not going to spend all day debunking and unpacking your posts. It's tiring and I have a life.

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 11:53

omphaloskepsis wrote:

Did you read about the nurses quitting or being fired? I'll provide links for your perusal.

Would you agree that less nurses puts strain on healthcare system?

Recently, the media published an article saying that Oklahoma hospitals were turning away gunshot victims because of Ivermectin horse de-wormer overdoses. Several things were wrong with this story.

https://reason.com/2021/09/06/ivermectin-overdoses-oklahoma-hospitals-rolling-stone-hoax/

Nurse keep quitting because they refuse the jab. Some hospitals have shut down entire wards because of nurses quitting.

New York

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/571895-hospital-says-it-will-stop-delivering-babies-after-maternity-ward

Houston-

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-08-26/covid-vaccine-mandates-drive-some-nurses-to-leave-america-s-hospitals

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/more-than-150-houston-hospital-workers-were-fired-or-quit-after-refusing-covid-19-vaccine/ar-AALkAnT

Cincinnati

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2021/09/01/survey-shows-nurses-quit-over-uc-health-covid-19-vaccine-mandate/5680714001/

California

https://calmatters.org/health/coronavirus/2021/08/california-nurses-shortage/

Oregon

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/nurses-choosing-fired-rather-vaccinated-041607781.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

Nationwide

https://www.oom2.com/t76560-critical-nursing-shortages-hit-hospitals-nationwide-as-nurses-quit-or-are-fired-over-covid-vaccine-mandates

I already debunked your claims about that Oxford study in another post (see the first post on page 411), and yet you ignored and repeated your baseless claims here. Why should I bother spending any more time on this?

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 13:11

omphaloskepsis wrote:

SteveG wrote:

I will read it in my leisure time. I'm sure it's chock full of contradictions to your statements. That I will enjoy.

Hey Steve, I curious why you love the Deep State so much. Is it because you know the Deep State/Industrial Comples will win? Since this is a political thread, please share your political views. What platform policies do you ascribe to?

You always say what you are against. Please, share what you are for. I know you vote democrat. Please tell me why?

I promise, I will not criticize your political, cultural, and social viewpoints.

I won't be able to respond for a week at least. I got a triple shift coming up. Plus, I still attend college classes.

The "Deep State" ? The Deep State is an idea promoted decades ago as a way to explain the Kennedy Assassination among other calamities. The term 'Deep Politics' was coined by Professor Peter Dale Scott and popularized in his book Deep Politics and the Death of JFK .

Basically it is any group doing things in secret you disagree with in order to affect events, politics, and economics. It doesn't actually exist except when it does, like when a politician tries to subvert an election or a government agency covers-up a crime. We are all part of the Deep State when we support something illegal or unconstitutional.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 14:02

Tomorrow is the big day, the trumpateers are headed to DC to stick up for all the criminal trumpateers who are headed to prison for their violence against police officers.
With so many trump fans in the area, the potential for violence is very high, so you can bet there will be a large police presence to try and keep them in line.

Edited by Easy Money - September 15 2021 at 14:10

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 14:29

Easy Money wrote:

Tomorrow is the big day, the trumpateers are headed to DC to stick up for all the criminal trumpateers who are headed to prison for their violence against police officers.

With so many trump fans in the area, the potential for violence is very high, so you can bet there will be a large police presence to try and keep them in line.

The average Trump fan is a fat, white piece of gutless misled trash. They will be "supporting" the violent traitors but I don't see them being a threat except to their own sociopathic tendencies. I suspect this demonstration will be a sad, laughable event.

"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy

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Posted: September 15 2021 at 15:34

I guess the Woodward/Costa book is supposed to be another bombshell. Apparently it includes Mark Milley making sure military commanders knew that any Trump nuclear strike order had to go through him; Milley twice calling Li Zuocheng assuring him the U.S. wouldn't attack China; the transcript between Pelosi and Milley where Pelosi says, "What I'm saying to you is that if they couldn't even stop him from an assault on the Capitol, who even knows what else he may do? And is there anybody in charge at the White House who was doing anything but kissing his fat butt all over this?"; Pence asking Dan Quayle for advice on if he could do what Trump wanted him to do with Trump apparently telling Pence "I don't want to be your friend anymore if you don't do this."; and the CIA director telling Milley, "We are on the way to a right-wing coup. The whole thing is insanity. He is acting out like a six-year-old with a tantrum."

Should be a fun read or a horror story depending on your mood.

Heather Cox Richardson gives a good summary about a third of the way down here (her sources are at the end of the blog post):

https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/p/september-14-2021

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Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin

Joined: August 11 2007
Location: Memphis
Status: Offline
Points: 10617

Posted: September 15 2021 at 18:03

^ So apparently we were saved by Dan Quayle, good for him.

SteveG

Forum Senior Member

Joined: April 11 2014
Location: Kyiv In Spirit
Status: Offline
Points: 20604

Posted: September 16 2021 at 04:42

Atavachron wrote:

omphaloskepsis wrote:

SteveG wrote:

I will read it in my leisure time. I'm sure it's chock full of contradictions to your statements. That I will enjoy.

You always say what you are against. Please, share what you are for. I know you vote democrat. Please tell me why?

I promise, I will not criticize your political, cultural, and social viewpoints.

I won't be able to respond for a week at least. I got a triple shift coming up. Plus, I still attend college classes.

There are many Deep State conspiracies. This is the one I support

Deep State against Donald Trump

2017

President Donald Trump's supporters use the term to refer to allegations that intelligence officers and executive branch officials guide policy through leaking or other internal means.^[37]^[13] According to a July 2017 report by the United States Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs, "the Trump administration was being hit by national security leaks 'on a nearly daily basis' and at a far higher rate than its predecessors encountered".^[38] According to David Gergen, quoted in Time magazine, the term has been appropriated by Steve Bannon and Breitbart News and other supporters of the Trump Administration in order to delegitimize the critics of that presidency.^[36]

In May 2017, former Democratic U.S. Representative Dennis Kucinich stated in an interview on Fox News that a deep state within the bureaucracy was trying to destroy Trump's presidency. He further elaborated "The political process of the United States of America [is] under attack by intelligence agencies and individuals in those agencies...You have politicization of agencies that is resulting in leaks from anonymous, unknown people and the intention is to take down a president...Now this is very dangerous to America. It's a threat to our republic, it constitutes a clear and present danger to our way of life. So we have to be asking, what is the motive of these people? Who's putting these leaks out? Why doesn't somebody come forward and make a charge and put their name and reputation behind it, instead of attacking through the media and not substantiating their position?" In an interview several months earlier Kucinich said "What's at the core of this is an effort by some in the intelligence community to upend any positive relationship between the U.S. and Russia...There are people trying to separate the U.S. and Russia so this military-industrial-intel axis can cash in."^[39]^[40]

Trump and Steve Bannon, his former chief strategist, have both made allegations about a deep state which they believed was interfering with the president's agenda.^[41]^[42]^[43] In 2018, describing the deep state as an "entrenched bureaucracy", Trump accused the United States Department of Justice "of being part of the 'deep state'" in a statement advocating the prosecution of Huma Abedin.^[44] Some Trump allies and right-wing media outlets have alleged that former president Barack Obama is coordinating a deep state resistance to Trump.^[41]^[45] While the belief in a deep state is popular among Trump supporters, critics maintain that it has no basis in reality,^[46] arguing that the sources of the leaks frustrating the Trump administration lack the organizational depth of deep states in other countries. Critics also warned that use of the term in the U.S. could undermine confidence in vital institutions and be used to justify suppressing dissent.^[41]^[47]

Edited by SteveG - September 16 2021 at 09:58

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