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Composers Conducting Their Own Music
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suitkees View Drop Down
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Points: 9050 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suitkees Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2021 at 16:46
Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:


This cd set mentions a fragment of a Love Duet from Tristan conducted by Richard Wagner in 1880; it used to be on youtube, but I think it is gone from there, but here is the cd cover, itself.

Well, I sincerely put in doubt the veracity of that claim of Grammofono, who put out this cd. Partly because of Wagner's health conditions in his last years, partly because the performance history of Tristan und Isolde (but I'm not a Wagner specialist), but especially because of the state of recording techniques in 1882, 1883... Nothing is impossible, but it seems really very highly unlikely to me.
Nothing is etched in stone, I realise, but Thomas Edison invented the cylinder in 1877, and patented it in 1878, so it could have happened. 


I thought it would not be too difficult to find out more about this recording... Apparently, this cylinder was recorded in 1903. You can read more about it in Jonathan Brown's book on Great Wagner Conductors here. This Grammofono disc is mentioned here.

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Points: 8780 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote presdoug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2021 at 17:36
Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:


This cd set mentions a fragment of a Love Duet from Tristan conducted by Richard Wagner in 1880; it used to be on youtube, but I think it is gone from there, but here is the cd cover, itself.

Well, I sincerely put in doubt the veracity of that claim of Grammofono, who put out this cd. Partly because of Wagner's health conditions in his last years, partly because the performance history of Tristan und Isolde (but I'm not a Wagner specialist), but especially because of the state of recording techniques in 1882, 1883... Nothing is impossible, but it seems really very highly unlikely to me.
Nothing is etched in stone, I realise, but Thomas Edison invented the cylinder in 1877, and patented it in 1878, so it could have happened. 


I thought it would not be too difficult to find out more about this recording... Apparently, this cylinder was recorded in 1903. You can read more about it in Jonathan Brown's book on Great Wagner Conductors here. This Grammofono disc is mentioned here.
Conducted by Lionel Mapleson. I stand corrected. Thanks for clarifying this correctly for me.
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presdoug View Drop Down
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Points: 8780 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote presdoug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2021 at 18:06
I meant to mention that I have also heard recordings of Jean Sibelius, Sergei Rachmaninoff, and Arnold Schoenberg conducting their own music.
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suitkees View Drop Down
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Points: 9050 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suitkees Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 22 2021 at 04:20
^ The Schoenberg one interests me. Do you have more information on that one, a reference?

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BaldFriede View Drop Down
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Points: 10266 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BaldFriede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 22 2021 at 04:37
Originally posted by presdoug presdoug wrote:

Originally posted by BaldFriede BaldFriede wrote:

I know Mahler conducted himself, but there are apparently no recordings of this.
What we do have are piano rolls from the first decade of the 20th Century, where he is playing part of a movement from his 4th and 5th Symphonies, but on piano, only.

Yes, I know. There is some device with which you could record every nuance of someone playing piano.


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presdoug View Drop Down
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Points: 8780 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote presdoug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 22 2021 at 05:19
Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

^ The Schoenberg one interests me. Do you have more information on that one, a reference?
Sure. The one I have is Schoenberg conducting Pierrot Lunaire originally pubished on CBS records in 1951-transferred to tape from lacquers in that year, reissued on cd on "CBS Records-Masterworks Portrait" in 1989. CBS MPK 45695  Recitation is by Erika Stiedry-Wagner. Also on the cd is the Trio for Violin, Viola/Bratsche/alto and Cello,  Op. 45, recorded in 1966.
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Points: 9050 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suitkees Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 23 2021 at 04:25
^ Thanks! Will look into this one.

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Points: 10266 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BaldFriede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 23 2021 at 06:10
A side note about Schönberg: What very few people know is that he also did paintings (mostly self-portraits). Jean and I once were at an exhibition of his paintings.

Here is one of his self-portraits:




Edited by BaldFriede - August 24 2021 at 03:11


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presdoug View Drop Down
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Points: 8780 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote presdoug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 23 2021 at 15:45
Originally posted by BaldFriede BaldFriede wrote:

A side note about Schönberg: What very few people know is that he also did paintings (mostly self-portraits). Jean and I once were at an exhibition of his paintings.

Here is one of his self-portraits:



I had no idea about that aspect of Schoenberg. Lovely.
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