Early British Prog vs American. Discuss. |
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dougmcauliffe
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^ The first 45 seconds are incredibly cool, and considerably heavy for the time as well. But after that it just drifts off into a void, and i've never been a fan of the vocals
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JD
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I think you had to be a 12-16 yr old boy at the time this came out to have any really attachment to it. It does bring back many memories for me, including learning to play the solo as best as I did at 13 or 14. Musically there really isn't much there. And yes the vocals aren't the best, although it's hard to imagine what type of vocals would really make it better. I think I might listen to it about once every 5 years or so.
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Atavachron
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Sometimes I think prog rock started in the US, which is to say rock 'n roll's progression from blues-based dance music to something more: Beach Boys, Zappa, the Dead, CSN, Hendrix, were all doing their own kind of progressive rock that, despite the influences that were passing between America and England, was independent and wholly domestic. If one looks at the rock timeline and the music being made and recorded, it's clear that the US had it's own brand of Prog before, or perhaps separate from, the British article. |
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Easy Money
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Awesoreno
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I only know the song from The Simpsons. I'd listen to that bit from the Songs in the Key Of Springfield CD.
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Awesoreno
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Wait a minute. This sounds like rock AND/OR roll.
-Reverend Lovejoy
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SteveG
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Atavachron
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Santana, too. |
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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Dellinger
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I do love In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida, and I wasn't there when it was released, though I did was in High School when I first heard it. Oh yeah, and put that song to your dogs, in the part of the screeching guitars, they have some fun reactions.
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siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15331 |
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Just imagine all the experiments that were so ahead of their time that they never got recorded. If rock and roll became popular in the mid-1950s, there must've been some jazz and classical artists who were hybridizing that far back but due to record labels probably never got anywhere. Perhaps some long lost recordings will emerge to change history! Given the cool archival material finally being released from the 1970s, i would never say never!
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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Frenetic Zetetic
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I think like this all the time; it's a fun thought experiment. Think of all the amazing technology that doesn't exist yet that you're living absolutely fine without, because of that fact, lol.
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"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
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dr wu23
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Great track....loved it and still do , but too long imho.
Edited by dr wu23 - August 14 2021 at 15:30 |
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The Dark Elf
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I've always loved the song. And yes, the length of the song is predicated on being stoned -- the lengthier the song the better. Back when being stoned was fun, and not some socially abhorrent enormity. Ummmm.... What were we talking about again?
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siLLy puPPy
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True but the reason i consider this possibility is that hidden gems continue to emerge from the vaults. Things that were too daring even for the early prog scene were recorded and ignored and are finally finding a home. This is particularly true from France for some reason.
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Sacro_Porgo
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I heavily disagree with any implication that the United States has no history of great art in all mediums. The names may not be as well known as the European greats, but where there is civilization there is art, and where there is enough art some of it always turns out to be great (just as some of it turns out not to be). That said, there is a definite failing of so many schools in this country, enough that you could call the problem systematic, to recognize the vitality and necessity of a decent artistic education, instead focusing nearly all their efforts on the material which shows up in standardized tests. Since art is inherently subjective, tests cannot be standardized, and without any art on those big exams school's don't see the value for money in teaching those subjects. Anymore in the US, if a child wants to be an artist, they will have to put in a lot of extra-curricular work to practice while they go through high school and take the necessary tests to get into college. Only at the university level can a student put all their efforts into what they really want to do, and even then only certain universities have decent arts programs. Unless they're lucky enough to go to a good high school that values the pursuit of art as a career or at least has a helpful teacher or two in that area, it's fully up to the child to learn enough to find the college that suits them best by about the time they turn 18. The system does not teach art as widely or as well as it should, and it never will as it's designed.
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Porg for short. My love of music doesn't end with prog! Feel free to discuss all sorts of music with me. Odds are I'll give it a chance if I haven't already! :)
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nick_h_nz
Collaborator Prog Metal / Heavy Prog Team Joined: March 01 2013 Location: Suffolk, UK Status: Offline Points: 6737 |
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^ and ^^
You’re not actually disagreeing (heavily or otherwise) at all, as Pedro made no implication that the US has no history of great art in any medium. That is solely your inference, and I expect if you re-read what he has written, you’ll see that you and he are actually agreeing. (At least, that is my inference). There has been US art and great US art (subjectivity put aside as much as possible) for as long as the US has been inhabited (let’s not forget Native American art). But for the Americans of European descent, a lot of that (Western) American art was either largely unknown and/or similar enough to the European artists to not be attractive to the average US citizen. (I know I a, grossly generalising here, but please bare with me!) Andy Warhol’s pop art was a kick start for American art. Suddenly here was something identifiable and unmistakeable for anything other than being American. Andy Warhol’s prints infiltrated US homes in a way no other US artist had done before, and he is often erroneously considered the US’s first great artist, because of this. It was cool to have a piece of American art hanging on the wall in your house, because this art looked “American”. Warhol. But this is where Mike’s point kind of comes in. There are a myriad of works of art from various media that have either been forgotten, or were unknown, simply because they didn’t capture the spirit of the time. In recent years, more and more of these are being (re)discovered. Andy Warhol did very little that was truly novel, but he did manage to capture the zeitgeist. He was the right person at the right time, and because of this he was absolutely a key figure in US prog (which, as per earlier posts on previous pages of this thread, already had some key proponents, that I guess may have been the US equivalent of proto-prog). Even something considered somewhat revolutionary like The Exploding Plastic Inevitable was actually nothing particularly new. There had been shows that integrated film, performance and music before. But again, Warhol was in the right place at the right time. I think it’s worthwhile remembering that prog is a bit of a retrospective label, with it being used very rarely (if at all?) contemporaneously. And at the time, bands like the VU and the Stooges were routinely described as progressive, in the same way that UK bands we now know as prog were described as progressive. However the prog tag was largely put on only the progressive UK bands, and others around the world that sounded similar or were influenced by them, leaving the US progressive bands estranged by semantics and semiotics. As for the Stooges, since someone will probably bring them up, they were mentioned earlier by me. But when people think of the Stooges, it is inevitable that people think of their recordings, which were not representative of what they wanted to sound like. John Cale has mused that the band might have had a completely different future had they been allowed to record the albums they wanted to, but their label would have never let them. They were a progressive band in the same way the VU were. Their biggest stated influences were Sun-Ra and Harry Partch. They wanted to call themselves the Psychedelic Stooges. Their live performances were improvisational and avant-garde. At every turn, the record company was saying no to what they wanted, and boxing them into something they considered more marketable. So maybe the debut Stooges album doesn’t sound prog, but it’s not the album they, or producer John Cale, wanted to make. Iggy was driven into a circle of drugs and depression, and the resulting second album is a mess that none of the band were interested in, and all have expressed dislike and disdain for. But even within these two albums that are more usually ascribed the punk label, there are still signs of the full on (US) prog that the Stooges were capable of. Again, it’s as Mike says, sometimes something is simply not heard because at the time record companies weren’t willing to take a risk on something they considered too daring or out there. In the US, this worked against the prog bands in a way it did not in the UK. Because of the recognised great history of art in Europe, and because most of the UK prog bands drew on classical influences, as daring and different as they might have been, they were still recognisable as being part of the greater European art history. American prog was more idiosyncratic and avant-garde - and arguably more progressive because of that. But put aside the semantics, and I think it would be foolish to suggest that the US did not have its own prog scene. The bands and artists that made it up may not be recognised now as being prog, but that’s only a label. Take away the signifier, and the signified is what is is. |
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