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judahbenkenobi View Drop Down
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

According to a Persian friend, the slower build up sections are Arabic with the billistic middle section being raga for Rajan Khan. For the first song I haven't a clue but I think the OP will like it. So just feel half embarrassed.


I happen to love Indian/Raga sounds too, so I really enjoyed those Renaissance songs.

You can check out my "Indo/Persian" version of Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun here, if you'd like to:

https://www.bandlab.com/hiedravenenosa/set-the-controls-for-the-heart-of-the-sun-pink-floyd-cover-a5ee2657?revId=37e8d63d-ae3f-eb11-9fb4-501ac5b31de6
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siLLy puPPy View Drop Down
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

According to a Persian friend, the slower build up sections are Arabic with the billistic middle section being raga for Rajan Khan. For the first song I haven't a clue but I think the OP will like it. So just feel half embarrassed.


That may be so since the trend then was to borrow from anywhere possible but the sitar and overall thematic trend seem much more Indian to me than Middle Eastern. Of course Indian music is somewhat similar in many ways. One of my favorite Renaissance songs actually!

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Hi,

I'm still listening to some of the stuff listed here.

However, I have reservations. For a band, any band, to simply have an instrument do something that is usually associated with Middle Eastern music, does not, and never will, make it "progressive" and thus a lot of the stuff listed does not really fit.

I don't consider the early AF progressive at all, as it was a school "study" (paid for too!) that was designed to mix various other elements in music, and specifically Middle Eastern music ... to me that does not make it "progressive".

Guy Guden, in his show, plays a lot of Middle Eastern music, going back so far as MONSOON and then Sheila Chandra, and even going so far as Ofra Haza and many others over the last 40 years! Not all of it is "progressive" but all of them include some western themes and song concepts that their culture might not exactly work on, unless it is simple pop music (and they have a lot of it!!!!) ... however, some of the things he plays these days, would/could/should be considered "progressive" since it is not just a "mix" and a touch of the sound anymore, and the stuff is way better integrated than it was before.

I would venture to say that some things are not "Middle Eastern Prog" and one example is RENAISSANCE, simple because of one song and one sound! 
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Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.

Edited by SteveG - June 08 2021 at 08:06
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Not quite prog, but probably more like classical crossover - this has got a distinct hypnotic Middle Eastern feel to it.
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As well as the excellent Renaissance track from SteveG, here are a couple of examples of songs with Middle Eastern influence from Annie Haslam's solo works (yes I know she's not in the database here - a moot point).
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

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Originally posted by Progishness Progishness wrote:

As well as the excellent Renaissance track from SteveG, here are a couple of examples of songs with Middle Eastern influence from Annie Haslam's solo works (yes I know she's not in the database here - a moot point).





Now THOSE are definitely without any doubt based on Middle Eastern musical elements! Never really checked out Annie's solo output before. Sounds good. Reminds me of a more rockin' Loreena McKennitt!

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^ Those are the only two Middle Eastern influenced songs in Annie's solo catalogue that I'm aware of.
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Not technically progressive, but from a psychedelic US band that combined various styles of music based on the band's players' mixed fortes: 
"Into every rain, a little life must fall." ~Tom Rapp
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Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.
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DCD can incorporate many trad and folk styles but they often do place middle eastern into the mix...
this is more eastern European but other tracks by them have a lot of other tones going on...
Try 'Realm, Serpents Egg, Aion, Labyrinth',,,,
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.


The author of the thread clearly stated an interest in Middle Eastern SOUNDS. Just clarifying for those interested. If that's not you then please disregard. In other words, if it don't apply then let it fly.

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Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

DCD can incorporate many trad and folk styles but they often do place middle eastern into the mix...
this is more eastern European but other tracks by them have a lot of other tones going on...
Try 'Realm, Serpents Egg, Aion, Labyrinth',,,,





Dead Can Dance were brilliant in how they mixed different folk elements! It's been a while since i've delved into their music but i do believe the last album had some Middle Eastern sounds as well. Those early albums were pure magic!

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To the OP:





If you like Myrath, you might like this English delight too:



And you shouldn't miss this:
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This is the best Middle Eastern Prog album I know of..... a recent discovery, found hiding in between my Krautrock collection. Smile

5 stars 1974: Between - Dharana - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieoiO46LCtI
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Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.


Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).

I just went on a road trip and listened to this whole album like 5 times. There are no hints of Middle Eastern music scales or otherwise that i can detect. In the case of the tales of Scheherazade, they are compiled from Arabic folklore.

If you take the characteristics of Arabic music (and most Middle Eastern music for that matter) they are defined by a few common criteria:

Much of Arabic music is characterized by an emphasis on melody and rhythm as opposed to harmony and typically Arabic music is homophonic not polyphonic like most Western classical music which this album and track are based upon.

There are no musical scales based on the maqam system which features one tonic note. Also there are no traces of the polymorphic percussion styles nor the instrumentation that accents tones, textures and timbres.

So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.

And what rule book stated that middle eastern prog was solely confined to music and not lyrics. Get off your high horse and chill out. And save your middle eastern prog 101 lessons for someone less musically aware.


The author of the thread clearly stated an interest in Middle Eastern SOUNDS. Just clarifying for those interested. If that's not you then please disregard. In other words, if it don't apply then let it fly.

You're right about that. I usually don't pay much attention to lyrics. That's why I am more interested in Middle Eastern sounds.

Anyway, I hadn't really heard much from Renaissance, so besides all the good (and not so good ) suggestions I have heard so far in this thread, I appreciate the fact that I was introduced to that band Renaissance. I will definitely have to dedicate some time in the near future to explore them.
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Originally posted by judahbenkenobi judahbenkenobi wrote:


Anyway, I hadn't really heard much from Renaissance, so besides all the good (and not so good ) suggestions I have heard so far in this thread, I appreciate the fact that I was introduced to that band Renaissance. I will definitely have to dedicate some time in the near future to explore them.


All the studio albums from 'Prologue' through to Azure d'Or' plus 'Live at Carnegie Hall'  are highly recommended.

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Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

 
Pedro, this is the 24 minute title track to Scheherazade by Renaissance. This is middle eastern prog.

Not really. Lyrically and poetically for sure but not musically. From the composition standpoint this album is the true definition of symphonic prog more inspired by the classic Scheherazade by Rimsky-Karsakov based on the folk tales One Thousand and One Nights (aka The Arabian Nights).
...
So if you're referring to the lyrics and subject matter, you are correct but as far as the music is concerned, there's nothing Middle Eastern about this Renaissance track at all.


Hi,

Thank you ... I was about to write the same thing. Just because it IS about this and that, so what? It does not make it Middle Eastern Prog. I'm not sure that Steve G has a good idea of what "Middle Eastern Prog" is all about, since the majority of folks here do not even bother to listen to different things other than their top ten or so, with an occasional something or other in the middle.

There is a LOT of Middle Eastern music around, however I am not sure that much of it could/should/would be considered "prog" or "progressive", otherwise someone like DamoX (here on PA) would be creating a thread/blog about many of these bands, and there are a lot of them that are way far and beyond the touch of music that we are so familiar with. It's the same thing for DamoX's blog ... we don't touch or discuss much the many bands that he lists and his doing this over the years is totally insane, and far out! We do not have the equivalent of someone doing Middle Eastern music at all ... and I, for one, wish we had one.


Edited by moshkito - June 08 2021 at 20:39
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I just heard some Middle Eastern sounds on Pendragon's Believe album. THat's such a beautiful album. Not sure why it is rated so low.

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