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Dylan or Shadows?
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earlyprog View Drop Down
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Points: 2159 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote earlyprog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2021 at 13:21
Originally posted by Spaciousmind Spaciousmind wrote:


Thanks for the links forgot about Booker T,....

Nick

Easy to forget as they were years ahead of their time...

Originally posted by Spaciousmind Spaciousmind wrote:


Btw... if you want to go a year earlier then try Nivram from the Shadows.... nice and Jazzy or See you in my Drums.

Nick

Exactly, love Nivram.

Originally posted by Spaciousmind Spaciousmind wrote:



The Shadows have been cited as a major influence on many guitarists, including Brian May, Eric Clapton, Mark Knopfler, Andy Summers, Ritchie Blackmore, David Gilmour, and Tony Iommi. A tribute album, Twang! A Tribute to Hank Marvin & the Shadows , in October 1996 featured Blackmore, Iommi, Peter Green, Randy Bachman, Neil Young, Mark Knopfler, Peter Frampton and others playing Shadows hits. The early set of Queen (who played their first gig on 27 June 1970 with Freddie Mercury, Roger Taylor and Brian May) included a cover of Cliff and the Shadows' "Please Don't Tease"

Nick

I would add Andy Latimer to the list.





Edited by earlyprog - March 24 2021 at 13:36
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Originally posted by Cactus Choir Cactus Choir wrote:

Jan Akkerman of Focus is another guitarist who I think sounds like he has a bit of a Shadows influence when you listen to tracks like Focus II and Tommy. On a separate note I've always thought this was a pretty heavy sounding track for 1965:

Thanks for sharing it.  No question in my mind about that sounding like proto prog.

With The Shadows or as they were known before that, The Drifters you can hear proto as far back as 1959.  Try this one called Jet Black.



Well if it takes organ or keyboard to make it to proto prog, do I detect some organ here in 1959?

A couple of others from the Drifters worth checking out are Chinchilla and Driftin'

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The Beatles, 'Cry for a Shadow' - not an accidental title.
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This thread died when it was moved to it's proper location where only few will see it LOL

Nonetheless, it's remains interesting, IMO, so here's my part II of what they were cooking in Proto-Prog's R&D Department in 1962.







'Telstar' by The Tornados is epic as stated earlier but definitely also this:




Edited by earlyprog - March 26 2021 at 12:11
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^ Nice. What's up Dan? Hope all's well! Smile

Edited by SteveG - March 26 2021 at 12:14
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

^ Nice. What's up Dan? Hope all's well! Smile

I'm alive and kickin' well, dear Steve Smile

Perhaps some of my early US pre-proto-prog can support your opinions in your 'Early UK vs US prog' thread. 

Surely, I'm supporting your view on the Zappa/Beefheart/RIO Avant Prog US direction... Wink 
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What I always liked about you, Steve, is your patience and persistence with ignorant PA members.....and your profound knowledge...and we never really disagreed....



Edited by earlyprog - March 26 2021 at 13:00
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Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:

What I always liked about you, Steve, is your patience and persistence with ignorant PA members.....and your profound knowledge...and we never really disagreed....


Thanks Dan. But we must have disagreed about something. This is PA, after all. All the best mate.
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Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:

What I always liked about you, Steve, is your patience and persistence with ignorant PA members.....and your profound knowledge...and we never really disagreed....


Thanks Dan. But we must have disagreed about something. This is PA, after all. All the best mate.

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Originally posted by Spaciousmind Spaciousmind wrote:

Anyway your thoughts about these two songs from almost 60 years ago, were these two songs big influencers to future drummers, musicians, singers, writers yes or no?

For the year 1962 or earlier what else would you add or consider as game changers?

(Admittedly, this is an attempt to perform a first aid procedure for cardiac arrest to this thread....)
 
I don't recognize any of the two songs (Dylan 'House of the rising Sun and Shadows 'Little "B"') as game changers. Both artists were game changers, but Dylan not until 1963 and Shadows with other songs from 1962.

I have listed other '62 tracks above and will move back in time to '61 with clavioline (a game changer) and the whole game changing instrument lot:
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Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:

This thread died when it was moved to it's proper location where only few will see it LOL

Nonetheless, it's remains interesting, IMO, so here's my part II of what they were cooking in Proto-Prog's R&D Department in 1962.

That Alan Watts is a trip!

Ok staying with 1962.

This must be the version that inspired Led Zeppelin's Custard Pie foot stomping from Sonny Terry & Brownie McGhee live at the Fret.



And some Jazz from Kenny Burrell & John Coltrane - Lyresto



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Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:


(Admittedly, this is an attempt to perform a first aid procedure for cardiac arrest to this thread....)
 
I don't recognize any of the two songs (Dylan 'House of the rising Sun and Shadows 'Little "B"') as game changers. Both artists were game changers, but Dylan not until 1963 and Shadows with other songs from 1962.

Don't get too hung up about the two song choices.  They were deliberate when i did my initial post.  Dylan was an easy choice with House of the Rising Sun as that would inevitably compare with The Animals besides him being acknowledged for his Folk contribution by almost everyone.

The Shadows a little tougher since many associate them with Cliff Richards and easier to pooh pooh away.  I chose the drum solo Little B simply because you can associate it to modern rock drummers.  No other reason as you rightly point out they have many other songs to choose from as participated by you and others :)

ps... remember that this post was also more about questions around older artists inspiring others to get to where it all ends up in the late 60s which is much easier to document.

Nick



Edited by Spaciousmind - March 27 2021 at 13:35
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Originally posted by Spaciousmind Spaciousmind wrote:

The Shadows a little tougher since many associate them with Cliff Richards and easier to pooh pooh away.  I chose the drum solo Little B simply because you can associate it to modern rock drummers.  No other reason as you rightly point out they have many other songs to choose from as participated by you and others :)

ps... remember that this post was also more about questions around older artists inspiring others to get to where it all ends up in the late 60s which is much easier to document.

Nick

As I pointed out in the appropriate poll, Chris Cutler started off in a Shadows cover band. He is a phenomenal prog drummer, but one has to assume he was at least somewhat influenced by the Shadows....

I love BJ Wilson’s drumming for Procol Harum, and he definitely stated his greatest influence was Tony Meehan.

It is a shame in a way, that the Shadows are so associated with Cliff Richard, as it potentially means people think less of them.
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Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

As I pointed out in the appropriate poll, Chris Cutler started off in a Shadows cover band. He is a phenomenal prog drummer, but one has to assume he was at least somewhat influenced by the Shadows....

I love BJ Wilson’s drumming for Procol Harum, and he definitely stated his greatest influence was Tony Meehan.

It is a shame in a way, that the Shadows are so associated with Cliff Richard, as it potentially means people think less of them.


Have you ever watched Live at The Union Chapel it's one of my favorite DVDs.  But I see the archives rate In Concert With The Danish National Concert Orchestra And Choir higher.  I might have to get it to compare it.
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Originally posted by Spaciousmind Spaciousmind wrote:

Originally posted by earlyprog earlyprog wrote:

This thread died when it was moved to it's proper location where only few will see it LOL

Nonetheless, it's remains interesting, IMO, so here's my part II of what they were cooking in Proto-Prog's R&D Department in 1962.

That Alan Watts is a trip!

Ok staying with 1962.

This must be the version that inspired Led Zeppelin's Custard Pie foot stomping from Sonny Terry & Brownie McGhee live at the Fret.



And some Jazz from Kenny Burrell & John Coltrane - Lyresto



Nick

THANKS! Never heard of the Led Zeppelin 'Custard Pie' connection before but can definitely understand your assertion. Great!

And don't get me started on Coltrane...Tongue
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