Most underrated prog band?

Nightwish is a good call...

Cristi wrote: M27Barney wrote: Nightwish is a good call... I disagree. They are famous and get a lot of praise from listeners enjoying symphonic metal and power metal.

^Man, that review of ITCOTCK was sure harsh!  I don't agree with any of it.  Thanks for posting!

verslibre wrote: progaardvark wrote: Zombi One of my faves (as if you can't tell). Their Goblin-meets-John Carpenter-meets Tangerine Dream sound is exactly what the doctor ordered. They maintain a loyal following, but it should be bigger. And they need to make a new album. But they do make solo albums as well, so I'm just grateful for the body of work they've thus far released. Everyone should dig these guys.

 

kenethlevine wrote: Cristi wrote: M27Barney wrote: Nightwish is a good call... I disagree. They are famous and get a lot of praise from listeners enjoying symphonic metal and power metal.  true but I specifically stated that on PA they are underrated.  Obviously they are a huge group commercially worldwide.  Considering that their latest studio album was released in 2015 and I was the first collaborator to review it 4 years later, I would say if they aren't underrated then they are just plain ignored

BaldJean wrote: The Red Masque. the only band formed after 2000 that I really like. no-one but Friede and me ever mentions them. singer Lynette Shelley is a member of PA under the name "redvelvetone"

Logan wrote: The following is a review of King Crimson's In the Court of the Crimson King. It does not prove a great illustration, but it gets some things wrong, so I would argue that this one star review underrates the album. I herd this hoping it would be the The Notorious Be-G's (NBG), but instead I got early Snoop Dog before he had the snoop in the dog and dog in the snoop. Having done research, I have come up with my theory which is as follows right after this (after "this" it follows). Some people claim that this is the first prog album and others don't. They are both wrong! I had never heard of Prog before, but In the Court of the Crimson King not only could, will, and would not be considered to be the first Prog album, in actual fact, it could/ would/ will not be considered to be Prog in any way unless Prog is short for microwave oven. In fact, it's not even music at all cause it's just noise, and music cannot be noise, it has to mean something and be more than noise-sound. It has no melody, no harmony, no soul, no nothing. It doesn't have notes, just noises, and noise is not musical so this is not music. If this "album" had actual instruments and actual musicians (like Dr Dre or Johnny Cashmachine), then maybe you could call it music even though you are wrong, but as it doesn't have any of those things that I mentioned before, you can't and so you shouldn't because it wouldn't make any sense to do that. Maybe you think that recording the sound of a microwave oven and food processor counts as music, but I don't, cause that's all this is, plus a disco beat which is just a spatula being used in a cheap diner for making mouldy cheese sandwiches with mayonnaise and bit of lettuce I think. People act all cool like they like this album, but they are not cool and they are all liars since they are not even real people and this music is not cool, and it is not even music, so how could it be cool and how would be people who do not exist in the truest reality that is in my world even know? It makes no sense. Those fakes are just Russian spam bots made out of tinned meat and Russian tin cans so they do not know what is music and what is not music, and what is not not not not not music. Later on Snoop Dog would make real music if it is called music, but don't start with this one that is not music even if it is called music, because it is not music, cause this is just Snoop dog turd plus microwave, food processor and cheap diner spatula, not like a good spatula found in a fancy restaurant. It is not even a real album. I don't like it, and doubt it even exists at all. If you like this you do not even exist, maybe I don't exist but at least I like actual music. Music that is real and true and honest and has a good beat in reality. I give it one star for not being Prog other than microwave oven, music, or even a real album. I also don't like the album cover because I don't like chihuahuas. Go buy "In the Kennel of the Crimpy Dog" instead because it is much improved. It is music, even if not very good music. Buy In the Court of the Crimson King if you like noise such as microwave oven sounds and cheap diner spatulas but don't buy if you want music. Thank you for reading if you did or didn't do so.

M27Barney wrote: What is the point of a spoof review of a classic? Unless an attempt by the pan-heads to bring down the average rating of an album they do not like?

Some pots and pans-heads love spatulas (in the US, an implement used in cooking).

It hasn't brought down the rating and it is not intended to do so. If one were to assume that such a silly review were written with serious intent, it would be underrating the album as it is fallacious/ erroneous. No cheap diner spatula was used to percussive disco intent in that album, the alleged spatula was in actuality quite an expensive electro-mechanical, polyphonic spatula -- the Spatulatron*.

While not my favourite King Crimson album -- I tend to favour Lizard) --, I like In the Court of the Crimson King, and that review only exists in this thread.   For those who haven't read through the posts here, like I said "I wrote it with some humorous intent to illustrate how I use the term underrated".

*Incidentally, the Spatulatron was most famously employed at John Lennon's "Strawberry Pancakes Forever" breakfast restaurant in Brooklyn and had also been utilised by The Moody Blues line-cook in "Fillets of Future Passed".

Lewian wrote: Logan wrote:     For those who haven't read through the posts here, like I said "I wrote it with some humorous intent to illustrate how I use the term underrated".   Ooops. Proper reading is an underrated skill...

Proper clear writing is also an underrated skill... Well, I rate it highly, I'm just not terribly good at it.

I just buried my explanation at the bottom of another post I made here about Nightwish. Mea culpa for being misleading. Quoting said review after writing "The following is a review of King Crimson's In the Court of the Crimson King. It does not prove a great illustration, but it gets some things wrong, so I would argue that this one star review underrates the album" is very misleading. So, then I would argue with myself that I not only misrepresented In the Court, but Prog, music and reality. I did quite like "...unless Prog is short for microwave oven. In fact, it's not even music at all cause it's just noise, and music cannot be noise... It doesn't have notes, just noises, and noise is not musical so this is not music." And "[those who appreciate it] are not cool and they are all liars since they are not even real people and this music is not cool, and it is not even music, so how could it be cool and how would be people who do not exist in the truest reality that is in my world even know? It makes no sense." It makes no sense, indeed. ;)

Anyway, I should have mentioned in that post that I wrote it as an example of the kind of underrating that I was writing about. If just one person has underrated the significance/ merit of an album, then I would argue that it is underrated.   Most everything we know is underrated and overrated by some in some respect. I took some grief when I claimed that the Beatles get too much credit, but I would also claim that some don't give enough credit to the Beatles.   It was a rather underhanded title since I wasn't so much interested in the Beatles at the time, but instead I intended to use it as a springboard to discuss notions of overratedness and underratedness. It was quite trollish.

When one brings out terms such as overrated and underrated, it does always lead to discussions about the terms themselves, which is important to understand where people are coming from. Side-note: my biggest issues tend to be surrounding terms such as liberal, socialist, communist and various "phobia" terminology -- by liberal I often mean free-thinking / open-minded, and when I talk of a phobia I mean a psychological condition that involves an irrational fear and is detrimental to the person with the phobia and is not synonymous with bigotry, though said person may also be a bigot. But I digress.

Underrated is a term that can be used in a variety of ways, but when I use it, I like to refer to specific claims where people are demonstrably and evidentially not giving something sufficient merit commonly out of ignorance and flawed, invalid reasoning. In this case I concocted my examples with The Flower Kings and King Crimson, ridiculous though they were, but I have seen various bands and albums being underrated by individuals making false or dubious claims and making specious arguments as justification for their estimations of worth/ merit. I know that I've done it before as well.

I expect when most people say something is underrated or overrated, they just mean that they like it or more or less than it seems that the majority do. I don't enjoy Close to the Edge much, and I seem to be in a minority here, but that doesn't mean that I think others are overrating it or that I'm underrating it. I recognise its significance, and I'm fine with people praising it, despite not personally being of the religious persuasion. But, to use an extreme example, if someone claims that Close to the Edge should be considered great by music historians as the first symphonic album, then I will say that they got it wrong and have overrated its significance. If someone claimed that that album in not important to progressive rock, and Yes should be drummed out of Prog Archives, then I will argue that that person has underrated the album and the significance of the band.

I like to look at specific examples, and I have come across dubious, and downright wrong, claims to, and arguments for, greatness for the Beatles, and some who I say demonstrably have unfairly diminished the merit as well.

Edited by Logan - June 06 2019 at 09:03

handwrist wrote: Gilgamesh. IMO their self titled is one of the best albums ever made.