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Joined: January 25 2008
Location: Wisconsin
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Points: 8192
Topic: Time for Indo-Prog/Raga Rock subgenre to go? Posted: February 04 2018 at 08:18
Listening to the newly released album Lunar Halo The Myrrors and seeing it having been assigned to the Space/Psych ward, I'm beginning to wonder about the relevance and viability of maintaining and sustaining an entire page and subgenre that cannot even generate 100 albums for a "Top 100 rated" albums list.
My questions are:
Does there need to be a page dedicated to this subgenre, "Indo-Prog/Raga Rock"--a minor category of practically extinct music?
Would there be any problem absorbing all of these albums into other categories? (e.g., Jazz-Rock Fusion, Space/Psych, Avant/RIO, Krautrock, Prog Folk, and even Symphonic.)
Is it any effort and/or distraction to keep and maintain the present page?
Did this subgenre play as important a role in "progressing" progressive rock as the other subs?
Did these bands/albums really deserve their own subgenre over other potential subs such as:
"Jazz-Rock" and "Fusion,"
"Space" and "Psychedelic,"
"Progressive Electronic" and "Berlin School,"
"Post Rock" and "Math Rock," etc.????
And what about Neoclassical/Avant Chamber as a representative of progressive music? (Why is such a thing impossible just because they don't use drums?)
Special Collaborator
PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic
Joined: October 05 2013
Location: SFcaUsA
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Points: 15252
Posted: February 04 2018 at 08:40
I don't have any idea why indo-raga was given it's own little world to exist in here but i kinda like it. It maintains a little exotic club of artists from another era that had their heads in the clouds and sitars at hand.
I've always been more curious why certain genres like RIO and avant-prog are lumped together.
Also metal has three categories here and they could easily all just be called "progressive metal."
I agree that post-rock and math rock are two different categories as well.
I would imagine that changing all this would require unfathomable amounts of effort that could be better spent sprucing up the site in other ways. There are still tons of bands missing here even from the classic era.
This is probably one of those questions for the founders of the site as it seems quite mysterious in some ways.
Joined: August 22 2010
Location: Indiana
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Points: 20623
Posted: February 04 2018 at 10:43
The only album I own from that 'category' is Third Ear Band -Alchemy.....never thought of it as Indo prog raga....more like folky psych rock to me. I used to own a copy of Tanyet...Caleib People in the distant past.
I don't have a problem with the genre....but it could easily fit in the folk psych/prog area.
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin
Joined: January 13 2018
Location: EllicottCityMD
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Points: 1423
Posted: February 04 2018 at 10:44
I recently had the same thought when I submitted a Celtic-prog band, "The Moors", for possible inclusion in the database. Someone suggested they be classified as Indo/Raga, but I disagreed, and recommended Prog Folk (althought that isn't even the best place for them).
I might suggest a more general genre called "World Fusion". The Celtic guys can go there. The Indo/Raga guys can go there. I think the band Azigza (mis-classified as Jazz Rock/Fusion, IMHO) should go there. The definition of the World Fusion sub-genre would be:
Bands that base their music on the traditional music of various parts of the world, whether it is their own native area, or some other. The music, while based on traditional songs and motifs, exhibits the characteristics of progressive rock. This genre include other sub-genres such as Celtic Prog, Indo/Rag Prog, Prog Gypsy, Afro-Prog, Prog Viking Metal. Examples bands in the genre include Azigza, The Moors, Quintessence, Tir Na Nog, Huun-Huur-Tu, Beats Antique, Koraii Orom, Lumsk, and even soundtracks of Cirque du Soleil.
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
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Points: 46833
Posted: February 04 2018 at 10:48
blame M@X Drew.... I offered to buy the site from him. Captcha would have been first to go and yeah.... that subgenre would have been on my list to do away with. The bands within it could have easily been folded into other subs.
but it is a good point... something that could be done but on that note... in case you haven't noticed... leadership is completely missing on this site. It sails the seas of mediority after the wind of the 1st generation collabs who ran the site and built it retired and moved on. No one left and M@X is f**king awol... to do anything to really change the site. It can't get rid of Captcha... zero chance of really changing anything on the database. The site has been on cruise control for years... it could really be improved.. but there is little stomach and less forceful personalities left here to make it happen
Joined: December 31 2017
Location: Australia
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Points: 4780
Posted: February 04 2018 at 11:02
Where would you put this?:
{EDIT: Fixed youtube embed. For youtube, either hyperlink using url code or use the tube code but only have the unique part of the youtube address after v= otherwise it will try to install shockwave flash objects on people's computers. So the embed code (without breaks) is not [TUBE ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QBYaoynkVg[ /TUBE] but instead it is (without breaks) [ tube] _QBYaoynkVg[/ tube] ... - Logan}
Edited by Logan - February 06 2018 at 06:05
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
Joined: January 13 2018
Location: EllicottCityMD
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Points: 1423
Posted: February 04 2018 at 11:28
I prophesy disaster wrote:
Where would you put this?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QBYaoynkVg
I would classify them as "World Fusion". If you look at André FERTIER's website (one of the principal members of Mixtus Orbis), he classifies himself as an innovator of World Music. Unfortunately, PA does not have this sub-genre. I think it's time to create it, and merge the Indo/Raga stuff (and a few other mis-classified bands) into it.
Joined: December 31 2017
Location: Australia
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Points: 4780
Posted: February 04 2018 at 11:52
siLLy puPPy wrote:
I agree that post-rock and math rock are two different categories as well.
Yes. Whereas I quite like math rock, post rock doesn't appeal to me at all. And because PA doesn't make the distinction, it's a bit of an effort to find the math rock amongst the post rock.
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
Joined: October 19 2011
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 6343
Posted: February 04 2018 at 13:32
I love the albums that are Raga-Prog. I check to see if new artists are added and I feel disappointed at the dearth of new additions. I think to myself, " I bet there are new bands, unknown even to the Collaborators, jamming to Raga Prog."
I agree with Silly Puppy....."post-rock and math rock are two different categories as well." Post Rock doesn't sound anything like Math Rock to me.
Joined: July 29 2005
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Points: 24429
Posted: February 04 2018 at 13:34
The reason is very simple: Indo/Raga was one of the favourite "subgenres" one of the site's earliest members and collaborators, Philippe (who also wrote the introduction on the subgenre's home page). Most of the subgenres were created in the early days of the site, and Indo/Raga is a legacy from those days. Other subgenres have been modified, but that one has remained - probably because no one finds it particularly offensive or noteworthy. The ones that were split - such as Art Rock or Prog Metal - were so huge as to be unmanageable by any team that did not have at least ten members.
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46833
Posted: February 04 2018 at 13:49
yeah..... for those of you who didn't have the pleasure of meeting him.
A picture says a thousand words
even I... who would pick fights with anyone..at anytime when I thought they were wrong tended to steer clear of him. He was a legend. And people think I am acerbic. sh*tttttt..... Miss ya buddy....
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46833
Posted: February 04 2018 at 14:01
*spits Hot tea all over monitor*
oh god daring I had forgotten that..... the time I pissed him off so badly he lost control of his english facilities as well as his stone cold personna... and called me a freaking monkey. f**king A hiliarious...
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
I really like having the Indo-Prog/Raga-Rock sub-genre, as I think it is truly is a separate and unique genre. Saying this, a 'Progressive World Music' category would also suffice, and provide a home where other progressive world musics could also be housed.
I also agree that post-rock and math rock - two genres I really like - are really separate genres and would be best as their own categories.
Finally, I always thought we didn't need so many progressive metal categories, but as someone who listens less to metal I will defer to those who do.
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Time for Indo-Prog/Raga Rock subgenre to go?
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siLLy puPPy wrote:
