A question about prog-related

Prog-related can mean what Friede means, and it can refer to music itself which has a prog relation. It can also refer specifically to a "sub-genre" at Prog Archives. Prog can be in the ear of the be-hearer and so can Prog Related in the musical sense.

When I say or think prog-related, I'm not generally referring to the Prog-Related category in PA which operates under its own set of guidelines. To me it is about the music (synonyms might be quasi-prog, prog umbrella music, proggy music, "possibly prog", "prog to some"....). For instance, I consider Ennio Morricone to be a prog-related artist for lots of his 60s and 70s music (prog for some of it). As a modern one, I consider Matt Berry to be a prog-related artist for his music (prog for some of it). The Wicker Man soundtrack is prog folk related to me, Mandingo is JRF related to me etc.

In the Prog Related category, I think that there is a fair amount of Prog-proper music. Even without the reviews, I wouldn't want to see those gone. I wish we had focused more on albums rather than artists (instead of thinking of an act as prog, think of the music or an album as Prog, prog related, or neither) -- I'm not keen on the whole discography policy and that has meant that so-called prog albums are not represented in the database because of concerns about other albums by the artists).

With the PR category, the more of the PR criteria that an act ticks -- according to the category page -- the stronger the argument for inclusion and the more worthy of placement, but my bias tends to give the qualities of the music itself primary importance while also considering the other factors (if not rock, is it progressive music, and how does it relate to specific categories in PA? Can knowing the music give listeners a wider picture of the prog umbrella?)

I think it would depend on the music. I know prog related refers to the artists in a big way, but if the music does not have any prog tendencies, then I would doubt calling it prog related.   

In the '70s almost every working musician was in some way connected to or related to prog.  

Vompatti wrote: Quinino wrote: SteveG wrote: One word: Sussudio. A brilliant pop song, and actually quite complex underneath when you really listen to it, that bass line alone is worthy of the eclectic crossover prog label.

It's not prog or prog related or even good. Good night.

Night, Steve..

Sorry didn't mean to brush you off Friede but I was about to eat dessert:)

I think what this basically boils down to is, once again, the age old warhorse 'progressive musiv vs prog'. A few people on PA, like Moshkito fx, have always wanted the site to be about the former and I suspect you're in the same camp.
But taking that step would also mean including other forms of progressive music such hip hop, polka, classical, pop, techno and so forth. As much as I love progressive music in all of it's aspects (these days I probably listen to far more experimental music than actual prog rock that is listed on PA) it is still not quite what this site is about...and I very much doubt that most members would enjoy such an overhaul.
It could of course also just mean that your definition of prog vastly differs from PAs.

Prog related taken at face value is more to my liking - just like Greg actually (Logan). Music that isn't really prog rock but somehow sounds related to it. Again this description can be applied to twice the number of artists already found in the database, which effectively would change the site completely.

Byw Prog related also happens to hold many of my own faves, but I still don't see the need for it unless we could multitag albums and/or completely bypass the whole discography policy....but then again do you really think this site is going to undergo any such overhaul? We've been pleading for some sort of respons regarding the whole capcha debacle for over half a year and we're still none the wiser. Anyway we've been talking about new ideas and cool update stuff for years (as long as I can remember), so I guess it must be too much of a workload having to rearrange the thousands upon thousands of bands and albums.
By the looks of it it feels more like a sinking ship without it's captain.

Edited by Guldbamsen - October 05 2017 at 17:10

This is a topic that just keeps getting regurgitated on a regular basis. With regards the OP:

if a band has almost the same line-up as a certain prog band but does not play prog is it then prog-related? I think yes, but I would lkike (sic) to hear other opinions

There are (7) criteria listed on the Prog Related definition page on PA but they are not intended to be all inclusive or exhaustive. As far as personnel is concerned, whether the music played can be deemed influential upon or influenced by Prog would be an important factor for inclusion but other criteria would have to be taken into consideration e.g. Greg Lake's solo output as evidenced by his studio albums is clearly NOT Prog but every single tour he has done post ELP has included very innovative interpretations of much of his back catalogue with both Crimson and ELP. Check out Gary Moore playing Karn Evil 9 on guitar for some truly jaw dropping innovation. For this reason I can see a tenuous case for his inclusion. Similarly, you could maybe make a case for David Gilmour of Floyd, but I don't know if he covers Progressive Rock, Floyd material or otherwise in the live realm. Phil Collins, by way of contrast, appears to have a strictly NOT Prog solo album career and does not, AFAIK, include Progressive Rock material in his solo live shows.

That said, there are inclusions in Prog Related that were clearly click-bait to lure the plain vanilla Rawk fan into PA at its inception and I cannot make any sort of cogent argument for the following: (and I adore many of these artists)

Black Sabbath, Iron Maiden, Metallica, Blue Oyster Cult, John Cale, The Church, Golden Earring, Yngwie Malsteem, Mercury Rev, Mike Rutherford, Steeleye Span, Talking Heads, Triumph.

With regards your remark: I don't belong to that group - I belong to a more radical one. I question the whole genre of "prog".

You are cordially invited to contact the site owner to determine what, if any, future direction he envisions will be pursued for PA moving forward. As things stand we have been at a crossroads for several years i.e. there is a burgeoning clamor for inclusion of all progressive developments in Rock music c/f the avowed aims of the site as being an archive of Progressive Rock. The clue's in the name really (archive usually denotes a historical record of a phenomenon that occurred in the past)

Edited by ExittheLemming - October 12 2017 at 07:40

ExittheLemming wrote: The clue's in the name really (archive usually denotes a historical record of a phenomenon that occurred in the past)

To me the bands in crossover and prog related could be interchangeable at times...I have never really understood the categories very well....but then I don't really understand the need for Neo Prog either since most of it sounds like symphonic prog to me.