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Atavachron 
Special Collaborator 
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65440 |
 Posted: September 26 2016 at 23:14 |
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I agree, soda and popcorn rarely disappoint. |
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: September 26 2016 at 23:30 |
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What?
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AZF
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: January 17 2012 Location: Wirral Status: Offline Points: 1079 |
Posted: September 27 2016 at 04:18 |
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Did Trump actually admit he doesn't pay or hardly pays any tax?
That's not going to play well in the sticks! If they bothered to get someone else the whole thing would of been different. |
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EddieRUKiddingVarese
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 04 2016 Location: Aust Status: Offline Points: 1802 |
Posted: September 27 2016 at 07:11 |
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He certainly doesn't pay it on haircuts
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"Everyone is born with genius, but most people only keep it a few minutes"
and I need the knits, the double knits! |
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65440 |
Posted: September 27 2016 at 17:31 |
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But isn't that kind of sneaky evasion and rule-breaking often applauded in U.S. culture. Someone got over on the Feds and kept their money; Yay! ... even though our tax-base suffers and consequently the country as a whole! Woo-hoo!
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: September 27 2016 at 17:34 |
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don't try to attribute common sense to right wing voters.... the guy avoids taxes... woo-hoo.. they'll love it. Just as they love supporting a party more interested in making the richest richer.. and their supporters... pffff... here.. have a bill protecting your bathroom experience in lieu of a decent living wage or affordable health care. |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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LearsFool
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: November 09 2014 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 8642 |
Posted: September 27 2016 at 17:38 |
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As a friend of mine at college said today: "Trump got roasted!"
For reference, here's a list of a bunch of the lies he spewed yesterday night in Hempstead, with rebuttals.
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: September 27 2016 at 18:33 |
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fell asleep prior the debate... and missed it.. but sounds like I really didn't miss anything.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: September 29 2016 at 23:29 |
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Didn't watch the debate since I didn't want to be morbidly depressed
(yeah still don't find Trump entertaining) and I figured how it'd go down. From all I gather, it went just as I figured. We all knew Clinton would wipe the floor with Trump, apparently even his aides can't deny he lost Since there is a larger than usual number of undecideds, these debates will be critical. At this point...if you are undecided, you really really are torn/have no idea and thus I think will be easily swayed. For example, by a debate performance. Assuming she keeps winning, the post debate swell (which already seems to be forming) should be enough to carry her to the win in November. As we've seen, she needs events like these...down time always results in Trump clawing into her lead. All that said, 538 currently has AZ, GA pretty solidly for Trump and things are still razor tight in several swing states, with him still favored in a few, including NC now. I will wait to see how strong her post debate bump is, but I almost wonder if my original prediction of an Obama 2008 level win was an overshoot. But yeah, I now think the debates will be her ace in the hole. Edited by JJLehto - September 29 2016 at 23:29 |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: September 29 2016 at 23:32 |
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Kinda. He did say once he "Pays people alot to pay as little tax as possible" This is of course not proof of anything, but Robert Reich claims people "in the know" told him that Trump does pay little to no tax. Also he's received millions and millions of dollars in various subsidies, breaks etc from the government. So that negates whatever tax he may pay...it's very possible he gets a net return from the government!  Sadly it wont phase many people. His cult has proven nothing will sway them. And if anything the GOP is on board with this, they love tax evading and letting the wealthy milk the government. I mean regular people too, not just politicians. Some people I know who yell the loudest about welfare bums, people abusing the government, responsibility not mooching etc etc etc champion the fact people and big business milk the government and get out of paying taxes. If I ever brought this up, they would often admit it. That yeah, they are OK with this and don't see it as hypocritical. And they are the ones who claim the left is stirring up class warfare
 Edited by JJLehto - September 29 2016 at 23:36 |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: September 29 2016 at 23:44 |
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Speaking of 538 I found this article VERY sobering. http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/missing-white-voters-could-elect-trump-but-first-they-need-to-register/?ex_cid=2016-forecast
They estimate that 47 million white, non college educated, Americans did not vote in 2012. 24 million of which were men. "Missing white voters" they call it, those eligible to vote but did not. Anyway,this group is Trump's strongest base of support. If just one out of every 8 of this bloc would come out to vote for Trump, he'd win the election. Popular vote and electoral college. That is kinda scary. This is the first concrete stats based analysis I've seen showing how Trump can actually very realistically win. Good news: There is little evidence that many of these people are registering to vote. So it seems unlikely that such a swell will happen. Also, while Trump has gotten lots of new people to come and vote, he's also inspired many to come out solely against him. Add to it he puts zero effort into making a ground game, and the GOP has not fully embraced him, there doesn't seem to much of a drive to get out the vote. Of course this all CAN happen, but it seems unlikely. Still, scary to think President Trump is not impossible, in fact it's actually very possible. Makes me think to the future as well. All the hope of the GOP's implosion, I actually see a grand chance for them. There is a huge bloc of Americans up for grabs, and I could see a somewhat toned down, more Republican Trump, one dedicated to campaigning and has party backing, scoring a huge opportunity. Of course the Dems could make inroads into this group as well, but needless to say Clinton won't be the way.
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: September 29 2016 at 23:50 |
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Final post of the night!
Sanders and Warren were right. The too big to fail banks are bigger. Not just that, they may not be any safer. I have heard this for years from various people, but seems now it's undoubtedly true. They are not in any better position, and certainly not behaving wiser, than in 2007. Next recession, I wonder if the banks will need to be bailed out again (my money is on yes). If so....ho-ly sh*t. Whatever poor soul is President may be doomed to one term. I actually think it'd be worse for Trump. Everyone knows Clinton will do it, but imagine if somehow Trump was to win, ends up in this spot, and bails out the banks and wall street, which he will do. Reminds me of Rogerthat's thoughts of how dangerous a let down in Trump could be. Not sure even his walls and wars would distract the mobs from the situation.
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ClemofNazareth
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk Researcher Joined: August 17 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4659 |
Posted: September 30 2016 at 06:11 |
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I'm living in Pennsylvania these days, which has a large white, blue-collar population and is Clinton's 'firewall' for her electoral majority. A couple months ago a Republican party county office opened in my office building and it has been a disturbing yet illuminating experience watching the goings-on there over the past few weeks. The diversity of white people coming out of that office is interesting, as the Jaguar's sitting next to worn-out pickups in the parking lot would attest (BTW 'The Diversity of White People' would make a great album title for some post-rock or neo-prog band). The main focus of this office is to register voters. They have a large group here every evening until the late hours on the phone, driving people into the office to register them, sending people out to remote locations to register voters, and handling walk-in traffic which is pretty steady. This is anecdotal of course and may not reflect what's happening in the rest of the state but if it does then Clinton may be in for a big surprise in Pennsylvania and with her electoral count come November 8th. Driving around Northeast Pennsylvania and rural upstate New York I also see a lot of Trump/Pence bumper stickers, yard signs, billboards and banners but almost nothing for Hillary or the Democrats in general, and these are areas that have traditional been at least balanced even when leaning slightly right. Frankly there are a lot more Gary Johnson signs in this area now than there are Hillary ones. And Clinton should also be careful about buying into the media's assertion that she "won" the first debate. I'm a very liberal Democrat who voted for her husband and for Obama twice each, but even I was put off by her smug and condescending responses to Trump's buffoonery. Sure he's a fool but at this point in the election he is a very dangerous fool and acting dismissive like she did last Monday will only rile up his base and turn off those 'missing voters' she needs to close a quickly shrinking lead. Interesting that the L.A. Times poll shows she didn't get a post-debate bump at all, in fact she dropped about one point while Trump extended his lead to 5.6 points. He's now leading beyond the margin of error in several national polls. This is shaping up to be a very nervous and interesting six weeks.
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"Peace is the only battle worth waging."
Albert Camus |
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 01 2016 at 21:33 |
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it is too late to change my vote.. of course it is.
I'd almost pay to see what a Trump administration looked like... and I could think of worse things than 4 years of Katrina representing our country at the U.N. It would be popcorn and Milk Duds 24/7. Just think of the complilation of ludicrious newschannel interviews we're working on accumulating in just 6 months. Could you imagine 4 years of it. Priceless... |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 02 2016 at 06:30 |
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October surprise? One reason I really didn't worry too much about the tightening of the polls in September was knowing...ie strongly suspecting that while all of Hillary's dirty laundry and skeletons had been exposed...to be point of oversaturation... thus the Lewinsky hail-mary... but... BUT... Trump was suspected of having a mansion full of them. It was only a matter of time before the Press fulfilled its watchdog duty.
Obviously won't deter the misogynists, bigots and ignorant... but it will for the soft middle that will be the difference between a nail biter and an electoral college blowout for Hillary. 'that makes me smart'... indeed That will play well in surburbia.. Edited by micky - October 02 2016 at 06:31 |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 02 2016 at 06:44 |
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ahhh.. the missing white vote... the fountain of eternal youth...the El Dorado of American Politics. worrying about it Brian is as much a waste of time as the GOP has wasted in trying to mine every last white vote. Look at it this way... if the fear of Obama didn't bring them out.. with as things go.. RATIONAL GOP candidates.. What makes anyone think they would magically appear this year when there is not a colored Muslim to vote against... and to support what... the single most disliked candidate in American history. The folly of the GOP is the Democratic gain.. for they refuse to moderate their policies to be more inclusive.. in the hope that THIS would be the year they could magically get the 'missing' white vote to turn out. Thus the barely disguised racism prevalent in this campaign out of Trump. It is the last ditch appeal TO get them out. But like anything.. with actions.. there ARE consequences  Thus as I have posted several times... driving the rapidly emerging (and very substantial I may note) 'missing' hispanic votes... firmly into the Democratic party, as happened with the black vote, on a generational basis. It is what Political scienctists will be looking at down the road as the root cause of the death of the Republican Party. They lose the hispanic vote as they did the Black vote.. it is GAME OVER for them as a party. Edited by micky - October 02 2016 at 07:02 |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 02 2016 at 07:32 |
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what is really interesting... and I saw a few articles on it this week.. so it isn't escaping notice is just how deeply these demographic sh*ts are, and will continue to, affect politics as usual.
Ohio? Once a vital battleground state for both sides..a bellweather state for Presidential elections. Today? Now it is only is for the Repubican Party. There literally is no realistic path to winning without it, yet the Democratic Party has a good many paths without it. What it symbolizes are the electoral shifts going on. With what were battleground states shifting from one side or the other.. but with otherwise previously solid states flipping to battleground. Virginia (thankfully) has flipped red to blue.. and it will not be long before North Carolina, Arizona and Georgia do the same. THen there is Texas. SO in the short matter of perhaps 2 or 3 election cycles. Ohio... Pennsylvania? They won't be the central battleground states they are today. interesting political times indeed... |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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LearsFool
Prog Reviewer
Joined: November 09 2014 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 8642 |
Posted: October 02 2016 at 11:24 |
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Mm-hmm. This election was never really in doubt, since worries about GOP mobilisation in PA don't look to have come to anything. And now Chump not just being caught taking a YOOJ loss in '95, and not even that he abused that fact to not pay income taxes for upwards of 18 years when his properties already have absurd tax breaks, but bragging about it and having chastised the lower classes in the past for paying no income tax when they have good goddamn reasons to not have to pay... this may yet knock some sense into people who really should've declared Trump dead to them when he insulted McCain's war record.
Oh, and I'll say it now: there's nothing certain in life, except death and Democrats freaking out during a presidential election. I remember in '12 when people were raving about how Mittens would totally get a majority of the votes while still losing the electoral college and cause chaos, and worries after Obama put in a weak performance at the first debate - some columnists lamented that he had lost the election! Calm down. We'll be fine.  |
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: October 02 2016 at 12:19 |
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Democrats do enjoy wigging out don't they. it is interesting to me the flap and worry about PA... they do realize there is a built in 900,000 vote advantage for the Democrats around Philalephia. That is what has turned Virginia blue...the huge vote advantage around DC that offsets the backward Virginia hinterlands haha. it has kept PA blue and likely will for some years.. at least long enough to where PA becomes like Ohio has in 2016. Not a vital part of the Democratic math. We may see that as early as 2020 with Democratic pickups in the west and south where the demographic changes are happening most quickly
What did people expect.. or the GOP.. that they would beat the bushes of central and Western PA to find 900,001 untapped white voters. At long as Hillary didn't f**k up.. PA was never in doubt IMO. Trump has made it worse of course.. in pursuit of those untapped yokels.. he has alienated the educated and female wing of his party. So for every yokel he gets to voting booth.. he will have lost some hot GOP milf in the suburbs. Edited by micky - October 02 2016 at 12:20 |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: October 02 2016 at 15:33 |
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To be fair, I did say it's unlikely much will come of it, NOW but ya know....arrogance tends to be people's downfall. We've seen they can be won, if only Trump and the GOP actually tried. That was more the point of the post, there's been this air of "this is whacky but it's just not possible" and that article showed no, it's actually VERY possible for Trump (or anyone like him) to win. Hell, if turnout is low enough (which is very possible) Trump may still win. I used to assume Trump is so awful people will say "OK dont like Clinton but I cant just not vote" however, I am now more sure lots of people just wont vote. Sad and stupid as it is. Yeah, we know all that It's not exactly news , just IDK man I dont like the arrogance. Bush was quite popular with hispanics. And it's funny, some minorities (and especially Hispanics) have a tendency towards social conservatism. Really if the GOP could be less sh*t, and not racist, there's no reason to just assume things continue as they do forever. And if you wanna talk about the future....remember the upcoming bloc, those pesky millennials, really dont like Clinton. This of course can't cover millions of people, but just personal anecdote: At my job not one hispanic or black person around my age (most are younger) like Clinton. A few will go "lesser of two evils" some are just not voting. Some have said they have no faith in the Democratic Party, either in general or to help them... Of course things can change. But all I can say is: Us youngins are told constantly "You havent seen the old Hillary/dont know the real Hillary. Just wait!" Just wait...just wait, just wait. All Im gunna say is we'll see what 8 years of President Clinton gets us. If it goes the way many think....the current youth bloc is not a guarantee to vote in the future. And since we millennials do have this bi polar "one day Sanders one day Rand Paul" deal, I still say it's very possible for a new look GOP to sweep up. Like I've said before the Dems BETTER take advantage. If not I'll call it now, a Trump loss may be good for the GOP. If they can jettison the racism, and embrace minorities (which they were trying to do but still have what racism baggage) and focus on right wing populism (libertarian).....I really fear for that. Reminds me of Bill's speech at the DNC. I was insulted a bit at one part "Those of us with more days behind us than ahead tend to look forward" besides the obvious jab in there I remember thinking no...most of you are stuck thinking in the past, or immediately ahead. I honestly have a big concern the Dems will squander what could be a great opportunity. They've shown to me little over the years to thus far make me think otherwise.
Edited by JJLehto - October 02 2016 at 15:38 |
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American Politics the 2016 edition
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HackettFan wrote: