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emigre80 
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: January 25 2015 Location: kentucky Status: Offline Points: 2223 |
 Posted: July 17 2016 at 14:05 |
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oh, those two are magic when they work together
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member Joined: February 01 2011 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 13110 |
Posted: July 17 2016 at 14:07 |
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Three police officers killed and several wounded in Baton Rouge by men wearing black masks. This crap has got to stop.
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
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micky
Special Collaborator 
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: July 17 2016 at 14:46 |
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^ good luck with that. Stop? It has only just started.
Sad as this is it has been brewing for a long time. The miiltarization of law enforcement, the continual display of racism in this country. I think we finally saw the proverbial straw that broke the Camel's back with those last shootings earlier this month. If we know anything about American's... we don't take sh*t lying down. And we are society highly predisposed to violence. Is anyone really surprised this is happening. I'm not, I said as much in the first post of this thread. It only needed a match to start the fire. We got that. 2nd Amenders and the NRA are likely rejoicing now.  Why else do we have more firearms than people, well.. of course.. they said it was for self protection to protect
ourselves as our founding fathers did from an oppressive government.Interesting article here. http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/07/minnesota-race-inequality-philando-castile-214053 my favorite part.. this from a supposedly enlightened progressive state. “Minor traffic violations are a pretty familiar narrative in Minnesota,” she said. Indeed, the previously mentioned ACLU report—which Nelson helped author—found that at 3 a.m., black drivers in Minneapolis are two times more likely than white drivers to be pulled over and arrested for an active driving violation. But at 2 p.m., when in the daylight officers can better identify the driver’s race, black drivers are nine times more likely to be stopped" does the crap need to stop. Damn right it does... but what needs to stop is a far deeper problem than thinking Black people need to shut the hell up and die quietly at the hands of police. Violence is never right.. nor more than racism is. This sort of problem needs a real leader to address.. I don't know if we have one capable of it. Especially in today's hyper-partisan country we live in. |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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Vompatti
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member Joined: October 22 2005 Location: elsewhere Status: Offline Points: 67421 |
Posted: July 17 2016 at 15:14 |
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member Joined: February 01 2011 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 13110 |
Posted: July 17 2016 at 16:37 |
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Hmmm...Wrong island and wrong ocean. "the land of Voodoo" would be Haiti in the Atlantic, and not Hawaii in the Pacific. But hey, the way things work nowadays is if you repeat something enough times, it magically comes true. So, as magic and voodoo are...ummm...kindred spirits, then what you say is absolutely true.
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
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Vompatti
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member Joined: October 22 2005 Location: elsewhere Status: Offline Points: 67421 |
Posted: July 17 2016 at 16:57 |
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Well, apparently all the Obama apologists have already accepted that Hawaii is a part of America. This is no different. |
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micky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46838 |
Posted: July 17 2016 at 17:18 |
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I had figured we'd see something like this. Not as powerful as Daisy.. but hey.. it is only July.
Still plenty of time to bring up the specter of the mentally unstable/ emotionally unstable having a finger on the button ... |
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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LearsFool
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: November 09 2014 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 8642 |
Posted: July 18 2016 at 22:58 |
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RNC 2016, Day One:
1) Stephen Colbert crashes the opening: 2) NeverTrump loses its last battle. It involved unreliable voice votes and apparent sudden dropping out of three of the nine states whose delegations wanted to throw Trump overboard. Uh-huh. Colorado and Iowa delegations walkout in disgust. 3) A whole conga line of reactionary speakers take the mic. Giuliani emulates Trump's own psychological projection in his hateful speech, accusing Hillary of smearing and insulting Trump. Other way around, dude. 4) Melania Trump's speech, which has been described as describing a different candidate than Trump, was a carbon copy of a Michelle Obama speech. HOLY SH*T! An embarrassment that makes me smirk and share the pain at the same time.
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 00:23 |
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In all fairness to Giuliani...that's not new for him
If anything Trump may have taken a page from his book!I have no idea his rep outside the NY area, I know he's famous for 'cleaning up NY' (crap) and 'I was mayor during 9/11' but he long has been accused of racism and has generally always been a fear monger. Yeah, the RNC was a dumpster fire. I hear several celebs and even party officials/designated speakers didn't show up, nor did John Kasich the governor of the state the convention is in! From what I saw and read, was a truly painful, terrifying show. Seen it called "Orwellian" even. We mock, because it's deserved but really I am quite nervous. We all assume "Hillary wins, I mean look at Trump, GOP implodes, happy ending" but I do fear this is a pandora's box. There is a real regressive force in the US, and virulent racism. Some very disturbing forces, and I don't know if it can just be "put away" even if Trump loses. Quite the opposite, we all forgot/ignored people like Pat Buchanan, or dismissed comments like Jan Brewer's "mexicans are beheading people". Perhaps this has always been lurking, kept at bay by wiser/more noble forces (never thought I'd say that about Bush and co!) the dominance of limited gov ideology, and better times. With all that gone, maybe simply the floodgates can't be held anymore.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65435 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 00:35 |
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Trump emerging from the white mist was too much even for him. It was like a SNL sketch.
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 00:41 |
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Seriously, check out this comment from IA rep Steve King. He's tired of the "old white guy" line claiming no other "subgroup" (wonderful wording!) of people has contributed to Western Civilization.
More disturbing, seems he said this in 2013, in regards to undocumented immigrants: "for every who's a valedictorian, there's another 100 out there who weigh 130 pounds-and they've got calves the size of cantaloupes because they're hauling 75 pounds of marijuana across the desert." WTF!? Yeah, I didn't expect the NeverTrump rebellion to go far. Kudos to them for even trying, and I do applaud the few Repubs who have steadfastly refused to back Trump. Paul Ryan, Tom Cotton, Mike Pence, all these sellouts that barely even try to defend him, but still back him. Hell, Chris Christie has thrown away his career (and literally stopped governing NJ) to be Trump's lackey. Sadly it's true, the people have spoken. Trump won, and was always gunna win, the plurality. Shame we never got to see a brokered convention and see if the party could cobble up a majority against him. Not that any of those options are good. Cruz is as repulsive, Kasich supports class warfare and failed ideologies, well most of the rest do. I wanna say the one I'd most prefer is Jeb Bush, then I remember his "if we work longer and harder things will come your way" comment. I take solace in the fact there's UKIP/Farage, Le Pen, Wilders, Lega Nord, the true finns (or whatever it is now), One Nation etc etc It's not just a US thing, we're all in this sinking boat together
 Edited by JJLehto - July 19 2016 at 00:49 |
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 01:47 |
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^ a 4 or 5 party system won't change anything - you get a plurality because of the voting system which favours the two main parties, not because of how the voters cast their votes or how many parties you have on the ballot. Alternatives such as Johnson and Stein will always be a long way back in third & fourth place regardless of the relative size of their popular vote because they won't win many (if any) states - for example Perot polled 19% of the popular vote in '92 but no electoral college votes.
In Presidential elections where you can only have one winner, there are no prizes for coming second and proportional representation means nothing so alternative voting methods won't change the plurality and won't change the final outcome (no matter how you jiggle the votes in any previous presidential election, the winner remains the same). This isn't the case in House and Senate elections where alternative voting systems can produce dramatic changes in the make-up of the elected body such that no single party holds a majority even though one will win more seats than its nearest rival and thus breaks the plurality - which leads to hung and coalition governments that the voting system within the legislature itself isn't able to cope with. What's needed is a no-party system (but not necessarily the George Washington kind) where none of the candidates are supported by any of the existing partisan ideologies, but that's never going to happen. [edit: but it can happen: see Politics of Jersey ... (the old one not the new one)]
Edited by Dean - July 19 2016 at 02:01 |
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What?
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 10:12 |
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Oh well don't think I'm that dumb
Apologies for not saying this (but I thought it kind of obvious) there'd need to be a change from "winner take all" to proportional representation, which I always believed in anyway. Was thinking mostly that we just need better representation, since clearly more and more people are feeling shut out. I just said 4-5 because those are already the fault lines occurring. (Normal GOP/Tea Party/Trumpism. Normal Dem/Social Democrat) As for gridlock and etc etc eh, that can always happen. Happens here, happens in other countries, but who knows maybe with more there could at least be coalition forming and etc More than anything, that was posted very late and I was just tired and rambling That is certainly an intriguing idea though.
Edited by JJLehto - July 19 2016 at 10:18 |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 11:09 |
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That's pretty awesome. Yeah it's shameful how many have lined up behind Trump, even if they half heartedly (or less!) agree. All this "well I dont like this BUT gotta back the party, Clinton cant win" it's sad. But the GOP has put themselves in a real bind here. They've compensated for abandoning the working class by hyping up social conservatism, racism, but they also stop short of going full out Pat Buchanan and have generally been lax on illegal immigration. Bush and the GOP mainstream mainstream always accepted the "tougher on illegal immigration but allow those here a pathway" which I think is fair and reasonable (and they don't even end up enforcing the tougher on illegals part). Same with the most recent immigration debate, the push for Rubio/understanding hey we can't just be the older white guy party. Even Saint Ronnie granted amnesty for near 2 million illegal immigrants. So it's funny, they are stuck in the rock and the hard place now. Trying to keep up the appeal, while also keeping borders open and somewhat hospitable to immigrants has put em in an impossible situation. Kinda stuck as a white party, continuing to pander just pushes this farther (the 2006 immigration/fence debate destroyed all progress Bush made with Hispanics) but then attempts to break from this just angers the base to the point of, well Trump. Add to it Trump has, ugly as its been given a voice to working/middle class voters who don't care about lesser government, oppose low wages and trade deals, they are kinda doomed at the moment. All their orthodoxy is being thrown away and replaced with blanket racism.
Edited by JJLehto - July 19 2016 at 11:10 |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 11:57 |
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And yeah, if one good thing can come from the RNC it'll be national exposure Giuliani is a terrible guy.
Seriously, wiki and google him. He's long been racist and has a not so great history on the subject. Supposedly he just recently touted how African Americans do better under Republicans, like himself, citing Harlem as an example but Harlem (like a lot of NYC) has become gentrified is a lot of white hipsters now. He was the original "tough/aggressive" policing guy and would probably build a police state if he could.
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LearsFool
Prog Reviewer
Joined: November 09 2014 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 8642 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 15:44 |
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That's not all, he definitely recently touted that black kids have a "99% chance" of killing each other. Steve King has also been going out of his way to show how terrible he is. "Where did any other subgroup of people contribute more to civilization?" than whites, he says.  I guess Trump is empowering them to openly embarrass themselves like we haven't seen since Wallace.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65435 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 18:38 |
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What really bothers me was Giullani's ridiculous enthusiasm; here's a smart, humane person who got his city through the worst period in its history and he's describes Trump's campaign as "greatness".
Wow. Speechless. |
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 65435 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 18:42 |
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I read the transcript; we got some pissed-off crusty white men getting tired of their diminishing status. King showed his true colors in that interview. Backpedal or not, he meant every word. |
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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LearsFool
Prog Reviewer
Joined: November 09 2014 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 8642 |
Posted: July 19 2016 at 22:04 |
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RNC 2016, Day Two:
1) Small outbreak of norovirus strikes some staffers and California delegates. 2) Conspiracy czar Alex Jones agitates the growing numbers of protesters outside the convention. He's joined by various other little known reactionaries, plus an Asian-American who says that America's Asians are the minority "you can trust". 3) Trump is officially nominated in unnecessarily cutthroat circumstances. He's awarded all the delegates from DC and Alaska, even though he lost those primaries handily. Mitch McConnell, who will be booed when he takes the stage, fist pumps when Kentucky's delegates are called for Trump. Michigan passes the buck so that New York and Donald Jr. will be the ones to put Cheeto Jesus over the threshold. Trump thanks the convention... by video. Classy. 4) Paul Ryan is boring when he speaks, so all attention goes to Christie as the spurned VP shortlister sets his sights on being Attorney General and prosecuting Hillary for supporting tyrants - the kind of things Manafort did as a lobbyist. 5) Tiffany and Donnie II try and fail to humanise their old man. Ben Carson gets to ramble on in front of the convention. 6) For a day apparently meant to be about "Make America Work Again!", they focused on battering Hillary. 7) And going back to NY's favouritism, there is a unique favouritism to the seating arrangements. NY, NJ, Cali upfront. Trump's wishful thinking seeps through the RNC.
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npjnpj
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 05 2007 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 2720 |
Posted: July 20 2016 at 00:45 |
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Trump is nominated republican presidential candidate.
Jesus Christ, there's 318 million of you lot, and Clinton and Trump are the best you can do? It's like being frozen to the tracks while a train is hurtling towards you. There'll be nukes and napalm everywhere! |
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American Politics the 2016 edition
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zappaholic wrote: