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Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 08 2015 at 07:45
Yep, you can route in audio from a guitar BUT it'll sound awful. Line level voltage. The synth expects +5v to -5v. There ARE some converters available.
There are also fretless 6 string electric guitars, by the way. ;-)
With regards to "an analogue synth can be played with a ribbon controller", it certainly can, and it can also be played with a keyboard. Any non digital instrument is analogue, you could, say, tune a piano in non standard tuning. Piano, hmmm, keyboard. ;-) There are musical scales developed with more than the standard 12 notes. And keyboards to suit.
Matter of fact, you can do anything you want with an analogue synth, there are no rules, after all, just guidelines. I'm driven away from ribbon controllers as they tend to make instruments sound like theremins. It limits, rather than enhances, them. But there are times when you actually want to get that sound. I'd just rather not have it all the time. ;-)
You pays your money, you takes your choice, after all !
OR you can just turn the GLIDE / Portamento up and achieve much the same effect using a manual keyboard. Nearly. ;-)
One of the problems I have with music forums (and a lot of musicians) (mainly classically trained ones) is that they tend to assume that there is a "right way" to do things - or a hierarchy of what is good or bad, or what's better than something else. "Band A vs Band B - which is better ? " - this really gets me ... irritated. It's art. You can't measure or quantify it. Unless you're a professional musician or actually wrote the piece, all you have is an opinion. Well, everyone has an opinion. ;-) So I'll defend Weeping Elf's decision to use a ribbon controller on his (theoretical) synth and anyone elses' right to not use one.... as the mood suits.
But that's the great thing about modulars. If you can't look at one and see the creative possibilities......
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Posted: December 08 2015 at 10:48
I have to admit that I don't have any practical experience with modular synths. Hence, all my musing about them, including the (in)appropriateness of keyboards vs. ribbon controllers, are purely theoretical and not "blemished" by practice, though I have been talking about such things with a friend who does have a (self-built) modular synth - and that one indeed doesn't have a keyboard for the reasons I stated. That guy puts great importance in that he is a synthesizer player, not a keyboards player. However, he doesn't play progressive rock, nor any other kind of rock music, but experimental music that is hard to pigeonhole.
... brought to you by the Weeping Elf
"What does Elvish rock music sound like?" - "Yes."
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 373
Posted: December 09 2015 at 14:37
Davesax1965 wrote:
Hi Weeping Elf - ahh yes, "Experimental music".
90% of all people who buy a modular are not musicians.... they tend to make "experimental music". Draw your own conclusions. ;-)
Yep. This may be the case because a modular synth is not really a very useful instrument when you are going to do anything a layperson would recognize as "music", as opposed to "strange noises". It tells a lot that the historical development of synthesizers quickly moved away from the big modular systems to less flexible but more easily handled (in terms of both moving and playing the thing!) units such as the Minimoog, and on to polyphonic digital synthesizers. The modular synth geek friend I mentioned considers himself rather a "sound sculptor" than a "musician", and I think he is a quite typical case.
Myself, I sometimes feel tempted to acquire a modular synth, but then I realize how little use I could make of it in my band. The digital synth I have is much better suited to my needs as a progressive rock musician.
... brought to you by the Weeping Elf
"What does Elvish rock music sound like?" - "Yes."
Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 10 2015 at 03:46
I guess I'm a bit more conventional in my approach, which is sort of "Tangerine Dream o'clock". :-)
Bit of work last night - two Doefper Dark Time sequencers bolted together in a common case, synchronised together. This will allow me to run sequences together on two synths simultaneously.
This all goes into a mixer. The modular can output audio from various points in the system, so I've also created Mixing Desk Nightmare. If we do a live gig, the technicians will probably attempt to strangle us. ;-)
Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 10 2015 at 03:47
"This may be the case because a modular synth is not really a very useful instrument when you are going to do anything a layperson would recognize as "music""
Tangerine Dream ? ELP ? ;-)
"It tells a lot that the historical development of synthesizers quickly moved away from the big modular systems to less flexible but more easily handled (in terms of both moving and playing the thing!) units such as the Minimoog, and on to polyphonic digital synthesizers. "
Well, the technology changed. As modular systems were (a) ruinously expensive and (b) very difficult to use, companies like ARP and Moog produced "normalised" synths such as the Minimoog and ARP2600. These suited the average "keyboard player in the street" but didn't have the flexibility of a modular - as well as the limitations. Poly digital synths are fine, but I find just playing presets.... soulless. Yes, you can mess around with presets, but most keyboard players... don't.
A lot of people seem to feel the same way, that something was lost when analogue synths were killed off by digital, hence the latest analogue revolution, which has been going on since the mid 1990s. That, I think, speaks a lot as well.
As for "a digital keyboard suits me as a prog rock keyboard player", well !! Great. I'm much more retro in my approach to prog rock. Horses for courses, of course - nothing is right or wrong, it's the end effect which counts. I wouldn't suggest everyone adopted analogue - even with modern add ons such as MIDI - or even thought about a modular synth, but. It suits some people. ;-)
Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 10 2015 at 08:04
As a PS, if you don't want the complexity of a modular, a lot of analogue synth manufacturers produce "normalised" synths - the Arturia Minibrute being a good example. I have one of these, plus a Korg MS20. These go for virtually nothing - under £300 at the moment (special offer). Good start for those getting into analogue so you get used to what a VCO, VCF, ADSR, LFO are......
Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 12 2015 at 05:13
"Here's one I made earlier"
This is the sequencer section. Two Doepfer Dark Times bolted together and synchronised. The audio is from something else, using a Minibrute (see above).
The output from this goes into two synths. The synth audio output is then fed into an effects rack and from there into a mixer. From the mixer, it goes either to a mixing desk or directly to the PC.
Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 22 2015 at 09:12
And, after some fun making my own ribbon cables - an internal bus system for the synth. Input is the green lead (and battery) on the lower left - the signal is routed internally around the synth (see sparkly lights)(it's Christmas) - no need for tons of patch cables.
Extend the ribbon cable through the back of the case and it can be used to feed the bus system of a second add on synth case. ;-)
Joined: February 02 2004
Location: South England
Status: Offline
Points: 14693
Posted: December 22 2015 at 11:27
Davesax1965 wrote:
It's about 40% complete but will be making basic noises by the New Year.
From a technical perspective, it will contain seven oscillators, five low frequency oscillators, three to four filters and two to three amplifiers. So it certainly knocks spots off any of the old Moog systems from the 1970's.
(Awaits technical furore from "Moog fans" who'll just cut and paste stats...... ;-) )
You really need to speak to Tom Szakaly from Noddy's Puncture, based in Rochdale:
Joined: May 23 2013
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Points: 2839
Posted: December 23 2015 at 06:34
Thanks, Jim, I'll look him up. That's a 5U format synth, by the way. Modulars come in all sizes - Eurorack (which is what I'm making) is 3U, which is.... smaller. (duh)
I grew up a few miles south of Rochdale, by the way. ;-)
Joined: February 02 2004
Location: South England
Status: Offline
Points: 14693
Posted: December 24 2015 at 05:58
Tom's band is an ELP tribute, but a serious cut above most of the ilk - he's also a keyboard engineer (rebuilt the one above virtually from scratch using original parts) & good friend of Keith Emerson, who tends to 'borrow' keyboards from Tom on a regular basis:
Joined: January 14 2016
Location: Nashville TN US
Status: Offline
Points: 7
Posted: January 14 2016 at 19:57
Oh hi. This is sduck (Steve) from over on Muffwiggler. Cool to see a convo about modulars here - long time lurker, first time poster sort of thing- although it's been quite a while since I lurked actually.
- all built by myself, except for the MOTM 650. Kind of an old picture actually, now there's a row of euro stuff (which you can see the start of top left), a TTSH, a Buchla music easel, etc etc. It's always expanding - such is the way of modular synths.
Joined: May 19 2013
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Status: Offline
Points: 554
Posted: January 15 2016 at 09:53
sduck wrote:
This is my modular, all built by myself, except for the MOTM 650. Kind of an old picture actually, now there's a row of euro stuff (which you can see the start of top left), a TTSH, a Buchla music easel, etc etc. It's always expanding - such is the way of modular synths.
Nice system, must be great fun to play!
I have a modular but it's much smaller than the other ones pictured in this thread, only has about ten modules.
There are so many interesting modules available and always new modules being released too. Often really hard to choose which modules to get. And unfortunately my disposable income is limited.
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Davesax1965 wrote:
