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GrahamK
Forum Newbie
Joined: May 02 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 26
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:25 |
Prog isnt popular anymore for the simple reason that music does not exist in a vacuum. Popular music is a reflection of the social climate of the era it comes from. The punk movement pretty much ended progs popularity simply because it was striking a chord with the disenfranchised youth. England at the time was in turmoil politically and as much as I love Jon Andersons lyrics the "peace and love" mentality just wasnt reflecting the up-coming generations angst. Prog was a victim of its own loftiness. Many of the bands at the time started to get so pretentious that they even began isolating their own fan bases.
If you look at popular culture of any era you will see a correlation between it and the music of the time (Generation Xers and the self absorbed Grunge era is a prime example).
You cannot measure someone's intelligence by the music they listen to. That is a ridiculous arguement. I own several AC/DC albums...hardly the worlds most musically complex band. It benefits you to listen to all musical forms, from the most simplistic to the most complex.
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Syntharachnid
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 05 2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 703
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:28 |
Fantômas wrote:
Public Image Ltd. IF FAR MORE INTELLIGENT than Yes, and more inventive as well.
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Ouch, it burns!!!
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comicbookguy
Forum Groupie
Joined: December 08 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 46
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:50 |
HeirToRuin wrote:
Look at it this way.
If the record companies, VH1, MTV, and _________ decided to heavily market prog music, then people would like it. However, record companies would rather have an easy sell. It's difficult to pass off "rebellious" music that is full of theory and intricacy.
Besides, most guys would rather stare at Britney's cleavage and midriff.
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Theres a bit of truth there too,large Record Companies consider it a risk paying for the distribution and promotion of artists that write/perform and have a large say in the production process of their music. They consider investments in those artists to be a risk. RC execs like to have a stranglehold and control on the image,sound and overall package of their product. Consequently, they pimp as many Bland corporate teenwank puppets through every form of media they can for the maximum amount of financial return.
Like most, I get more cynical as I get older, but in a way I quite like the way that the music I love has been unhyped and left alone. I dread the day when DJ's 'fashonably' f**k about with samples of 'Suppers Ready' to a dance beat. In fact even though I don't dislike some of the Scissor Sisters stuff that version of 'Comfortably Numb' made me sick to the stomach. So its probably just as well prog is not that popularIMO.
Edited by comicbookguy
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abyssyinfinity
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 13 2005
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 443
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:53 |
Where's the problem about...?
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Guests
Forum Guest Group
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 18:55 |
abyssyinfinity wrote:
Where's the problem about...? |
what problem???
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abyssyinfinity
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 13 2005
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 443
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:00 |
The problem about prog is not popular...
IMO is not a right question, prog is for definition not popular, or maybe will be popular in 2112 A.D....
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fractal
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 16 2005
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 120
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:11 |
Exactly... How can something experimental and different become popular?
Popular (or pop) is by definition something apropriate and adequate,
often repetitive that pleases the majority. Progressive rock is nothing
like that, otherwise it ceases to be "progressive."
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Klaatu Barada Nikto!
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21383
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:22 |
Borealis wrote:
I also think that if prog would be popular, a lot of us wouldn't listen to it anymore. We like to be original. I always liked to, and I always will.
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That is a serious question ... are you a prog fan because it makes you something special, a musical snob or at least a person that seems to have more (aquired) taste than others, or are you in it because of the music?
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Hibou
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 24 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 250
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:23 |
Borealis: I think our opinions converge about music (and prog) being a form of art which not everyone is born to appreciate. You need at least a minimum of musical sensibility to understand of what’s going on. If you have no ear for music and have to use your willpower alone to try and ‘get it’, it becomes a sterile intellectual exercice, not a pleasurable experience.
About progsters being smarter: many of us who consider ourselves elitists would appear very dense to those who are as passionate about other forms of art, such as the visual arts or poetry, for example.
As for prog’s lack of popularity: during the 60s and early 70s, mainstream radio merely “tolerated” prog because it was the fad. Yes, it was cool to say you liked Jimi Hendrix… even if you needed a broomstick-size reefer to get off on his music. Indeed, many radio DJs, reporters and record store owners couldn’t make heads or tail of it – and frankly all breathed a sigh of relief when it took a plunge.
We should all thank the internet for picking up prog just as it was starting to sing its swan song.
(sorry for my ranting: like most of you on this site, I'd love prog to be more popular, even for all the wrong reasons if it comes to that. But let's not hold our breath).
Lise
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[IMG]http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b311/Progueuse/Album.jpg">
Gene Police: You!! Out of the pool!
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MikeEnRegalia
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 22 2005
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 21383
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:27 |
HeirToRuin wrote:
Look at it this way.
If the record companies, VH1, MTV, and _________ decided to heavily market prog music, then people would like it. |
I don't think so. Prog music requires active listening. The music they currently play requires no brain activity at all. There's no difference between watching a talkshow and listening to Mariah Carey.
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Fantômas
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 15 2005
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 1859
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:33 |
Dustin101585 wrote:
Fantômas wrote:
xhamasaki wrote:
edit: seriously whats your problem? Maybe you need to go outside or something, or maybe grow up since youre only 15
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My problem is that you started the topic in a very arrogant way. How that is irritant... And I'm not 15, I'm 16...
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Want a tissue? |
Want a funny joke?
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And above all, is punk
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Fantômas
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 15 2005
Location: Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 1859
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:33 |
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And above all, is punk
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Syntharachnid
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 05 2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 703
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 19:57 |
I wish people could just get along...
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HeirToRuin
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 30 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 454
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 20:07 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
Prog music requires active listening. The music they currently play
requires no brain activity at all. There's no difference between
watching a talkshow and listening to Mariah Carey. |
I know a couple of "scene kids" that are into all this emo Dashboard
Confessional and Thursday and "hardcore" stuff such as Norma Jean and
From Autumn to Ashes.
For some reason, these kids really look up to me. I played some
Yes (Gates of Delirium) for them, and they loved it. These people
are basically this generations punk rock They seemed to accept it
more because it was coming from me. That's sort of a suggestion
that if things you look up to showcase something, you tend to take it
more seriously. I mean...if radio did start playing longer songs,
people wouldn't have a choice.
If the music business would promote these types of artists on TV and
radio the way that they do Britney Spears and Train, then more people
would be exposed and enough people listen to the radio that it would
catch on. It can't be a worse idea than Vanilla Ice.
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King of Loss
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 21 2005
Location: Boston, MA
Status: Offline
Points: 16765
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 20:12 |
Syntharachnid wrote:
I wish people could just get along... |
+1
And stop being such ignorant bitches.
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gdub411
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 24 2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3484
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 20:44 |
xhamasaki wrote:
Why isn't it more popular? It really is probably the only truly creative, innovative and revolutionary form of music, is it because people are just shallow and stupid? I don't get it. I find it somewhat, I don't know how to say it, funny?- that the people that listen to prog generally have a much higher intellect and ability to understand things than people that listen to very mainstream and MTV kinds of music. Is prog really only for intelligent people? What do you guys think?
Edit: Im not trying to say that prog fans are smarter that other fans, I'm saying that I think you have to be at least a LITTLE bit smart to get into it, which unfortunately IS a factor in why it's not popular.
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Do not worry...i try my best to bell curve that intelligence somewhat.
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xhamasaki
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 13 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 128
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 20:50 |
Do you guys think that mainstream music of tomorrow will end up taking influences from the prog music of today? That would make the music that we listen to truly "progressive"
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Borealis
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 06 2005
Location: Neutral Zone
Status: Offline
Points: 599
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 20:55 |
MikeEnRegalia wrote:
Borealis wrote:
I also think that if prog would be popular, a lot of us wouldn't listen to it anymore. We like to be original. I always liked to, and I always will.
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That is a serious question ... are you a prog fan because it makes you something special, a musical snob or at least a person that seems to have more (aquired) taste than others, or are you in it because of the music?
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Exception to music. I'd listen to real music even if the whole world was listening to it. I am not listening to this only because I'd feel over the others, that's stupid.
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Vive le Québec libre!...
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Borealis
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 06 2005
Location: Neutral Zone
Status: Offline
Points: 599
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 21:06 |
xhamasaki wrote:
Do you guys think that mainstream music of tomorrow will end up taking influences from the prog music of today? That would make the music that we listen to truly "progressive" |
Huh?... I don't understand, I guess you're too intelligent for me...
Seriously, I think no. I doubt prog (or jazz, or post rock, or any 'real music') will ever get an influence on mainstream music of the future. The music industry is based on pretty simple, easy to listen music with good image of the band members. And I guess that's what people who watch MTV wants. Like most people here said, prog is too 'complex'.
There should be more radio and TV show about prog music though.
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Vive le Québec libre!...
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Bionic Commando
Forum Groupie
Joined: June 09 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 71
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Posted: June 16 2005 at 21:19 |
Would you guys really want it to be popular? I mean, honestly. Seeing Threshold on MTV would possibly make me feel sick.
If the thread-starter is referring to Progressive Rock. I don't understand you. Bands like Yes, Genesis, Pink Floyd and Emerson, Lake and Palmer are all very popular. Each band has sold millions of albums individually.
Other, more recent forms of Progressive music don't sell for a few reasons. A lot of bands don't release singles, meaning they get no air-play on the radio which makes them less popular. Others are on record labels like Insideout, or Magna Carta who are big in the Progressive world, yes. But not big enough to really promote/distribute millions of albums on the same level as say Sony, Geffen or Electra. I think it's mostly down to the label. Take Queensryche for example: If they'd been on Insideout they wouldn't have sold a quarter of as many records but since they were on EMI/Manhattan, Empire, Operation: Mindcrime and Promised Land sold like hot cakes in the US. Hell, just look at Tribe which was released on 'Metal Is'. Didn't sell well at all. Then again, it wasn't that great an album either...
I think I can understand where the guy is coming from on technicalities, and whether you like to admit it or not: He's on the right tracks. However he implemented his points in completely the wrong way. You don't need intelligence to listen to Prog, but it's certainly not easy listening either. A lot of the music is quite complex, and not exactly radio-friendly meaning a lot of people simply can't sit and listen to long, intricate songs. A lot of people are either trend-whores who focus predominately on image or they simply have different tastes altogether.
Whoever mentioned DT being popular because of Labrie and how he looks. Oh puh-lease. I, and many others here i'm sure listened to Dream Theater and their albums without having probably ever seen the band. Bear in mind, in the UK they are virtually unknown. Hell, after I watched the "Pull me Under" and "Lie" videos recently I almost laughed. That designer stuble just doesn't do the trick i'm afraid. Ultimate cheese.
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