Van or Von??

Bonnek wrote: That other Belgian here is too fast for me

I thought the only fast Belgian was called Eddy.

Flandern/Belgia/Netherland/Friesland is all confusing

Larger than a station wagon, smaller than an SUV. 

someone_else wrote: Bonnek wrote: [QUOTE=Dean>The band name is a complete misspelling anyway, the Generator of static electricity that bears the name was designed by Robert Van de Graaff, an american of Dutch heritage.  Why is the "V" is capitalised and the "de" not? Is this another nuance? I'm beginning to suspect things aren't all that consistent. <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"></span> [/QUOTE>The official rule (for the Netherlands at least) is that you don't use capitals is the first name is given (or abbreviated).So:mister Robert van de Graafmister R. van de GraaffIf however the first name is not provided then the first letter of the family name prefixes must be capitalized.Hence:mister Van de GraaffSo if you've seen it as Robert Van de Graaff then he probably forgot how to spell his own name from being American for too long. PS. I had to correct the above 3 times as I kept spelling Van de Graaf with one f. 2 ff's just doesn't make much sense at all in modern Dutch! Some Dutch people, even a PA collab, may not agree with this. Even the variety "van de(r) Graaff" occurs now and then.

True, I meant 'Dutch' as in 'Flemish'. We don't double-f , too archaic

Bonnek wrote: We moved quite a bit off the Beethoven topic now

Which is good because this topic never made any sense.

Sean Trane wrote: Moogtron III wrote: Hehe, your memory serves you well, Hugues, and yes, Bonnek meant me. Yes, I'm a crypto-Belgian, I'm disguised as a Belgian  I used to lead youth camps in Africa, representing Belgium among countries like the Netherlands, South-Africa, Germany and Rwanda, singing the Belgian national hymn (very un-Belgian to know that one, even former prime minister Yves Leterme couldn't distinguish it from the French Marseillaise), showing Belgian beer, making Belgian chocolate mousse, introducing Belgian comic strips (Smurfs, Tintin), and big was the astonishment once when I said that I was not a Belgian at all, but had a Dutch passport.  You, Hugues were the true Belgian (though I remember that you lived in Toronto as well) who worked in the Netherlands, Petten if I recall well, and I was the Dutchman who was living in Belgium.  Belgium a better land, huh? Well, what a coincidence that I was just sipping from my Belgian beer, so that's spot on The beer is definitely better, the pils, the trappist, everything!  And for the rest... there are pros and cons in both of the countries. I like the bourgondy lifestyle of the Belgians, the fact that there still is a lot of youth working, like scouts, chiro and stuff... but I do prefer the directness and the openness of the Dutch, well, some of the Dutch. Both countries have their strong and weak points. I come from Rotterdam, my family comes from the utmost northern part of Groningen, but sometimes I hear something slightly northern in my own accent.   Ludwig is one of the best composers ever, BTW. I'm still astonished by his 5th Symphony. It sounds so modern, like pop music. On the other hand, some of his later string quartets are like RIO, or should I say SIO? Symphonic in opposition  Back to my Jupiler...    Touché, my friend   And yes, Holland is a dream place for kids and cyclist (though you should NEVER leave home on bike with the wind in your back.... coz you're not sure you'll be able to come back). Byt yeah, some Dutch can be a bit too blunt... but that's allright... you know where you stand with them.   Actually I work in West Fruesland, but spoken Northern Dutch dialects (including Frison) always made it difficult for me to adapt... Though I'm now able to guess in 50% of the cases what the second half of the four syllable word is... (don't ask me to write it (ABN, Flemish or Frison) though From Gronigen, uh?? In the news this w-e, I saw the near-riots in the demos  (this seems so un-Dutch) against exploiting gas pockets because they're causing mini-earthquake (125 last year)... Living close to Bergen, where they registered only two, they're about to reuse the old gas pockets and use them as storage tanks   SIO   Tonight, it'll be a Chimay Blue

someone_else wrote: Moogtron III wrote: [QUOTE=Sean Trane> [QUOTE=Moogtron III> Hehe, your memory serves you well, Hugues, and yes, Bonnek meant me. Yes, I'm a crypto-Belgian, I'm disguised as a Belgian  I used to lead youth camps in Africa, representing Belgium among countries like the Netherlands, South-Africa, Germany and Rwanda, singing the Belgian national hymn (very un-Belgian to know that one, even former prime minister Yves Leterme couldn't distinguish it from the French Marseillaise), showing Belgian beer, making Belgian <span style="line-height: 1.2;">chocolate </span><span style="line-height: 1.2;">mousse, introducing Belgian comic strips (Smurfs, Tintin), and big was the astonishment once when I said that I was not a Belgian at all, but had a Dutch passport. </span> You, Hugues were the true Belgian (though I remember that you lived in Toronto as well) who worked in the Netherlands, Petten if I recall well, and I was the Dutchman who was living in Belgium. Belgium a better land, huh? Well, what a coincidence that I was just sipping from my Belgian beer, so that's spot on The beer is definitely better, the pils, the trappist, everything!  And for the rest... there are pros and cons in both of the countries. I like the bourgondy lifestyle of the Belgians, the fact that there still is a lot of youth working, like scouts, chiro and stuff... but I do prefer the directness and the openness of the Dutch, well, some of the Dutch. Both countries have their strong and weak points. I come from Rotterdam, my family comes from the utmost northern part of Groningen, but sometimes I hear something slightly northern in my own accent.   Ludwig is one of the best composers ever, BTW. I'm still astonished by his 5th Symphony. It sounds so modern, like pop music. On the other hand, some of his later string quartets are like RIO, or should I say SIO? Symphonic in opposition Back to my Jupiler...  [/QUOTE>   Touché, my friend   And yes, Holland is a dream place for kids and cyclist (though you should NEVER leave home on bike with the wind in your back.... coz you're not sure you'll be able to come back). Byt yeah, some Dutch can be a bit too blunt... but that's allright... you know where you stand with them.   Actually I work in West Fruesland, but spoken Northern Dutch dialects (including Frison) always made it difficult for me to adapt... Though I'm now able to guess in 50% of the cases what the second half of the four syllable word is... (don't ask me to write it (ABN, Flemish or Frison) though From Gronigen, uh?? In the news this w-e, I saw the near-riots in the demos  (this seems so un-Dutch) against exploiting gas pockets because they're causing mini-earthquake (125 last year)... Living close to Bergen, where they registered only two, they're about to reuse the old gas pockets and use them as storage tanks   SIO   Tonight, it'll be a Chimay Blue     [/QUOTE> Yes, cycling in Holland... Indeed, we can put that at the advantages of Belgium, the lack of heavy wind, but the cycling paths in Belgium, hmmm well...  Groningen: my family left at the right time, I suppose   The dialects: I couldn't understand anything from the West Flanders dialect when I got there. East Flanders is much easier now, and now looking forward to hearing a Brabant accent, or no accent at all... Chimay blue is my favorite trappist  Despite the sometimes heavy wind, I can hardly imagine a country where biking is more pleasant than here in Holland. It is one of my favourite activities. I yearn for biking long distances again when the days lengthen and the temperatures rise. Of all the accents I find that of Brabant the hardest to stand, leaving even plat-Uteregs behind. I wonder why anyone can look forward to hear it... Chimay Blue is an excellent trappist. Ever tried Rochefort 10°?

You're probably right about nature around Utrecht, and I'm probably too negative. Maybe you made more kilometers on the bike than I did, so you got more out of it than I did  Or I was just spoilt  

@Moogtron III: It is not a shame to have less kilometers on the bike than I have. When I go out for a bike ride, I make 60-90 km when I'm with my wife and 80-120 when on my own. And once a year I make a real long one (170-190 km). And I don't use a racing bike, just a conventional one. During the winter months (October-March) I just go out occasionally for 40-70 km.
There are new biking routes in the Netherlands since 2008 (knooppuntenroutes) which I use frequently to create routes throughout the region.

-o0o-

@Sean Trane: I think the infrastructure of roads in the Netherlands is way better than in Belgium. Moreover, Belgian villages are often stretched along one or just a few streets, so it is easy to pass unnoticed from one village to another. In the Netherlands, the habitat spaces have sharp bounds, like Alkmaar: once you're no longer in, you're really out. Only in the northeast (Drenthe) there are some villages that are actually streets.
And about the beer: this is just a matter of taste. Unlike Chimay Blue, Rochefort 10 is not representative for a Trappist, but it is full, strong (11,3% ABV) and rich. I have to try the 6 and the 8 yet, but 10 comes close to perfection imho .


Edited by someone_else - January 23 2014 at 03:10