Flower Kings Appreciation Thread

As much as I love Garden of Dreams, or The Whirlwind, I find 20-25 minutes is long enough for a good prog epic. Time needs to be put aside to listen to the real massive epics, and many times, they're not so great. I've listened to Echolyn's "Mei" which is about an hour long, and it doesn't do much for me.

M27Barney wrote: Hmm - An english band - that has produced 12 Studio albums from 1971 - 2012...wonder how come I've never had these brought to my attention - Tom would hate them - Double mellotrons I see - no mention pf a saxophonist - looks like I may go for a litle toe in the water - "A tab in the Ocean" is the highest rated ?? Or should I go for the compilation - Nektar....Hope they blow my gruddies off....coz thats a helluva back catalogue to catch up on...

Edited by dennismoore - April 05 2013 at 15:58

dennismoore wrote: M27Barney wrote: Hmm - An english band - that has produced 12 Studio albums from 1971 - 2012...wonder how come I've never had these brought to my attention - Tom would hate them - Double mellotrons I see - no mention pf a saxophonist - looks like I may go for a litle toe in the water - "A tab in the Ocean" is the highest rated ?? Or should I go for the compilation - Nektar....Hope they blow my gruddies off....coz thats a helluva back catalogue to catch up on...   Why hasn't Nektar been brought to your attention? Are you by any chance, the Duke of Kent?  Hmm, why did it take you 35 years to move out of your mum's flat? These are questions that will probably never get answered, sigh....   Like I said:   Just    Buy    Recycled.   http://www.amazon.com/Recycled-Deluxe-Edition-Nektar/dp/B008NEVPJ0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1365194158&sr=8-1&keywords=nektar+recycled   Then.... get the remastered Remember The Future.   Nektar CDs have been sold for decades but from inferior generation masters.  Only the 2002 Nektar aproved remasters were sourced from low gen master tapes.   As far as Tab in the Ocean being most popular; polls are for bloody idiots, don't get me started on popularity.  Plus, the "Tab" fans who voted may have never heard Recycled or RTF...I can tell you that Recycled is Roye Albrighton's(Roye is the composer/singer/lead guitarist in Nektar) favorite recording. It is certainly Nektar at their creative & sonic peak and has Larry Fast brilliantly adding keys on it. Tab in the Ocean is early and is not recorded that well, get Recycled & Remember The Future, first.   Don't make me say it a 3rd time or this will get to a whole new level. Right.     -edit-  Barney: if you are low on $$$, this might do in a pinch: http://www.amazon.com/Retrospektive-1969-1980-Nektar/dp/B0052EV5Z8/ref=sr_1_5?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1365195221&sr=1-5&keywords=nektar   I believe all songs are sourced from the recent remasters. It has most of Recycled on it and half of Remember The Future, and obviously a sampling of all their stuff.

M27Barney wrote: Just bought Recycled - deluxe edition - £6 from amazon - inc P&P bargain !!!

Barney, I am really glad for you.  I bought Recycled from CD Japan in the early 90's for 35.00 and it was a
bad quality version.  I had to wait until 2002 to get the Nektar Approved Remaster for 15.00.  I bought the album
in 1978...   I don't know why Nektar fly under the radar, some prog bands are sadly second tier, Nektar are certainly not.
I've got the SACD of the 4.1 surround sound remaster of Remember The Future, and playing it is truly a heavenly experience.  I think you will really enjoy Recycled.

Some updates from Roine at the TFK Yahoo Group about the new album:

Roine Stolt wrote:   Fact is - working on this new album -   my gut feel is that those of you who liked the weirdness   interludes and the cinematic effects and ambiences will find   this new album interesting.     I could be wrong - but it has some superspacy stoner droner jams that resembles Santanas Caravanserai   and still plenty of catchy, classic symph prog and also somewhat heavy   riffy sections.   The names Black Sabbath and Dimmu Borgir were both mentioned more than once in the strudio   but also Queen, Rush, James Bond and albums like Ummagumma and Atom Heart Mother.   That's our weird musical environment - but be aware that we are still in "construction mode" so   these are all blueprints for what's to come - this album is still a shapeshifter - day by day.     It will however not be a double album - but if you like adventurous prog - and fearless genre bending -   this may be it.     Roine.

dennismoore wrote: darkshade wrote: As much as I love Garden of Dreams, or The Whirlwind, I find 20-25 minutes is long enough for a good prog epic. Time needs to be put aside to listen to the real massive epics, and many times, they're not so great. I've listened to Echolyn's "Mei" which is about an hour long, and it doesn't do much for me.   I must agree with my esteemed young colleague from New Jersey.  Just running about in space with no purpose, (like some of the longer winded stuff) doesn't make for a musical good time. I love Transatlantic's 1st 2 CDs of epics, but Whirlwind is an example of the musical babbling that I speak of.  I can't get through that song and when the end refrain brings a repeat of an already overplayed theme, I wanna strangle everybody in the world who doesn't own a copy of Space Revolver(for obvious reasons...)   My worst live concert experience, by far was being turtured by a wind-bag of an epic by Echolyn at Nearfest in 2002, maybe it was the track "Mei".  I have never felt so exhausted or tortured by live music before.  Example:   Pink Floyd: Dogs YES: CTTE ELP: KarnEvil9 pt 1&2   These songs are not that long and don't wear out their welcome.   You old windbag supporters need to hear my edited version of Garden of Dreams and you'll see what I mean.   The Flower Kings would have had a much larger fan base had they editied their songs a bit. 5-10 mins=OK, 10-15-20 mins=OK. Song length of 25 minutes and longer = 15 radical "derranged" fans(yep, "us" guys here in TFK forum.) People; it is still rock-n-roll. Only complex stuff like classical with all its movements & modulations can venture into more than 30 minutes and get away with it.  You can only do so much in rock before it gets repetitive.   God Bless the Editors!   Everybody needs one!

Sorry Dennis, but here's where we part ways.  Garden of Dreams was edited for live performance (making it about 45 minutes long), and as much as I loved it I couldn't help but be disappointed the first time I heard this edited version.  I find the full 58 minutes of it to be absolutely perfect and the finest prog epic ever created.  I wouldn't change a single thing about it.

Whirlwind, on the other hand, I could go either way.  I've come to appreciate it as it is, but still find the 12 minute final part to drag a bit and I find it a pretty anti-climactic finish to such a long piece.  Though to be honest, I tend to see it as more like The Wall or something along those lines........a concept album where the songs all segue and some musical and lyrical themes get repeated.  I don't really see it as a single "song".

Mei, however, is brilliant and a masterpiece..........all 49 minutes of it.  I wish I had been at that Nearfest to see it.  Friends of mine who were there had various opinions of it, running from "perfect masterpiece" to "boring and drawn out".  In any case, I love the piece and thing it hangs together as a single "song" far better than even Garden Of Dreams (which is really a suite of songs, rather than a single "song"........just like The Whirlwind).  But GoD is still my favorite prog "epic" of all time.  Frankly I think Close to the Edge, at 18 minutes, is a bit drawn out and could have been shortened without loosing anything.  Just my opinion, of course.

For TA, I find both epics on the second album to be overlong and not that enjoyable (both would have made killer 16 minute tracks..........in fact, Duel stops being enjoyable for me at right about the 16 minute mark).

 

I've been feeling like putting on some TFK soon. Maybe even some related stuff too. The weather around here, along with the recent discussions here, is really giving me the itch. I wonder which album I should throw on first...

darkshade wrote: I've been feeling like putting on some TFK soon. Maybe even some related stuff too. The weather around here, along with the recent discussions here, is really giving me the itch. I wonder which album I should throw on first...

I listened to the Back In The World album last week.  Still a very good album, though not a top 5 for me.

I've got Retropolis and Stardust We Are in the car right now.  So it's the 90's stuff for me this week (along with Steven Wilson's Raven, the new Kaipa, and a couple Glass Hammer albums).

infandous wrote: darkshade wrote: I've been feeling like putting on some TFK soon. Maybe even some related stuff too. The weather around here, along with the recent discussions here, is really giving me the itch. I wonder which album I should throw on first... I listened to the Back In The World album last week.  Still a very good album, though not a top 5 for me. I've got Retropolis and Stardust We Are in the car right now.  So it's the 90's stuff for me this week (along with Steven Wilson's Raven, the new Kaipa, and a couple Glass Hammer albums).

Nice. I've always liked Back In the World over TFK and Retropolis. I can't decide! (choosing what TFK song/album to put on always has to be the perfect choice for me, I don't know why.)

darkshade wrote: infandous wrote: darkshade wrote: I've been feeling like putting on some TFK soon. Maybe even some related stuff too. The weather around here, along with the recent discussions here, is really giving me the itch. I wonder which album I should throw on first... I listened to the Back In The World album last week.  Still a very good album, though not a top 5 for me. I've got Retropolis and Stardust We Are in the car right now.  So it's the 90's stuff for me this week (along with Steven Wilson's Raven, the new Kaipa, and a couple Glass Hammer albums). Nice. I've always liked Back In the World over TFK and Retropolis. I can't decide! (choosing what TFK song/album to put on always has to be the perfect choice for me, I don't know why.)

Well, Retropolis is my favorite FK album of them all, so I don't agree   Between Back In The World and TFK, I'd probably prefer Back In The World........but it's kind of a toss up there.