Prog clichés

HackettFan wrote: A series of very accessible commercial hooks strung together with irrelevant transitions into one long epic. I'm thinking of Nektar - Recycled. Recycled is a bit of a guilty pleasure for me, but Journey to the Center of the Eye is an epic from the same group that manages to spare us that sort of commercial shlock masquerading as sophistication.

rogerthat wrote: I don't think happy music by itself is necessarily shallow though I know that idea is frequently tossed about in Western art generally.  But I too would find a near complete absence of pathos in the work of an artist rather strange and tough to take very seriously.  It is hard to not find anything at all in the human condition that evokes grief or anger.

Edited by brainstormer - March 24 2013 at 21:18

Earendil wrote: The worst cliche in progressive metal is that screechy keyboard solo that always comes in following the extensive guitar solo right before it.  It takes it the step too far and it shows up in so many bands.  Jordan Rudess especially.

 He did tone it down on the last album. In fact, it seems he's been cutting back on it since Systematic Chaos.

Prog cliche?



How about over-analysis by its fans?

Jim Garten wrote: Prog cliche? How about over-analysis by its fans?

brainstormer wrote: rogerthat wrote: I don't think happy music by itself is necessarily shallow though I know that idea is frequently tossed about in Western art generally.  But I too would find a near complete absence of pathos in the work of an artist rather strange and tough to take very seriously.  It is hard to not find anything at all in the human condition that evokes grief or anger.   Yes, but those of us, like myself, who do feel extreme grief or anger at the human condition realizes that staying there does nothing to change the situation.  In fact, it becomes "resisting evil with evil" which we are told not to do (ok, by Christ), but resist evil with good" (prog).  Staying in my grief or anger is physically damaging, and science proves that.  So, when all these people stay in negative art, to me, it's not a sign of sophistication, it's like being anti-science.  That's a different type of Pollyanna attitude.

I like John Wetton's thoughts on the prog idiom:

Progfan2010 wrote: I´d say a cliche in Prog are those unjustified, very intense coming from nowhere Instrumentals, just for the sake of making a Prog-sounding instrumental. Sounds fake. Prog is not meant to be Prog for sounding Prog, but for possessing certain qualities to it, like an intelligent songwriting. Starting a track with cheesy, funny sounding fast and changing tunes is not a characteristic Prog is proud about.

... and that's where the word "pretentious" comes in. I'm very much aware of the allergies some people around here have to that word, and some would simply explain it as a critic's word for bla-bla-bla-bla-bla-bla-... something bad ... mayhaps something they don't personally fancy. But if we put to use the definition of that word according to Merriam-Webster, it pretty much applies in the context Progfan2010 provided us with - to roughly put it, to adjust it to the context, meaning "unwarranted, uncalled-for, unjustified, excessive, focused on the skill rather than the musical essence".

Edited by Dayvenkirq - March 26 2013 at 13:20

cstack3 wrote: I like John Wetton's thoughts on the prog idiom: http://elephant-talk.com/wiki/Interview_with_John_Wetton_in_Big_Bang_Magazine "Everyone who wants to be progressive, in inverted comas, want to use mellotrons, Marshall amps and Rickenbacker basses, you know, it's all back to 1973, which is hardly progressive. So it's very much regressive. But it seems that progressive has become a generic term for a style of music which involves time changes, classical moods... "

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