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The Dark Elf View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2012 at 21:49
I give this thread a 1.5 rating. It's just a half-step up from banal. Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2012 at 22:08
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

An imperfect record can be a 5-star one, and a flawless record can be a 2-star. Rating systems don't account for this ... .
Like the PA rating system? How do you figure?
No, I mean the kind of personal rating methodologies people here tend toward.  As I said, like a point system.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 01:22
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by HarbouringTheSoul HarbouringTheSoul wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by HarbouringTheSoul HarbouringTheSoul wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

An imperfect record can be a 5-star one, and a flawless record can be a 2-star.
Can they? It seems pretty obvious to me that in a quality-based rating system, a flawless record must get the highest grade.
That's my point; are Lamb or Tarkus flawless records?  Absolutely not.  Are they 5-star records?   I have little doubt they are.
You're reversing my statement. The fact that every flawless record gets the highest grade does not mean that every record with the highest grade is flawless.
Music is not machinery or baked goods, but rather an offering of self-expression.   To apply mechanical or mathematic standards to music is not only daft but unethical.
OK. What if we were discussing the music of Swift or the Beaver and such? Would you still think it would be daft and unethical to rate their music (considering that it lacks all manners of sophistication ... that I know of)? Wink

Edited by Dayvenkirq - November 29 2012 at 01:24
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 01:32
^ I've heard a lot worse -
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 02:39
Originally posted by SolarLuna96 SolarLuna96 wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

An imperfect record can be a 5-star one, and a flawless record can be a 2-star.   Rating systems don't account for this and important things can be lost in translation.  


Thank you so much for saying this. I can't stand it when people will give something a lower rating because they do not see it as "a masterpiece". It all matters on how you interpret it which is why the overall rating of an album is complied of individuals' ratings.
  Nice statement !!
I'd like to think we all stay true to the site's guidelines for rating albums.  The overall 'score' we give an album is still personally judged by our own selves, we have an 'inbuilt system' with which we determine what an album does for us - it's our own individual perception of an album - a great example is National Health's debut album.  To me, it ticks all the right boxes to label it a 'masterpiece', but to many others, it may be a fairly average album.  Dave Stewart's fuzzed organ is pure bliss to my ears but obnoxious to many. I love Anglagard's stop/start approach, few bars of this, then let's fly off in this direction.  FANTASTIC !!  To certain folks, this just doesn't suit.  Personal taste counts for a lot in ratings.  No one person is right or wrong. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 05:27
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

I increasingly find rating standards to be trite and unnecessary--  'what do I think?' is my rating system.
Sorry for bothering you; I'm just curious about why you think so.
It reduces the process to numbers and criteria like a point system.   Music is an art form and ultimately should not be valued by how many songs are thought to be good or whether Dick Johnson had one fewer good solos this time than last.   It misses the point and misunderstands the creative process.   The odds of an artist releasing an album that is generally considered to be 'a masterpiece' are probably about a hundred to one, if not worse.   It isn't a contest, it's music.


Perfect. Clap
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 05:43
One word for each is enough - but I rather review than rate

Star - poor
StarStar - fair
StarStarStar - good
StarStarStarStar - excellent
StarStarStarStarStar - masterpiece
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 06:08
5 stars - As close as things come to perfect. 
4.5 stars - Very close to being a full-blown masterpiece, often not much difference between a 4.5 and a 5. 
4 stars - Relatively solid and excellent.
3.5 stars - Very good, but occasionally some slight clangers here and there maybe. 
3 stars - As others say, either has some good tracks with some bad ones, or is just inoffensive and relatively unspectacular. 
2.5 stars - Shows some strength in spots, but is mainly mediocre. 
2 stars - Little in there that's good, not completely bad though. 
1.5 stars - Most definitely not my thing. Could start to grate and annoy me a bit.
1 star - Bad. Avoid.
0.5 stars - Masochist material. 


Something like that. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 07:28
Originally posted by AtomicCrimsonRush AtomicCrimsonRush wrote:

One word for each is almost enough - but I rather review than rate

Star - poor
StarStar - mediocre
StarStarStar - average/decent
StarStarStarStar - very good/excellent
StarStarStarStarStar - superb/masterpiece
 
 
This comes close enough. Modified or added descriptions in colour. Just a few reviews, no ratings for me.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 09:27
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

An imperfect record can be a 5-star one, and a flawless record can be a 2-star.   Rating systems don't account for this and important things can be lost in translation.  



Agree completely. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 09:41
Originally posted by Man With Hat Man With Hat wrote:

Originally posted by Finnforest Finnforest wrote:

I believe when you participate in a site that means to convey information to site users, one should follow the site's ratings definitions as much as possible so that users actually know what your rating means, and have useful information about the average rating.  Your own personal definitions are fine on your own blog, but users of the site are not likely to know your personal system. 

I guess I've just never understood what is so hard about making a good faith effort to follow the intent of the site's rating guidelines, and what we gain from all the hand wringing and over-thinking about ratings.  Maybe I've just seen this topic one too many time.  Do what thou wilt.  Smile


 
Absolutely. ClapClap
 
For this topic, I assumed the OP was talking about your own personal scales. For the purposes of reviewing on this site, I follow the guidelines provided (just like I would if I was reviewing on a different site with different rules). I'm glad I'm not alone in thinking this. Smile
Very true, and I do use the official guidelines as a guide when assigning a star.  Even then, though, there's a lot of room for subjectivity, and I strongly think that a rating I give should incorporate those subjective intangibles ("near and dear to my heart and soul" and stuff like that) rather than attempt to give a definitive rating that a robot could come up with if programmed the right way.  My personal relationship with an album can bump an essentially 3-star album up to a 4, or down to a 2.  But again, the basic guidelines for the site ratings still provide my initial template for assigning ratings.  But without letting my personal experience and relationship with the album factor into it, my review would be nothing more than an emotionless checklist of pros and cons.  I just think that the reader would appreciate a personal touch, so long as I describe it such that he can understand what I mean.

So when the topic asked for "your rating system", in my case I assumed it meant, "what is your personal interpretation of the PA ratings system".  Which is a fair question, I think.


Edited by HolyMoly - November 29 2012 at 09:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 10:37
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Music is not machinery or baked goods, but rather an offering of self-expression.   To apply mechanical or mathematic standards to music is not only daft but unethical.
So there is nothing to measure about self-expression or the lack of thereof, ... right?

Edited by Dayvenkirq - November 29 2012 at 10:39
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 20:11
 ^ Right

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 20:57
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Music is not machinery or baked goods, but rather an offering of self-expression.   To apply mechanical or mathematic standards to music is not only daft but unethical.
When did rating music become an ethics question? It's immoral to rate albums? Bizarre.

Personally I decide how much I like an album and give it the rating accordingly.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 20:59
^ You are missing the point. An artist works so hard, puts so much love and care into a work that cannot be understood by everyone on this globe, and he gets a f$%king star or two for the work? Who are we to say that we are at the liberty to judge someone's music based on what we like? Discrimination is what it is, and the rating system is a means to do that.*

* Sorry for sounding a bit like a radical. Just trying to sell a point.


Edited by Dayvenkirq - November 29 2012 at 21:09
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 21:09
Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Music is not machinery or baked goods, but rather an offering of self-expression.   To apply mechanical or mathematic standards to music is not only daft but unethical.
When did rating music become an ethics question?
I'd say it's more a question of aesthetics than ethics.   That is, one's appreciation (or criticism) of art.   I didn't say rating albums is unethical, I said the common rating systems, personal or public, are.




Edited by Atavachron - November 29 2012 at 21:10
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 21:22
^ What are uncommon rating systems?

Edited by Dayvenkirq - November 29 2012 at 21:23
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 21:26
Well we could make one up, but I think that's for a different thread.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2012 at 21:31
^ Right. Big smile 

Edited by Dayvenkirq - November 29 2012 at 21:58
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 30 2012 at 01:56
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

^  An artist works so hard, puts so much love and care into a work that cannot be understood by everyone on this globe, and he gets a f$%king star or two for the work? Who are we to say that we are at the liberty to judge someone's music based on what we like?

* Sorry for sounding a bit like a radical. Just trying to sell a point.
*Extremely* well put, my friend.  We should ditch ratings altogether and keep it to reviews......For instance, I've noticed some folks giving absolute glowing write-ups on certain albums, only to find their rating is a 3 or 3.5.  Hey, I've given a 3 star to Renaissance's 'Time Line' album - it measures up to be a 'good, but not essential' album for me. Christ, I'm lucky I haven't been shot for that, as the general view of it is quite poor....?
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