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Topic ClosedWhy does Glass Hammer get Hammered here?
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javajeff View Drop Down
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Points: 467 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 12 2012 at 07:46
I try to rate bands on their own merit even if they sound like someone else.  The new group Headspace for example has some YES and Queensryche moments in their album I AM ANONYMOUS, but it is excellent.
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Points: 3126 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 12 2012 at 07:33
I'd echo a few thoughts here.  Some people just tend to write off anything considered "derivative".  You'd think they only listen to albums that are 100% original (an impossibility?)  So yes, I think there is definitely an element of conceitand/or superiority.  I differ greatly here.  
 
I have no problem whatsoever with a band who's sound is influenced by another, as in the case of the last couple of albums by GH.  It's where that becomes outright plagiarism that I draw the line.  For me, GH are clearly not guilty on that point.   In any event I'd strongly recommend listening to Lex Rex which is in my top 20 albums of all time.  The Inconsolable Secret and Shadowlands are also excellent although even I have to say they were pretty close to the aforementioned line on the latter with Run Lisette LOL. 
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Points: 4287 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 12 2012 at 06:14
Originally posted by dtguitarfan dtguitarfan wrote:

Originally posted by The Bearded Bard The Bearded Bard wrote:

GOD! You just can't accept that everybody don't share your opinions about music, can you? 

What I can't accept is the trolling.  Look, have you ever read UMUR's reviews?  I've never read anything negative from him.  He can write a 3 star review, and if you didn't look at the stars, you'd think he loved the album because he says nice things.  This is something I am striving to emulate now that I am writing reviews in return for receiving free promos.  I have not yet written a review under 3 stars, and if I got something that I thought I might want to dip to that level or below, I'd tell the guy who sends me the promos that I'm not sure I want to write that one, because I always want to be respectful.  But I don't think that's a sentiment most reviewers agree with - I think a lot of people think it's cool to be insulting, because other people who share their hatred of that music applaud them and tell them how funny they were.
 
You may be right, but then I think you should start by changing this one yourself, as i think some people might get hurt by the unfrindly tone against music they like LOL :
dtguitarfan : "Progressive Metal fans: don't make the same mistake I made! Don't waste your time on this one!" 
 
What im saying is, it makes no sence to have a page like this, if you are not allowed to dislike what you dislike, and love what you love.
It may hurt someones feelings, but its part of the game.
 


Edited by tamijo - July 12 2012 at 06:31
Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours
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Points: 28085 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 12 2012 at 01:14
Originally posted by Mr. Maestro Mr. Maestro wrote:

I happen to really like Glass Hammer, especially If.  I frankly don't care how "original" they sound - it's still good music (to my ears at least), so I enjoy it.  It really irks me to see people complaining about GH solely because they're "derivative" or "unorginal" without actually addressing the quality of the music (which is quite high, in my opinion).
I must admit that if I don't like something (and I don't like IF at all) then I tend to dwell on the originality aspect. BUT you have a good point that good music is just good music regardless of whether its a 'copy' or not. For me IF is just too slow paced. I love Fred when he plays like Emerson with those fast keyboard runs most notably on Chronomotree. So as long as he's copying my favourites and doing his take on Tarkus rather than Tales Of Topographic Oceans then I'm happyTongue

Edited by richardh - July 12 2012 at 01:15
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Anthony H. View Drop Down
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Points: 6088 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 23:59
Originally posted by Mr. Maestro Mr. Maestro wrote:

I frankly don't care how "original" they sound - it's still good music (to my ears at least), so I enjoy it.
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Points: 918 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 23:57
I happen to really like Glass Hammer, especially If.  I frankly don't care how "original" they sound - it's still good music (to my ears at least), so I enjoy it.  It really irks me to see people complaining about GH solely because they're "derivative" or "unorginal" without actually addressing the quality of the music (which is quite high, in my opinion).
"I am the one who crossed through space...or stayed where I was...or didn't exist in the first place...."
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Anthony H. View Drop Down
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Points: 6088 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 22:22
Post-80s symph-prog (with a few exceptions) isn't that popular around here.

Shadowlands is fantastic, as is If. GH deserve a bit more renown.
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Points: 573 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 22:18
To me, they're second tier. They're good, but I've got more A-list artists to explore before I really get into them.
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Points: 7971 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 22:04
Originally posted by The Doctor The Doctor wrote:

Am I the only one who thought Three Cheers for the Broken Hearted was a good album?  Not their usual style but still a solid album, I thought.  Chronomotree is my favorite of their albums.  

I liek Three Cheers and have a review about it, if you'd like to check.
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Points: 7951 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 21:29
Hey Doctor! I quite enjoyed `Three Cheers', it's a nice album from them to put on in the background when you're not in the mood to listen to bombastic, epic workouts! It's still very well played with great vocals. I wish they'd made a bit more effort with the cover, though!

Jon Davison has been great for them, though I really do miss the female vocals. I also liked it when Steve/Fred sang, even though they're not the most memorable of vocalists, there is a nice purity and honesty in their voices. Some of the favourites from Lex Rex and Shadowlands had those two singing.

I think `Cor Cordium' was more of a step away from the outright Yes comparisons, but I don't think the material was quite as memorable as the stuff on `If', which some have dismissed as a total Yes ripoff.

Still, I love the band, and how happy they are to produce epic, clasical, massive prog rock in the grandest tradition!
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Points: 13522 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 20:55
I really am not a fan and believe me i've tried. Just my taste in music that's all. Sometimes a band clicks sometimes they don't.
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"Sad Rain" ANEKDOTEN
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Points: 8543 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 20:51
Am I the only one who thought Three Cheers for the Broken Hearted was a good album?  Not their usual style but still a solid album, I thought.  Chronomotree is my favorite of their albums.  One thing I always thought they had a problem with was in the vocal department, so generally my favorites are the ones where they have someone else singing, Brad Marler on Chronomotree, Jon Davison on the last two and Carl Groves on Culture of Ascent.  
I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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Points: 467 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 20:42
I just found this to be an interesting topic, but I am no fanboy.  I like Glass Hammer along with the many other Prog groups in my collection.  I think they are solid, and they are releasing a new concept album entitled Perilous.

http://www.dprp.net/wp/?p=6486


Edited by javajeff - July 11 2012 at 20:43
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Points: 4160 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 02:48
Originally posted by The Bearded Bard The Bearded Bard wrote:

Originally posted by dtguitarfan dtguitarfan wrote:

Originally posted by The Bearded Bard The Bearded Bard wrote:

GOD! You just can't accept that everybody don't share your opinions about music, can you? 

What I can't accept is the trolling.  Look, have you ever read UMUR's reviews?  I've never read anything negative from him.  He can write a 3 star review, and if you didn't look at the stars, you'd think he loved the album because he says nice things.  This is something I am striving to emulate now that I am writing reviews in return for receiving free promos.  I have not yet written a review under 3 stars, and if I got something that I thought I might want to dip to that level or below, I'd tell the guy who sends me the promos that I'm not sure I want to write that one, because I always want to be respectful.  But I don't think that's a sentiment most reviewers agree with - I think a lot of people think it's cool to be insulting, because other people who share their hatred of that music applaud them and tell them how funny they were.
There is nothing wrong with a negative review. Actually, I think most musicians would prefer a sincere, negative review to a positive, ass-licking one. And it is, of course, possible to be both negative and respectful at the same time. That's what you should be striving for IMO, to always be respectful, but critical.
 
(Sorry for all the edits. English is not my first language.)

Bard pretty much said what I thought. Geoff, nobody's insulting anything because it's cool. Most of the times we just exclaim we don't like things because frankly we don't like them. It's very weird I know. You'll find that most of the negative reviews are critical as well as opinionated and I see that as a good thing.  
There be dragons
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Points: 14258 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 02:41
I like em. Love the lead singer too as I saw him live at the Yes concert singing in place of Benoit and he was terrific. Good band and I must get round to reviewing the albums too.
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Points: 338 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 02:14
I only have one Glass Hammer album, their Middle-Earth one.
 
Sorry, I don't care for it at all. Never bothered picking up anything else they've done based on that.
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Points: 28085 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2012 at 01:26
I did 'hammer' their album 'If' which in my opinion is a poor clone of Yes. I really don't like it all.
However I do like Lex Rex,Shadowlands and Chronomotree and I love The Inconsolable Secret which in my opinion is a modern symph prog masterpeice and a long way from being a Yes clone. Unfortunately they pretty much ran out of ideas after that eventually ditching the wonderfull Susie B and decding to go with an obvious Jon Anderson sound a like. I really don't like it but my take is that all bands have a shelf life and GH have exceeded theirs by several years. I still have much to enjoy by them including the two DVD's 'Lex Live' and 'Live At Belmont' which I play a lot. Fred is an amazing talent but I reserve the right to not like their recent material and I respect that others will like this recent material which is absolutely fine. As for the ratings of their albums ..well most of them are considerably higher than ELP - Works Volume One yet GH will never touch the brilliance of Pirates no matter how long they carry on. I think they are treated fairly. There is a lot of good music out there and GH are just part of the melting pot.
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Points: 22774 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 10 2012 at 20:08
Aw yeah, gettin' hammered.
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Points: 7971 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 10 2012 at 18:46
Originally posted by Triceratopsoil Triceratopsoil wrote:

Originally posted by dtguitarfan dtguitarfan wrote:

Originally posted by The Bearded Bard The Bearded Bard wrote:

GOD! You just can't accept that everybody don't share your opinions about music, can you? 

What I can't accept is the trolling.


The things you flip sh*t about aren't trolling by any stretch of the imagination.

I have to agree.

I love the band from Chronometree until Three Cheers for the Broken-Hearted, where they unfortunately became another Yes pastiche. They had pretty obvious influences from Kansas, ELP, Yes and another band I can't recall now, but they were still somewhat original. I haven't followed them since, though. I can understand why people dislike them, however, and I'm OK with it.




Edited by CCVP - July 10 2012 at 18:53
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 10 2012 at 18:37
Originally posted by Ambient Hurricanes Ambient Hurricanes wrote:

Originally posted by javajeff javajeff wrote:

I was just really curious why they get hit so hard.  I always thought it was the YES clone analogy.  However, what about Wobbler?  I think Wobbler is rated higher, but they did not make it over the 4.00 hump.  I think both bands have good albums.

Does Progressive Metal get more love than Symphonic?  I enjoy both.

Look at this list and tell me that every album rated over 4.00 is better than Lex Rex:

http://www.progarchives.com/top-prog-albums.asp?syears=2011#list

I haven't heard any Wobbler, but from reading reviews, I think Wobbler gets rated a bit higher because they are so similar to Yes that people just tend to think of their stuff as "extra Yes albums" and rate the albums as if they had been made by Yes in the 70's.  Glass Hammer seems to me to sit a bit on the edge; not similar enough to Yes to be accepted as a total clone, but not different enough to avoid the "derivative" tag.  That's just my impression from the reviews and discussions around here; I'm not very familiar with the bands and I'm not trying to represent any particular person's opinion.


The three Wobbler albums sound like three different bands to me.  The first was good but all over the place.  The second was all over the place and bad.  The latest one, Rites of Dawn is straight up Yes revisited and it's their best album.  Perfect morning music.
https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays
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