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I think I need to clarify something. I have no problem with a four-chord song, per se. What I have a problem with is when an artist has an entire collection of nothing BUT four-chord songs that never go anywhere, never add any unique elements, never strive for excellence, and this artist is worshiped by millions of rabid fans, they have multiple mansions on opposite sides of continents, and they win awards - like our society is saying "THIS is the best we have to offer." I have no problem with finger-painting either - my kids make finger paintings, and they go on my fridge and I see beauty in them. But if there were an "artist" who made nothing but this type of painting, and made millions of dollars doing it, and appeared on the covers of magazines, and won awards, while millions of teenage fanatics and middle aged women credited this artist as the greatest artist ever while simultaneously saying Leonardo Da Vinci was nothing special, it would infuriate me.
It sounds like it already does.
I see no reason for my blood pressure to increase just because more people like something I don't. Ever since the advent of the middle class, people in general have enjoyed what entertains them- not necessarily what stimulates their intellect. That they spend their money that they earned (or their parents earned) on a form of music that isn't complex or unique is something they are free to do. It doesn't bother me in the least.
And I would add that being a pop sensation is much, much harder than finger painting. I know, for example, that I could not make a video and dance the choreography in it.
Joined: September 03 2006
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Posted: June 02 2012 at 08:47
dtguitarfan wrote:
I think I need to clarify something. I have no problem with a four-chord song, per se. What I have a problem with is when an artist has an entire collection of nothing BUT four-chord songs that never go anywhere, never add any unique elements, never strive for excellence, and this artist is worshiped by millions of rabid fans, they have multiple mansions on opposite sides of continents, and they win awards - like our society is saying "THIS is the best we have to offer." I have no problem with finger-painting either - my kids make finger paintings, and they go on my fridge and I see beauty in them. But if there were an "artist" who made nothing but this type of painting, and made millions of dollars doing it, and appeared on the covers of magazines, and won awards, while millions of teenage fanatics and middle aged women credited this artist as the greatest artist ever while simultaneously saying Leonardo Da Vinci was nothing special, it would infuriate me.
Well, that definition probably fits Bob Dylan nicely, if you take lyrics out of the equation. It certainly does fit AC DC and they enjoy a lot of goodwill in rock circles too and they don't even write anything as profound as the Zimmerman. So I will have to disagree with that, I don't think there is any compulsion on artists to progress music or make something new. They can make what they like; I personally do find derivative music of any kind boring, be it within pop or prog. And I certainly find it harder to endure uninspired, by-the-numbers prog epics rather than a short pop song which might at least be catchy while it last, but that's a different story.
The last sentence sort of resonates with me. I don't have a problem with who they call the greatest as long as they respect my taste. I don't want to hear about how I am this weirdo or show off just because I am more open minded and adventurous in exploring music than people who listen to nothing but radio hits. I am not inclined to give courtesy unless it is reciprocated, which is why I generally avoid conversations on music 'offline'.
Joined: July 27 2010
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Posted: June 02 2012 at 08:52
rogerthat wrote:
Define "pop genre". No such thing as that. It has always been only a mix of contemporaneous music influences. Stevie Wonder may have done it better than most others, but it's still pop music. Pop music is simply accessible music revolving around a chorus that is intended for a large audience. The point is there is nothing inherently wrong with pop music that makes pop artists all those things that you mentioned. Proof being that you also have tr00, uber kvlt heavy f****ing metal bands who sound exactly like each other. You also have celebrated rock bands who make the same album at least 10 times over. That has nothing to do with the nature of pop music.
Excellent point. Pop, like all genres, isn't necessarily popular, but a sound, we can all agree on that. Therefore, pop music means something totally different than its actual, literal definition. Therefore, the definition of pop music can apply to anything. All music is pop music. Hahahaha lol ROFLCOPTER.
Everybody thinks today's stuff is crap but the stuff back then was great. OK honestly ABBA??? Come on! It's hard for me to see the difference between ABBA and Lady Gaga. The only difference is that I can enjoy ABBA sort of sometimes.
rogerthat wrote:
I don't know of a genius working in music right now, whether in the mainstream or otherwise.
Terrible point. Not one genius in the entire music industry?????? Not even one????? One????????? Uno??????אחד??????
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Posted: June 02 2012 at 08:54
frippism wrote:
Terrible point. Not one genius in the entire music industry?????? Not even one????? One????????? Uno??????אחד??????
C'mon....
I only said I do not know of. There may well be one in the fragmented web that is the music industry today but the only geniuses I know of are those who were acknowledged as such long ago and are still working. I know of many talented musicians who make excellent music but none from the new crop that I could call a genius.
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Posted: June 02 2012 at 08:57
frippism wrote:
Everybody thinks today's stuff is crap but the stuff back then was great. OK honestly ABBA??? Come on! It's hard for me to see the difference between ABBA and Lady Gaga. The only difference is that I can enjoy ABBA sort of sometimes.
I think ABBA were indeed in a different league altogether. They just lacked some healthy dose of tastefulness, imo, but they could do some conceptually interesting stuff once every few songs.
However, there's plenty other 70s pop I could hardly bear. Diana Ross is terribly boring to my ears. And what of the much acclaimed Hotel California? I don't know of many other anthems that could be as dull, as un-catchy, etc. That's just me but there surely was terrible music in the 70s too.
OK honestly ABBA??? Come on! It's hard for me to see the difference between ABBA and Lady Gaga. The only difference is that I can enjoy ABBA sort of sometimes.
.
Yep, cut the crap, you hear one of ABBA's classic hit singles and you ain't singing it inside your head for weeks thereafter? You're a lying sack of flotsam if you think that type of song is easy to write without stellar talent
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Posted: June 02 2012 at 10:30
Yay troll threads.
If you hate bad pop, then avoid bad pop and listen to good pop instead, which is still being made today. It's not that hard to find; it's just not being crammed into your face like the flavor of the week Lady Gaga (by whom I still have not heard a single song).
I think this thread is focusing mainly on modern electro/synth/bubblegum pop or whatever it's called (I'm no expert), but there is always at least a few artists grouped into any genre that I find enjoyable and that is because I think music always has its merits and nothing is entirely awful (even if I don't like it). I personally think people should be more open minded and willing to understand and enjoy other types of music even if their preconceptions about a genre is kind of negative. Or else I'll start a thread about how people don't have the same tastes as me and defend my stance as the superior music listener, but that sounds like something that everyone might want to avoid.
If you hate bad pop, then avoid bad pop and listen to good pop instead, which is still being made today. It's not that hard to find; it's just not being crammed into your face like the flavor of the week Lady Gaga (by whom I still have not heard a single song).
I think this thread is focusing mainly on modern electro/synth/bubblegum pop or whatever it's called (I'm no expert), but there is always at least a few artists grouped into any genre that I find enjoyable and that is because I think music always has its merits and nothing is entirely awful (even if I don't like it). I personally think people should be more open minded and willing to understand and enjoy other types of music even if their preconceptions about a genre is kind of negative. Or else I'll start a thread about how people don't have the same tastes as me and defend my stance as the superior music listener, but that sounds like something that everyone might want to avoid.
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Posted: June 02 2012 at 11:47
I despise autotune and all of this too, but I guess that some people might argue that guys like Meshuggah's Jens Kidman also use effects to make his growls sound "growlier" (or whatever they should sound like), or that some metal guitarists effects can be partly used to mask minor playing mistakes or to make some rather trivial playing sound spectacular.
I myself play guitar and I know by experience that when you play with high-end gear and sophisticated effects it's so much easier to play and give an impressive sound, and small mistakes become unnoticeable.
Isn't it a bit like what auto-tune does for vocalists?
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dtguitarfan wrote:
