Why DO women like prog? |
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995 |
Posted: January 31 2012 at 16:23 | |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: January 31 2012 at 16:27 | |
wait what? Oh god, please please any divine being that may exist...tell me this is some exaggeration gone wrong. |
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infocat
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: June 10 2011 Location: Colorado, USA Status: Offline Points: 4671 |
Posted: January 31 2012 at 19:41 | |
Sherman Hemsley likes prog. Who else do you need? |
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Frank Swarbrick Belief is not Truth. |
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Alitare
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 08 2008 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 3595 |
Posted: January 31 2012 at 21:12 | |
Why do religious people like Prog? Isn't prog rock too open-minded for their pathetic, close-minded apprehensions? Isn't prog rock too important and forwardly-thinking for their incomplete, backwood sensibilities?
My three year old son knows half the words to Dylan's Ballad of a Thin Man (and can sing them pretty much in tune), but I don't think he likes ELP too much. Does that make him a f**kin' idiot? Why don't most toddlers enjoy prog? We need to devote millions of dollars of funding into figuring that one out. Do active members of the Ku Klux Klan enjoy prog rock? I'll bet they're jamming out to Tales From Topographic Oceans during those secret lynchings. I'll wager a study donkey that they chant the chorus to Lucky Man in the midst of burning crosses on the lawns of minorities. I have no real point to add other than that my girlfriend loves almost all the same bands as me, which is only important to me. I doubt any of you here give half a sh*t about that, and that's the way I prefer it. She loves Pink Floyd and hates Rush. Perfect!
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
Posted: January 31 2012 at 21:32 | |
If ti were physically possible to burn this thread, I would.
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brainstormer
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 20 2008 Location: Seattle, WA Status: Offline Points: 887 |
Posted: February 01 2012 at 10:25 | |
Wow, what a nice guy you must be. Just insult some of the greatest creators of prog, who happen to be very into spirituality. Isn't not opening one's mind to the nature of reality, which many think of as spiritual, "close-minded"? |
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Robert Pearson Regenerative Music http://www.regenerativemusic.net Telical Books http://www.telicalbooks.com ParaMind Brainstorming Software http://www.paramind.net |
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Alitare
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 08 2008 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 3595 |
Posted: February 01 2012 at 13:53 | |
^You haven't read enough of what I say to determine whether or not I'm being sarcastic. I have nothing against spirituality or religious individuals.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
Posted: February 01 2012 at 14:05 | |
Why on earth would you want ti to burn this thread physically? |
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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NotAProghead
Special Collaborator Errors & Omissions Team Joined: October 22 2005 Location: Russia Status: Offline Points: 7852 |
Posted: February 01 2012 at 14:40 | |
Surpisingly this thread is less popular than this one: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82415
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Who are you and who am I to say we know the reason why... (D. Gilmour)
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CPicard
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 03 2008 Location: Là, sui monti. Status: Offline Points: 10841 |
Posted: February 01 2012 at 16:18 | |
Note that these two threads have at least two common points: - they are discussing matter concerning women - but without any woman involved in these discussions; - they are made for trolling; - they will go waaaaaay out of hand in less than one week. |
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brainstormer
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 20 2008 Location: Seattle, WA Status: Offline Points: 887 |
Posted: February 01 2012 at 18:21 | |
OK, that's fair....(listening to to the Hallelujah section of Magma's Ka, lol). |
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Robert Pearson Regenerative Music http://www.regenerativemusic.net Telical Books http://www.telicalbooks.com ParaMind Brainstorming Software http://www.paramind.net |
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LirazelsOdyssey
Forum Newbie Joined: January 31 2012 Location: Seattle, WA Status: Offline Points: 28 |
Posted: February 08 2012 at 09:50 | |
Hi, new to this forum and this thread grabbed me because this is one of the things that has stumped me as well. I am a woman BTW who has been very into prog since my high school days in the 80s. Someone in this thread mentioned maybe it was lack of exposure? Maybe. I can only speak for myself, but here is why I got hooked on prog: < ="text/" ="" ="/B1D671CF-E532-4481-99AA-19F420D90332etdefender/huidhui.js?0=0&0=0&0=0">
First of all (I also wrote this story on my intro post), my first "baptism", if you will, into prog was when I took my sister to the Yes- 90125 concert in 1984. In all actuality, the thing that motivated me to get tickets to go to that concert was that Berlin was the opening band and I was very into them. Well, Berlin cancelled and we were left with only Yes. My sister (who is 9 years older than I) said not to worry; I would find that I knew a lot more of Yes songs than I thought I did. Well, she sure was right. The whole concert I was like, "Oh yeah! I know this song!" That concert just blew me away and I have never encountered its equal all of these years, and I've been to a lot of concerts. After that concert I went and found and 8 track (yes, an 8 track) of Fragile and just was captivated. Thus was my initiation into prog. But my interest was then nurtured by a group of guys I began hanging around with. I was quite the rebel back then and kind of a party animal and there was this house called "The Zoo" we all used to hang out at and drink crappy 3.2 beer. The gender proportion there was always about 4/1 guys over girls, but there I was. Many of those guys were into prog and a couple were serious audiophiles. So I got introduced to a lot of prog type bands such as: Rush, ELP, more Yes, Jethro Tull, Asia, Pink Floyd, Styx and my huge fav.. Alan Parsons Project. Later I met my husband who really loved Yes and prog in general and he was amazed and thrilled that I was interested in it. During the 90s I got caught up in contemporary Christian music which became pretty boring pretty fast until I heard Iona, which is an outstanding Celtic Christian prog band from the UK. I was being reeled into prog once again. But why do I keep searching for new prog artists to enjoy and keep being captivated to all of those I have found through the years? I guess its just that I have a fierce and deep love of music in general. It is "in my blood" so to speak. I come from very musical parents and have owned my own music since I was a toddler, literally. I knew how to operate a turntable with respect at the age of 4 and began building my collection of vinyl at that age (which I still have BTW). I am hard pressed to find a genre of music that I just can't stand at all. And now that the internet and broadband has come around the music world has opened up to me big time! In the last few years, I've discovered a lot of prog bands through emusic while I had a good job as I had a subscription there. Now I don't have that and so have started lurking around here to discover more. Glad to be one of the few women here! Lirazel
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dennismoore
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: April 19 2011 Location: America Status: Offline Points: 877 |
Posted: February 08 2012 at 12:10 | |
Hi sm sm, if you are still around....if I read your post right, I now realize that it is "I" who have been victimized. As a man who delights in a listening session of YES- CTTE but is a pariah on the dance floor. I have missed out and could not cash-in on all the fame and social goodies that went to the majority that can trip the light fantastic to the latest Madonna drivel. I Missed out on so many late night romances, to that "pop", happenin kinda guy who can talk "Beyonce". Plus, the $$$ I could have made from hangin with the "in crowd". Hmm, maybe Gloria Alred will represent me. Where are MY social programs(for guys who love Gentle Giant but can't disco dance)???
Ok seriously... I am new here and I just saw that this thread is active so I read it. Boy, do I feel like a fool thinking this was a nice mellow little place! I thought all the insult tossing, judgemental peeps were all over at Alt. Music.Yes!
Silly me. Seriously, the original question was kinda silly. The are virtually no girls who are into prog! A better question is why is that?
The monkey-dance mating ritual theory was covered already so I will humbly point out 2 other reassons why I think we have this phenomenon.
1. Simple exposure
2. Woman have been left out of all boys club of music.
Exposure I - As an Alice Cooper, Elton John loving 13 year old, I had a music appreciation class freshman year HS. The teacher played on a decent stereo.... Rick Wakeman (after Jackson Brown) then ELP... and I was hooked! I went out and bought Rick Wakeman LPs then Yes, etc....
Exposure II - I recall going to a party in 8th grade and a girl had an ELP - Brain Salad Surgery record. Well at that time New York's WPLJ had ELP muisic in their TV commercial! See the connection?
Prog is not promoted via radio or the media so it is hard for anybody to be exposed to it.
Exposure III - Before I met my wife she was into dance - pop rock - whatever pop de jour. After seeing YES ONE TIME
(with Benoit David, thank you very much!) she LOVES YES. It was Steve Howe's playing that actually got to her. She herself decided that we would travel to see them the next night as well... She loves ELP as well & Glass Hammer...
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Music was largely a men's only club. In the 70's (my generation) women were not in prog or rock bands(Heart was the only band I think....) Women were very much stereotyped. Women should be models,actresses, teachers, maybe doctors but NOT rock musicians. This all slowly changed so today, girls in bands are no big thing. Back then, Led Zep, Pink Floyd, Grateful Dead, The Who, Stones, AND all the prog bands were ALL men. These bands were the heroes of men. Most guys wanted to play like them and BE like them. What did that music offer a girl? Oh, yeah,to be that folk singer Joan Baez... That was pretty much it.
Cheers!
Ok, just my $.02. Edited by dennismoore - February 08 2012 at 12:21 |
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"Yeah, people are unhappy about that - but you know what, it's still Yes." - Chris Squire
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: February 08 2012 at 22:10 | |
The irony is that Raff made this thread to talk about what drew other women like her to prog and thereby beat the stereotype. But you just had to have all the men say the usual stupid things about women going because David Gilmour is cute and all that.
Let us suppose that is true. So what? Are there not men who watch women's tennis only when Sharapova or Ivanovic play and who don't really care about better players like Davenport (ok, she's retired but anyway..) or Clijsters just because they are unattractive? In my experience, 90% of male tennis lovers I have met are like that. Why should it be so hard for some men to understand that if they can feel drawn to attractive members of the other sex, it can very well hold good for the other side and is not just about this whole business of "women being women". |
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NotAProghead
Special Collaborator Errors & Omissions Team Joined: October 22 2005 Location: Russia Status: Offline Points: 7852 |
Posted: February 09 2012 at 16:36 | |
Not that stupid at all I think. Nobody cancelled the rule: don't even dream about success if girls don't like you.
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Who are you and who am I to say we know the reason why... (D. Gilmour)
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: February 09 2012 at 18:38 | |
You are only quoting a part of my post and the not the next and more important part of it. And by the way, it's not true that men are so religiously devoted to music alone that they won't attend the gig of an attractive female musician mainly for her looks and not the music. When Iron Maiden performed here 5 years back, people were more forgiving of Lauryn Harris than a local nu metal band though both were equally bad. If men didn't salivate at the sight of attractive women, a fair few female TV presenters would have to find another job. One sided stereotyping, imo. Edited by rogerthat - February 09 2012 at 18:41 |
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progbaby
Forum Senior Member Joined: April 20 2007 Status: Offline Points: 286 |
Posted: April 04 2012 at 16:49 | |
A female friend of mine who is in the business of pyschology (she has a degree) mentioned that women are more "relationship" oriented and men are more "task" oriented. ON the whole from studies, men tend to base their self esteem on their jobs/work and women tend to base their self esteem on their relationships rather than on their jobs.
With prog music, there's not much to be found in the lyrics that talk about "woman loves man, man falls for woman. Man and woman kiss and get married and have a family"... With your AOR American pop music on the radio, the lyrics tend to be of a relationship nature (even if it's twisted in terms of sexual immorality or with sexual conquest overtones, etc...) and women tend to prefer more that type of stuff based on the studies. I hope I did not offend anyone. No offense meant. Thinking about relationships and being married and having a family are at the top and forefront of most women. Those same women would much rather hear a Whitney Houston song (singing about dancing and dating men) rather than "The Battle of Epping Forest"... Also, women tend to multitask much better than men (they've done studies on that) so as such, the attention of span of many women is divided and they switch task their minds much more than men (I don't like to multitask)... As a result, I feel many women (who multitask a lot) don't have the patience or desire to sit down and concentrate and feel a 20-minute "Close to the Edge" flowing thru your brains. They'd much rather have a 3-minute 2 chord progression Bon Jovi song on in the background or some song that produces a constant repititous drum/dance beat (ie, maybe it gets them thinking about dancing which somehow involves a relationship again???) But it is known that well known and studied that women switch-task much better than men and that they are more relationship-oriented than men. I know there are exceptions but the brain chemistry/makeup between men and women are different. Much in the way that you hear the stereotype that most men love sports and women don't and most women love to shop and most men don't. Not meaning to say this in a demeaning way but if a 20-minute song is delving into complex instrumental solos and sung in a foreign language or if the lyrics are not about relationship-sort of things, many of the women will not be interested. I feel much of prog relates to a "task oriented" nature.. I mean when I hear a really cool keyboard solo or guitar solo or melody, my mind turns to "task mode" and I'm like, "how'd they do that?" or "what's going on there with that chord progression, etc...". I do think the element of "lack of relationship-oriented nature in the topics of many prog songs" to be turn offs for many of the female persuation who look for those elements in their music (and they will find it on American idol).. Plus with their extensive multitasking nature, I feel many don't want to go thru the effort of listening to a song that lasts more than 3-4 minutes long as they have a bunch of other things on their mind that they need to attend to and do. The american-idol music fits that bill for them. Maybe??? I really hope this did not offend anyone... I meant no offense to any man or woman reading the thread. Edited by progbaby - April 04 2012 at 16:51 |
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
Posted: April 04 2012 at 18:29 | |
Now, apply all of that to instrumental prog.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: April 04 2012 at 19:17 | |
It is not only about relationships. A lot of prog IS technical, left brained stuff. And therefore it appeals only to a very specific demographic, not even all men. |
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progbaby
Forum Senior Member Joined: April 20 2007 Status: Offline Points: 286 |
Posted: April 04 2012 at 21:37 | |
I definitely believe you
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