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Points: 2 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Tabs and sheets
    Posted: September 09 2011 at 04:46
Hi there!

I'm searching for some tabs or sheets of Genesis and King Crimson, and I want to ask if you know any site or if you have a personal tabs archive of these bands.
I know Tabs-archive.com , 911 tabs.com, guitar-tabs.com so there are wrong tabs, So, you know this genre requires more accuracy of music and I don't need these sites.  Big smile


Thank you!!! 
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Points: 2 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 12 2011 at 07:20
Nobody knows....?!   Shocked
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Points: 887 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2011 at 00:34
You can find a pdf of the Second's Out book online. 
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Points: 1601 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 22 2011 at 15:54
Well seeing as prog rock is full of educated musicians it's unlikely you'll find any self released tablature, since to pick apart prog rock with no rhythm would be a nightmare.  So I'd say either sheet music (which would be an official release, meaning google is your friend but you're going to need to fork over $$$), or looking at the best tabs and working from there.  Personally I'd do it by ear before I'd even look at a tab
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Points: 374 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 26 2011 at 02:06
there is a lot of midi music which can be easily converted to sheets 
ask on jordanrudess.com forum (midi exchange)
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Points: 1119 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 08 2011 at 10:39
most of the sites you mentioned cannot be accessed with an IP from my country because of copyright laws. So yeah, at least in Finland, the sheets belong to the composers.
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Points: 17487 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2011 at 20:38
Hi,
 
I know this may sound wrong, but it is not meant to be.
 
If you wish to play like many of these folks, you do not want to pick up the tablatures, and study them ... may I recommend that you take as much wax out of your ear as possible and go after it ... the moment that you know that you can pick it up off the ear, you know that you are now good enough to play that stuff as good, if not better.
 
Remember one of the most important things about the arts ... a "style" is NEVER a process, it's an end result, so thinking that a style or this or that is important is not really a strong musical exercise or learning at all. The "style" almost always is only defined way after the life of the music anyway, and is mostly used for academic or commercial concerns ... so give yourself a good chance ... learn it from the inner source ... YOU!
 
If you want to be progressive, learning what the others did is not the way! Never will, specially when you factor in the fact that you will be compared to the "masters" and you will never be good enough! Take that comparison away, and watch everyone scratch their heads, ears and crotch to figure out what it all is ... !!! (hahahah! Confused  LOL  Wink) You can, however, learn from what they thought and say about HOW they created something, but rock music is too egocentric to study that stuff and critical studies are not kosher since a lot of the musicians will come off really vain and self-righteous. And grossly over hyped. Thus, that discussion is never offered, or defined, or wanted! The "famous" progressive rock bands fit that club to almost all degrees, and the discussion of the technical side of their work is often ... very obtuse and out in left field. And I'm not sure that even Chris Squire can define why he decided to play 127 notes in that 1 minute and passage ... he might just say ... I don't know ... it just sounded right! ... and that's the way it is a la Walter Cronkite!
 
Good luck and best to you ... just be better than the others and stop worrying about what the others did!


Edited by moshkito - November 21 2011 at 20:46
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2011 at 20:59
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Hi,
 
I know this may sound wrong, but it is not meant to be.
 
If you wish to play like many of these folks, you do not want to pick up the tablatures, and study them ... may I recommend that you take as much wax out of your ear as possible and go after it ... the moment that you know that you can pick it up off the ear, you know that you are now good enough to play that stuff as good, if not better.
 
Remember one of the most important things about the arts ... a "style" is NEVER a process, it's an end result, so thinking that a style or this or that is important is not really a strong musical exercise or learning at all. The "style" almost always is only defined way after the life of the music anyway, and is mostly used for academic or commercial concerns ... so give yourself a good chance ... learn it from the inner source ... YOU!
 
If you want to be progressive, learning what the others did is not the way! Never will, specially when you factor in the fact that you will be compared to the "masters" and you will never be good enough! Take that comparison away, and watch everyone scratch their heads, ears and crotch to figure out what it all is ... !!! (hahahah! Confused  LOL  Wink) You can, however, learn from what they thought and say about HOW they created something, but rock music is too egocentric to study that stuff and critical studies are not kosher since a lot of the musicians will come off really vain and self-righteous. And grossly over hyped. Thus, that discussion is never offered, or defined, or wanted! The "famous" progressive rock bands fit that club to almost all degrees, and the discussion of the technical side of their work is often ... very obtuse and out in left field. And I'm not sure that even Chris Squire can define why he decided to play 127 notes in that 1 minute and passage ... he might just say ... I don't know ... it just sounded right! ... and that's the way it is a la Walter Cronkite!
 
Good luck and best to you ... just be better than the others and stop worrying about what the others did!


Breaking my rule here by responding to you, but here we are:

As a teacher, I have plenty of students who learn from some "inner source."  They are complete a****les because they won't study and learn from someone else.

Did it ever occur to you that the "masters" learned from and were influenced by others?  Mastery doesn't occur in a vacuum.  Jon Anderson said this:

"I know when I started I would have been happy to sound like the Beatles or Joe Tex or whoever. You want to sound like most bands, you want to sound like their records and that's how you learn your chops."

And "just be better than the others" is horrific advice for musicians.  Thumbs Down

Edited by Epignosis - November 21 2011 at 21:00
https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays
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Points: 17487 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2011 at 21:29
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

...
As a teacher, I have plenty of students who learn from some "inner source."  They are complete a****les because they won't study and learn from someone else.
...
 
Again, it was not meant to put down "teachers" and "masters" ... but in the end, the one thing that you did not say, is that ... the master and teacher may know the notes, but they might not have the feeling behind it, that CREATES the notes, and that was I was trying to say ... about ... "You", which was immediately mis-understood.
 
And as Krautrock and a lot of other music, sometimes you are not lloking for The Beatles, or Joe Tex, or anyone else ... try to make sense of Tales and that ... and you will know that Jon was being more polite with the person he was talking to and saying it in a way that is easier to understand ... and eventually, he became his own person and talent ... or he would not even be mentioned.
 
Quote
And "just be better than the others" is horrific advice for musicians.  Thumbs Down

The point was to suggest that you have to stop comparing yourself to the mirror of others ... so you can find YOURSELF. If you can find yourself in the midst of it all, you won't need that mirror any more ... and you will simply figure out how you want to express yourself and do it.

That is the "trick" and the "secret" of all arts. And the main reason why I spend so much time inviting people to experiment and learn different things, because in the end, you find a contrast that can help you define your very own musicianship ... because otherwise the paper score is MASTER ... and you are but a slave to the feeling that someone is creating for you to play in the first place. (Or the notes and chords).

It's a very tough area, but teachers like you, that obviously have a fabulous ear for even more music and expressions in musical form, is someone that I would have loved to meet and take musical instruction from (and WOULD EVEN TODAY) ... so my younger sister played Harp (yeah the big one is at our house in Santa Barbara) with the SB Symphony, and she was far and above them and could play with eyes closed and no score ... and I told her that if she really wanted to work on that she should try and go play with some jazz folks and some rock folks, to help get even further ... she just gave up playing music when she was dissatisfied with the Symphony and a life of nursing was more interesting!

As a famous mystic once said ... "potential is crap" ... and I would add ... "and a bad teacher!"
 
Lots of good when the music has nowhere to go is my point ... and you have, sometimes, to break out ... and the only way to break out is learning something about yourself and your instrument, and that part does not have as much to do with you or I ... or anything else you know or taught ... think of it this way ... despite everything you taught, and said, the kid still left home to make his own life! ...
 
I look at it this way ... is this instrument about me ... or about some thing that is "out there" ... that is visionary at best? It's the same thing as a writer for me. The minute I worry about the comparison, instead of what I SEE inside, the poem stops, the life of that "moment" is over, and the writing is done. Unfinished. Forever.
 
YOU are a person attempting and helping translate that vision and dream, and I have the utmost appreciation for that ... because there is no expression in the history of human kind that has forever been more important ... and it's not "words" ... it's music, and you and I know it!
 
If those folks are "ash_____" then it's not about the music for them either ... it's about their ash! ... Or money! ... choose your weapon!
 
Yeah, I had the pleasure of having met Isaac Stern and Yehudi Menuhin, and those folks were not only masters, they were teachers ... and they knew we were just studying the history of arts, but Yehudi, was saying to us, how important it was that we knew the history of it all and how far it all has come, and how our abilities adnn perceptions came alive and changed all we knew and know and would like to know ... Isaac was more about the music itself, but Yehudi, probably had gained massive insight to his experiments with Ravi Shankar ... where several folks after the concert in Chicago, were saying ... oh my word ... all that improvisation can't be called "music" ... and that is a true story, and when we asked Isaac about that he laughed ... "nothing you can do ... some love the music and some don't ... and for people like us ... we just stick with the music and do not worry about anything else!"
 
This stuff I have not placed in a book yet ... because it is not the time and place, and folks like yourself are not believing in the "miracle" of the music itself ...
 
Sorry Ep ... I love what you do and have an awesome respect for your patience, love and desire ... but I am also a writer and a part of a literary tradition and I live for the internal vision and work, and basically you are saying I am an a****le and the vision isnot worth it ... and I have given you every bit of my soul to express and explain everything I "see" and "know" ... and it is not in a book. Actually it is, but right or wrong, if has more in parity with the Surrealists and a Jean Cocteau than ... "progressive music"! But I wonder if that is too far and bizzare for most folks to get and understand ... it would require a lot of reading and studying ... as much if not more than you request of your students!


Edited by moshkito - November 22 2011 at 21:32
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Points: 18016 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2011 at 21:40
Out of curiosity, Moshkito, are you a musician?

As for the OP - if you are struggling to find tabs or sheet music, it's really great practice to try and learn by ear.  If you know well enough to tell that the tabs you found are incorrect, you should capable of figuring out parts by yourself.

One of the nice things about doing that is you have to figure out which was to play something is easiest to you


Edited by Triceratopsoil - November 22 2011 at 21:49
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2011 at 22:12
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

...
As a teacher, I have plenty of students who learn from some "inner source."  They are complete a****les because they won't study and learn from someone else.
...
 
Again, it was not meant to put down "teachers" and "masters" ... but in the end, the one thing that you did not say, is that ... the master and teacher may know the notes, but they might not have the feeling behind it, that CREATES the notes, and that was I was trying to say ... about ... "You", which was immediately mis-understood.
 
And as Krautrock and a lot of other music, sometimes you are not lloking for The Beatles, or Joe Tex, or anyone else ... try to make sense of Tales and that ... and you will know that Jon was being more polite with the person he was talking to and saying it in a way that is easier to understand ... and eventually, he became his own person and talent ... or he would not even be mentioned.
 
Quote
And "just be better than the others" is horrific advice for musicians.  Thumbs Down

The point was to suggest that you have to stop comparing yourself to the mirror of others ... so you can find YOURSELF. If you can find yourself in the midst of it all, you won't need that mirror any more ... and you will simply figure out how you want to express yourself and do it.

That is the "trick" and the "secret" of all arts. And the main reason why I spend so much time inviting people to experiment and learn different things, because in the end, you find a contrast that can help you define your very own musicianship ... because otherwise the paper score is MASTER ... and you are but a slave to the feeling that someone is creating for you to play in the first place. (Or the notes and chords).

It's a very tough area, but teachers like you, that obviously have a fabulous ear for even more music and expressions in musical form, is someone that I would have loved to meet and take musical instruction from (and WOULD EVEN TODAY) ... so my younger sister played Harp (yeah the big one is at our house in Santa Barbara) with the SB Symphony, and she was far and above them and could play with eyes closed and no score ... and I told her that if she really wanted to work on that she should try and go play with some jazz folks and some rock folks, to help get even further ... she just gave up playing music when she was dissatisfied with the Symphony and a life of nursing was more interesting!

As a famous mystic once said ... "potential is crap" ... and I would add ... "and a bad teacher!"
 
Lots of good when the music has nowhere to go is my point ... and you have, sometimes, to break out ... and the only way to break out is learning something about yourself and your instrument, and that part does not have as much to do with you or I ... or anything else you know or taught ... think of it this way ... despite everything you taught, and said, the kid still left home to make his own life! ...
 
I look at it this way ... is this instrument about me ... or about some thing that is "out there" ... that is visionary at best? It's the same thing as a writer for me. The minute I worry about the comparison, instead of what I SEE inside, the poem stops, the life of that "moment" is over, and the writing is done. Unfinished. Forever.
 
YOU are a person attempting and helping translate that vision and dream, and I have the utmost appreciation for that ... because there is no expression in the history of human kind that has forever been more important ... and it's not "words" ... it's music, and you and I know it!
 
If those folks are "ash_____" then it's not about the music for them either ... it's about their ash! ... Or money! ... choose your weapon!
 
Yeah, I had the pleasure of having met Isaac Stern and Yehudi Menuhin, and those folks were not only masters, they were teachers ... and they knew we were just studying the history of arts, but Yehudi, was saying to us, how important it was that we knew the history of it all and how far it all has come, and how our abilities adnn perceptions came alive and changed all we knew and know and would like to know ... Isaac was more about the music itself, but Yehudi, probably had gained massive insight to his experiments with Ravi Shankar ... where several folks after the concert in Chicago, were saying ... oh my word ... all that improvisation can't be called "music" ... and that is a true story, and when we asked Isaac about that he laughed ... "nothing you can do ... some love the music and some don't ... and for people like us ... we just stick with the music and do not worry about anything else!"
 
This stuff I have not placed in a book yet ... because it is not the time and place, and folks like yourself are not believing in the "miracle" of the music itself ...
 
Sorry Ep ... I love what you do and have an awesome respect for your patience, love and desire ... but I am also a writer and a part of a literary tradition and I live for the internal vision and work, and basically you are saying I am an a****le and the vision isnot worth it ... and I have given you every bit of my soul to express and explain everything I "see" and "know" ... and it is not in a book. Actually it is, but right or wrong, if has more in parity with the Surrealists and a Jean Cocteau than ... "progressive music"! But I wonder if that is too far and bizzare for most folks to get and understand ... it would require a lot of reading and studying ... as much if not more than you request of your students!


What do I do that you love?  Besides posting

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:


tl;dr?
https://epignosis.bandcamp.com/album/a-month-of-sundays
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Points: 17487 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2011 at 17:05
Originally posted by Triceratopsoil Triceratopsoil wrote:

Out of curiosity, Moshkito, are you a musician?

As for the OP - if you are struggling to find tabs or sheet music, it's really great practice to try and learn by ear.  If you know well enough to tell that the tabs you found are incorrect, you should capable of figuring out parts by yourself.

One of the nice things about doing that is you have to figure out which was to play something is easiest to you
 
Been studying some of the stuff that the Perfect Pitch guy has written, that is ... actually really far out when you think about it, and I thought it was hilarious that some academic places were giving him heck, until all of a sudden ... oh my word ... we better check that out!
 
I'm not a "musician" per se, but I am an "artist" and my whole life is about music, which is expressed in writing in its flow. I can't even write a rock'n'roll song, because all I want to do sometimes is scream, shout, whisper, love, hate ... the same as Peter Hammill does because it is almost all about the feeling in his work and a lot less about the music itself ... but no one talks about that ... they talk about the "progressive" this or that. I actually think that it scares people to get that strong about how you feel ... and most quit ... the reason why there are so few "real" people in the arts!
 
I can write poetry, ad lib, to stuff I can flow and meander with on my keyboards. I think that right now it is too raw and probably sound like something that Patti Smith did before she got "in tune" ... so to speak ... but, it's not about the "tune" or anything else ... it's about the "stream of consciousness" that creates the words in the first place, and I do that easy ... almost same as writing here ... it's all visual for me, so someone disagreeing is weird, because this or that was never the preocupation when it was written in the first place and this is the same joke about Ian's thread, that some don't like! And it explains why giving you a real life movie of the creative process, can never be "progressive" for a board like this ... it's not mechanical! ... and the thread got removed to the generic thread! When the process itself is highly progressive and was also used in Europe and by King Crimson!
 
But this is a "commercial" board ... so tabs it is, because it is all folks can learn and do? ... now you know that the music will hardly be good enough and both you and I will laugh at it and give it some kind of designation that basic states ... that ain't music! Pretty soon there is a new "style" ... I call it the NY Lounge Lizard Jazz Kings!


Edited by moshkito - November 23 2011 at 17:09
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Points: 18016 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 24 2011 at 15:06
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

I'm not a "musician"


So you admit that you really have no purpose in being here other than to berate the OP (2 months late) ?
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Points: 17487 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2011 at 20:00
Originally posted by Triceratopsoil Triceratopsoil wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

I'm not a "musician"


So you admit that you really have no purpose in being here other than to berate the OP (2 months late) ?
 
If that is what you think, whatever.
 
I'm no less a music lover, and you know it.
 
But you are not accepting that artistic concepts and ideas have a common thread, that some rock'n'roll folks (or progressive folks) are not interested in. But if there is one thing that some folks here, obviously you included, do not like, is someone taking the artist's side on their work. Since you interview people, none of them can tell you ... I don't need you, since they all canuse the help as much as possible and you basically have them over the coals ... but no ... you would rather go after me, because I am not famous (whatever) and thus my validity is limited to your own idealism and anything written here is automatically wrong. But you can kiss some ... but not others, because you are too lazy to find out ... what is he/she really all about?
 
I can not change lilfe and the living ... I can only be me.
 
The rest?
 
Enjoy your anger and frustration, and thinking that I do not care about art, and the work itself. Show your love ... show how you think ... instead of trashing others ... I'm not into trashing you or others, and I have opened myself up and explained the best I can how I think and see ... but no ... you can only say something bad, and state that you are omnipotent and does not have to explain himself or his own words ... now show me who is being rude and who is not helping the thread or the comments?
 
I'm not looking for fame or acceptance, like you are, or the board. The only acceptance I need is myself and my own vision, and you show me anyone you have ever met, or talked to  that did not feel that way ... if they were not different and saw things differently and did not do them differently ... you would not have bothered!


Edited by moshkito - November 28 2011 at 20:13
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Points: 18016 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2011 at 20:05
This thread is about finding sheet music, not about how obnoxious you can be.
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Points: 17487 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2011 at 20:17
Originally posted by Triceratopsoil Triceratopsoil wrote:

This thread is about finding sheet music, not about how obnoxious you can be.
 
Show your colors. Because you certainly are not representing mine!
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2011 at 02:02

Unbe-bloody-lievable. Stern Smile
What?
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2011 at 03:10
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

I'm not into trashing you or others


As you can see I've quoted you OUT OF CONTEXT. (Bolt-hole is open for business) Practically every post you have submitted over the last few weeks has criticised PA's modus operandi, it's collaberators and members and attempts to undermine their motives for the work they do around here. You are of course perfectly entitled to voice your misgivings about our views and opinions as you see fit, but are you going to feign surprise that such unstinting and relentless criticism just may rub some selfless, well intentioned and hard working folks up the wrong way? You have been a member for 4 years and have submitted precisely 2 reviews. All I get from your posts Moshkito is that you appear to be a frustrated artist. Please don't take out your thwarted ambition on the undeserving souls round here thankyou.
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Points: 2 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 31 2012 at 01:08
In my opinion google is the best answer for searching. 
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Points: 13244 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 31 2012 at 17:04
I think the OP picked up on that 9 months ago....Wink
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