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Luna View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 25 2011 at 21:39
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Originally posted by SolarLuna96 SolarLuna96 wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Originally posted by Slaughternalia Slaughternalia wrote:

I'm sure many literature enthusiasts would consider my taste in books generic and boring


I know I do. I bet your favorite novelist is Dean Koontz. Ha ha ha ha ha!
 
No, Stephanie Meyer Embarrassed


I don't know or care who that is,
You're better off that way
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 25 2011 at 22:27
Originally posted by paganinio paganinio wrote:

Would you recommend King Crimson to someone who's just getting into rock music? I'm talking about someone who knows not Led Zeppelin, Radiohead, maybe a bit of Beatles and Linkin Park (that picture comes to mindStar).

I did such a thing to one of my colleages. I pointed her in the direction of Larks' Tongues In Aspic and Discipline, and said this music would help her focus at work and sleep better at night. I wonder what happened to her.

This also brings up a topic: how would a person react to avant-prog if she had no prior experience to almost any rock music, and non-mainstream music in general? Would she think it's cool because there's nothing to compare it to, no point of reference? I mean, for a Radiohead fan, avant-prog probably sounds distant and hard to get into. But this person never heard any rock music anyway, there's nothing to be distant from.
Sometimes in the past because people have heard a band like Led Zeppelin first before anything else.... it holds them back from expanding into other styles of music. Not so that the person lacks depth. Only due to what they grow with or hear first. The first impression from 1 particular style of music may cause the person to eventually devlelop.....the wrong assumptions about other styles of music.
 
Another example would be a kid that hangs with a small prog gathering of friends during the weekends. The listening experience begins for this kid at age 15. He hasn't heard mainstream rock music yet or has payed attention to it. At first he doesn't like the music his friends are worshipping. Then about 4 months later he begins to enjoy it.  Also taken into consideration that his friends are rather fringe members in their age group and loners which hang together. In school they are by all means considered strange to everyone around them. Prog becomes the local "Goblin's Club" or the "Dead Poets Society". It's like your religion now and you are more than willing to except it.
 
There is this old practice amongst my elderly prog brothers from the 70's. To simply get rid of a girl you do not prefer to date ......play a King Crimson album.  Never play King Crimson for a cheerleader. Things of that nature and guys in college were sarcastic about it.  Over the years I had met ladies who were huge fans of King Crimson. The early King Crimson. It was what they liked on their planet. Most of the dislike for King Crimson derived from people's feelings towards the strangeness of the band's style. This was the generation of teenage groupings in 1971that I was exposed to. Only because 1 or 2 of us had older sisters that collected King Crimson albums were we aware of the band and their music. No internet, no picture with an ID, .........just people older than you introducing this music to you and your friends. I have no idea what the current reactions to the band are.


Edited by TODDLER - July 25 2011 at 22:28
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 26 2011 at 01:16
yeah i find that "Epitaph" goes well with people who like mainstream rock. not my first guess of music that would be accepted in the mainstream areas. i would think maybe the title track off of that album, but whatever.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 27 2011 at 18:50
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I would recommend King Crimosn to anyone in any situation, but not Discipline. I hate that album. Any of the first seven would be fine.


Totally agree. The question of whether people are "automatically" programmed to listen to "mainstream" music is useless. Yes, of course, we all have an "acquired" or imposed taste for music, but that doesn't mean King Crimson has to be considered as some kind of weird music that you have to listen after a rite of passage.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2011 at 07:20
Im not an expert in music theory, but isnt it, that every child are exposed to something in 4/4 time, from day 1 they enter the (at least western) world.
The same goes for the melody, as soon as you move avay from the 3-4 main scales, it sounds unusual.
 
My point is that if you try to move people directly from no interest in (advanced) music, to Larks Tounges, they have to cross a very wide range in terms of what they have put in their ears before, and you a very likely to fail.
 
Like never tasted garlic.....You know what im sayin'.  
Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2011 at 09:37
Originally posted by tamijo tamijo wrote:

Im not an expert in music theory, but isnt it, that every child are exposed to something in 4/4 time, from day 1 they enter the (at least western) world.
The same goes for the melody, as soon as you move avay from the 3-4 main scales, it sounds unusual.
 
My point is that if you try to move people directly from no interest in (advanced) music, to Larks Tounges, they have to cross a very wide range in terms of what they have put in their ears before, and you a very likely to fail.
 
Like never tasted garlic.....You know what im sayin'.  
I agree based on experience. I tried to introduce people to the music of King Crimson for years and now I realize it was a stupied move to make. Maybe in the case of "Elephant Talk' where it is adaptable due to the dance beat it has. It is straight forward in that way. But Lizard? Who on the average is going to be interested in that? If people are interested then they will investigate on their own. But then again.....King Crimson are complex? Compared to what specifically? Rio? .....I doubt it. ....and that realization makes this mission all seem worthless to me. If the general public cringes at the sound of early Crimson just imagine how they would react to Rio? After careful observation I have noticed with bands like the Butthole Surfers to Stone Temple Pilots they use some pretty strange Fripp tri-tone distorted guitar and it appeals to a larger crowd. The reason being is the beat of their songs, the vocals, etc. In the same sense Jimmy Page added tri-tone sections to Led Zeppelin songs.

Just as long as that beat and vocal are there to guide the average listener.....it is excepted. Crimson chase people away because they are more daring regarding their time signatures. Many people in society do not feel anything from time signatures which develop an off-beat within a song. A song like "The Ocean" by Led Zeppelin has a driving beat. If it contains a few bizzare changes in the timing it won't really matter to most people. It's that driving beat which entertains them. It's the same old garbage that's been going around for many years.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 28 2011 at 11:10
While we are on the topic of Crimson, the one thing I really respect about this
band is how they stayed viable in the last 10 years, whereas the other major
"big 4" English prog bands (Yes, Genesis, ELP) did not.  I have to single these four out
because of course there were other major English prog bands, they just didn't
have as many sales.  And, of course, Yes, has a new CD, so I can't take that away from them.
Crimson, largely through Fripp's direction most likely, were able to create many new albums,
do many new tours.  I haven't been able to get into this new Crimson music, finding
my harder/aggressive music elsewhere, but I appreciate the ability to adapt.   The thing
I probably don't like about it the most is that it often sounds angry, but in a way I can't
relate to. 


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Robert Pearson
Regenerative Music http://www.regenerativemusic.net
Telical Books http://www.telicalbooks.com
ParaMind Brainstorming Software http://www.paramind.net


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 29 2011 at 11:33
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I would recommend King Crimson to anyone in any situation
...even Discipline! Approve

Originally posted by paganinio paganinio wrote:

Would you recommend King Crimson to someone who's just getting into rock music? I'm talking about someone who knows not Led Zeppelin, Radiohead, maybe a bit of Beatles and Linkin Park (that picture comes to mindStar).

I did such a thing to one of my colleages. I pointed her in the direction of Larks' Tongues In Aspic and Discipline, and said this music would help her focus at work and sleep better at night. I wonder what happened to her.
I think, that were totally wrong choices. If the person likes Beatles or Linkin Park, I would definitely play The Court of the Crimson King. Only the song first, later maybe the whole album.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2011 at 14:48
Agree with In the Court of the Crimson KIng.
Your friend may have found this record more accessible than the others you suggested.
Three of a Perfect Pair might also work for KC first time exposure.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2011 at 15:42
I don't think KC is a good band to start listening prog... they aren't accesible at all.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2011 at 19:29
I would say no, because I was introduced to KC through a friend like it was background noise, and it was too dense to really appreciate.  I only really started to get it when I set aside some time to just relax and go through the whole album.  
I remember trying to listen to the album with Power to believe on it(Discipline I think) in the background and hating it.  But when I really listened to it I felt like my mind was just growing and being charged with new ideas.  Takes a damn unique sound to do that, from then I was hooked.

That said I'm learning epitaph for open mic nights to try and spread prog.  
"Leaders or not we're part of a flock to follow till death, or Glory..."

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2011 at 20:49
Originally posted by paganinio paganinio wrote:

Would you recommend King Crimson to someone who's just getting into rock music? I'm talking about someone who knows not Led Zeppelin, Radiohead, maybe a bit of Beatles and Linkin Park (that picture comes to mindStar).

I did such a thing to one of my colleages. I pointed her in the direction of Larks' Tongues In Aspic and Discipline, and said this music would help her focus at work and sleep better at night. I wonder what happened to her.

This also brings up a topic: how would a person react to avant-prog if she had no prior experience to almost any rock music, and non-mainstream music in general? Would she think it's cool because there's nothing to compare it to, no point of reference? I mean, for a Radiohead fan, avant-prog probably sounds distant and hard to get into. But this person never heard any rock music anyway, there's nothing to be distant from.
It was your responsibility to find out what happened to her. And you should have told her to listen to RED!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2011 at 16:56
In the Court of the Crimson King was the first prog album I ever heard and I loved it. It was an excellent introduction to the genre. Although, I did like many other rock bands at the time unlike the woman you speak of.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2011 at 01:21
I recommend In The Court of the Crimson King. If you ask why, I think it's the only easy listening King Crimson album. If you start with Red or Larks' Tongues in Aspic, probably you won't like.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2011 at 14:57
Originally posted by king cameloyd king cameloyd wrote:

I recommend In The Court of the Crimson King. If you ask why, I think it's the only easy listening King Crimson album. If you start with Red or Larks' Tongues in Aspic, probably you won't like.
Well I certainly equate prog with easy listening, and those are the ones I start out with as I discover new prog bands.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2011 at 07:41
My first post. After 20 odds years I've rediscovered my love for Prog after journeying in the realms of Jazz, 20th Century Classical and Soul (!). Must be honest I can't think of a better thread to make for my first post, because I absolutely love this band.
 
But, the first KC album I bought was Islands, after hearing the title track late at night on a radio show. An extremely accessible and tranquil song, if you can last the 9 minutes or so (and the Miles influenced cornet solos).
 
However, that first side left me gobsmacked and not for the right reasons. I'd never heard anything like it before and it took an eternity to get into. Strangely, I was already listening to Yes, Genesis and ELP at the time, but KC were on a different level altogther.
 
Of course, Islands turns out to be their strangest album and an already esoteric range. If I'd bought ITCOTCK or ITWOP first, then I would have got into the much earlier.
 
The early stuff really now sounds as if it's from a bygone era now. Most younger fans probably wouldn't realise there was an experimental phase in rock music where bands had more or less total freedom to play their own style. I suspect  I would therefore recommend some of the later more electronic efforts to get them into the style. The Construction Of Light, for example, is nowhere near as good as the early 1970's stuff - in fact, it's a pale imitation of their 1974 style, minus any Jazz influence, but it's perfect for giving you a feel for the band's style without being too challenging. One to play on a long car drive to keep you awake.

While LTIA is probably their most original work, there's a danger it could sound like white noise to some.
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