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rdtprog

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Posted: July 28 2011 at 16:54

GypsyJoker wrote:

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

I'm thinking this is the end, except for the obligatory live album and DVD. Time has not been kind to Squire.

Nah, they'll just replace him with the bassist from a tribute band.

Yes will still exist 200 years from now, with original members' great-great-great-great-grandchildren, tribute-band members, and Steve Howe.

Yes is eternal... Wink

Jon said it in the past...

ferush

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Posted: July 28 2011 at 17:24

Every Yes album is good, even the Talk album

bestteragold View Drop Down

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Posted: July 28 2011 at 21:39

YES, I THINK SO. And the tracklisting: 1. Fly From right here - Overture, 2. Fly From right here - Pt I - we are able to Fly, 3. Fly From right here - Pt II - Sad evening on the Airfield, 4. Fly From right here - Pt III - Madman on the Screens, 5. Fly From right here - Pt IV - Bumpy Ride, 6. Fly From right here - Pt V - we are able to Fly Reprise, 7. The person You invariably wanted Me To Be, 8. lifestyle on the film Set, 9. Hour Of Need, 10. Solitaire, 11. to the Storm

cstack3

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Posted: July 28 2011 at 23:22

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

I'm thinking this is the end, except for the obligatory live album and DVD. Time has not been kind to Squire.

Well, Squire clearly doesn't think so!!

http://www.mercurynews.com/music/ci_18532630?nclick_check=1

"Squire says the group will likely spend much of the next few years on tour supporting "Fly From Here," its first studio album in 10 years."

....much of the NEXT FEW YEARS?? Who does he think are going to buy the tickets?? Old-time Yes fans are already checking out on this band from what I'm reading elsewhere (Yesfans etc.)

chopper

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Posted: July 29 2011 at 07:12

bestteragold wrote:

YES, I THINK SO. And the tracklisting: 1. Fly From right here - Overture, 2. Fly From right here - Pt I - we are able to Fly, 3. Fly From right here - Pt II - Sad evening on the Airfield, 4. Fly From right here - Pt III - Madman on the Screens, 5. Fly From right here - Pt IV - Bumpy Ride, 6. Fly From right here - Pt V - we are able to Fly Reprise, 7. The person You invariably wanted Me To Be, 8. lifestyle on the film Set, 9. Hour Of Need, 10. Solitaire, 11. to the Storm

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Posted: July 29 2011 at 08:39

bestteragold wrote:

7. The person You invariably wanted Me To Be,

That's what i'm calling that song from now on

''Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal.''

- Albert Camus

ghost_of_morphy View Drop Down

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Posted: July 29 2011 at 10:58

cstack3 wrote:

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

I'm thinking this is the end, except for the obligatory live album and DVD. Time has not been kind to Squire.

Well, Squire clearly doesn't think so!!

http://www.mercurynews.com/music/ci_18532630?nclick_check=1

"Squire says the group will likely spend much of the next few years on tour supporting "Fly From Here," its first studio album in 10 years."

....much of the NEXT FEW YEARS?? Who does he think are going to buy the tickets?? Old-time Yes fans are already checking out on this band from what I'm reading elsewhere (Yesfans etc.)

Well, they did spend most of a decade touring in support of Magnification.

darkshade

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Posted: July 29 2011 at 17:36

So I stood in the record shop yesterday, with Fly From Here in my hand, deciding if I really wanted to purchase it. There have been so many mixed reactions to this album online, that I wasn't sure I'd enjoy it. I also am not the biggest fan of their 90s and 2000s work. I walked around the store "browsing", when in reality I was walking around going "should I buy it? Should I pass?". Ive never taken that long to figure out if I should buy or not.

But I eventually gave in.

I'm listening to it now for the first time, and the FFH suite is almost done, and I have to say, it was a lot more enjoyable than I thought it would be. We'll see how the rest of the album fares.

Edited by darkshade - July 29 2011 at 17:37

My Last.fm

cstack3

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Posted: July 29 2011 at 18:09

darkshade wrote:

So I stood in the record shop yesterday, with Fly From Here in my hand, deciding if I really wanted to purchase it. There have been so many mixed reactions to this album online, that I wasn't sure I'd enjoy it. I also am not the biggest fan of their 90s and 2000s work. I walked around the store "browsing", when in reality I was walking around going "should I buy it? Should I pass?". Ive never taken that long to figure out if I should buy or not.

But I eventually gave in.

I'm listening to it now for the first time, and the FFH suite is almost done, and I have to say, it was a lot more enjoyable than I thought it would be. We'll see how the rest of the album fares.

Yeah, it's not too bad! However, I'm waiting to find a used CD copy so I can rob Squire of his royalty!

The online streaming link that Slartibartfast posted was a nice gift, thanks man! I didn't know about that site!

http://totallyfuzzy.blogspot.com/2011/07/yes-fly-from-here-album-stream.html

darkshade

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Posted: July 29 2011 at 18:12

It's not bad. After the suite, I'm not sure how I feel. I'll give it a few more listens before I make an assessment.

My Last.fm

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Posted: July 30 2011 at 13:12

cstack3 wrote:

The online streaming link that Slartibartfast posted was a nice gift, thanks man! I didn't know about that site!

http://totallyfuzzy.blogspot.com/2011/07/yes-fly-from-here-album-stream.html

Holy cow, I just pulled it up browsing. Digging in deeper right now and it looks like a really cool site. It seems to be dedicated to the whole listen to it for yourself first philosophy.

Edited by Slartibartfast - July 30 2011 at 13:13

Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

lucas

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Posted: July 30 2011 at 13:19

I listened to it for a few mn. Nothing grabbed my attention, very amateurish music for such big names.

Edited by lucas - July 30 2011 at 13:21

"Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood)

leonalvarado View Drop Down

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Posted: July 30 2011 at 18:11

I see people getting pretty brutal about Benoit and the band in general. Despite that, it looks like this album is doing better in sales than what some people expected. Maybe the controversy helps after all.

In all, I think the biggest mistake people are making about the new line-up is comparing it with the old. Sure, it only makes sense except that the band has taken a new direction altogether. In a way, it is sort of like when Peter Gabriel left Genesis and Roger Waters left Pink Floyd. The music changed but still was good (in Genesis case to a point but, in Pink Floyd's case I liked the albums without Waters as much as the ones with him on them).

Let's say you never had heard of Yes and "Fly From Here" were the first album you listen to. I think everyone here would think is at least as good as any Camel album (which are, in their own right, very good indeed). At worst, you would think it's a little "lighter" than it should but keep in mind the times we are living in and what really sells out there. Sure, you may want to put out an album of a particular music but what if that market doesn't have enough money to pay for the bills? Then what?

To achieve certain amount of financial success, you can't deter too far from a formula. All of our favourite bands had always worked worked under those circumstances. It so happened that in the late sixties and for the most part of the seventies, the type of music that we call progressive rock would sell out stadiums. That's not the case anymore. Only name recognition and popularity will sell a stadium out these days.

2007, Genesis does a reunion tour and goes for huge venues. Many of those people were the old and faithful but many were people who knew that Genesis were a huge band before. They went for the opportunity to say that they had seen Genesis live. Same goes for the Stones, Pink Floyd, Queen, etc.

So, what's wrong in just pleasing the old fans? Simply said, they don't spend the money as they once used to. The recording industry is in a decline and it has been so since the introduction of music downloads. Illegal copying of music surpasses real music sales by astronomical figures. If a band sold 500,000 copies of an album, in today's number they would just sell a tenth of that. Of course the rule doesn't apply to very commercial music so therefore the compromise. Yes could not sell records like the Yes from the past even if they resonated like "Close To The Edge".

"Fly From Here" presents us with a new perspective of the band. Never mind the politics, to us listeners it should not be about politics. I said it many times, it should be about the music. And, in this particular place, it should be about the music of today and not a comparison to the past. We need to give the band the latitude they need in order to do business in today's environment. The "let's get together and do some wonderful music" attitude has evolve into a business with real expenses and overhead that needs to make certain amount in order to survive.

Some people are saying that they should have released the album under a different name. Really? If you spent the last 43 years of your life building your brand equity, would you walk away from all that if you knew you didn't have to? Some people have the gull to tell the band to retire. Again, would you retire from the only way you know how to make a living? I don't think so.

People are more naive when thinking about their musical heroes. Sure, they make more money than most of us but don't be fooled. They also have bigger expenses than most of us. Bands like Yes stopped raking in the millions of dollars many years ago. Do you think these people like the idea of gruelling tours at the age of sixty and sixty plus?

But back to the album, I finally found the time to write a proper review of the thing in here:

http://leonblogaswords.blogspot.com/2011/07/fly-from-here-full-review.html

Please feel free to read it and comment on it. I'm posting many things related to Yes, Jethro Tull, progressive music and my working relation with all of it under my blog.

I hope you enjoy.

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Posted: July 31 2011 at 10:29

leonalvarado wrote:

I see people getting pretty brutal about Benoit and the band in general. Despite that, it looks like this album is doing better in sales than what some people expected. Maybe the controversy helps after all.

Most people seem to be quite positive towards the album. I've heard some brutal (and surprising) comments about David live. Yes came by here on the first two tours with them and I heard them both times. David was good. (It was Oliver Wakeman who wasn't always up to snuff.) Maybe he's having problems this time around or maybe not. I haven't heard him this time.

leonalvarado wrote:

In all, I think the biggest mistake people are making about the new line-up is comparing it with the old. Sure, it only makes sense except that the band has taken a new direction altogether. In a way, it is sort of like when Peter Gabriel left Genesis and Roger Waters left Pink Floyd. The music changed but still was good (in Genesis case to a point but, in Pink Floyd's case I liked the albums without Waters as much as the ones with him on them).

I don't think any of us expected another Close to the Edge, another Going for the One, or even another The Ladder. Some people obviously had their hopes up for a second Drama, but thankfully we didn't get that either. What we got is simplified, sophisticated and very well produced. It's more like The Buggles than anything else you might expect (which Drama definitely wasn't.) It also reminds me of Squire and Nardelli's album that resurrected The Syn a bit.

leonalvarado wrote:

Let's say you never had heard of Yes and "Fly From Here" were the first album you listen to. I think everyone here would think is at least as good as any Camel album (which are, in their own right, very good indeed). At worst, you would think it's a little "lighter" than it should but keep in mind the times we are living in and what really sells out there. Sure, you may want to put out an album of a particular music but what if that market doesn't have enough money to pay for the bills? Then what?

I personally wouldn't put it up against any Camel album prior to The Single Factor except maybe for Breathless. (I happen to llike most of I Can See Your House From Here.) If I heard Yes for the first time on Fly From Here and heard nothing else about them, my reaction would be that that's a decent ablum but I've heard better things that I'm more interested in exploring.

leonalvarado wrote:

To achieve certain amount of financial success, you can't deter too far from a formula. All of our favourite bands had always worked worked under those circumstances. It so happened that in the late sixties and for the most part of the seventies, the type of music that we call progressive rock would sell out stadiums. That's not the case anymore. Only name recognition and popularity will sell a stadium out these days.

Legacy bands like Yes make most of their money off their history and their touring and their merchandising. This point doesn't really make much sense when discussing their most current work, except to point out that Yes does have a certain dedication to moving forward instead of resting on their laurels. Skipping ahead....

leonalvarado wrote:

"Fly From Here" presents us with a new perspective of the band. Never mind the politics, to us listeners it should not be about politics. I said it many times, it should be about the music. And, in this particular place, it should be about the music of today and not a comparison to the past. We need to give the band the latitude they need in order to do business in today's environment. The "let's get together and do some wonderful music" attitude has evolve into a business with real expenses and overhead that needs to make certain amount in order to survive.

It's ok to miss Jon. David does an excellent job on vocals, but Jon brought much more to Yes than that.

leonalvarado wrote:

Some people are saying that they should have released the album under a different name. Really? If you spent the last 43 years of your life building your brand equity, would you walk away from all that if you knew you didn't have to? Some people have the gull to tell the band to retire. Again, would you retire from the only way you know how to make a living? I don't think so..

Old arguments to all of us old fans. As far as three of these musicians are involved, you can call yourself Yes in my book: Anderson, Wakeman, Kaye, White, Bruford, Howe, Squire, And I might be understanding if Banks, Rabin, Khoroshev or Moraz were involved.

leonalvarado wrote:

People are more naive when thinking about their musical heroes. Sure, they make more money than most of us but don't be fooled. They also have bigger expenses than most of us. Bands like Yes stopped raking in the millions of dollars many years ago. Do you think these people like the idea of gruelling tours at the age of sixty and sixty plus?

Well, Anderson and Wakeman claim they don't!

Looks like Anderson/Wakeman is going on the road again soon too. Best Yes affiliated project since Bruford!!!! Skipping the rest....

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Posted: July 31 2011 at 11:37

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

Most people seem to be quite positive towards the album. I've heard some brutal (and surprising) comments about David live. Yes came by here on the first two tours with them and I heard them both times. David was good. (It was Oliver Wakeman who wasn't always up to snuff.) Maybe he's having problems this time around or maybe not. I haven't heard him this time.

You are right about the complaints mostly when Benoit sings live. I have seen Yes with Benoit and Oliver a couple of times. The first time around it seemed that Wakeman wasn't up to snuff. The second time was the other way around, Oliver sounded very good whilst Benoit was very "off" in places.

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

I don't think any of us expected another Close to the Edge, another Going for the One, or even another The Ladder. Some people obviously had their hopes up for a second Drama, but thankfully we didn't get that either. What we got is simplified, sophisticated and very well produced. It's more like The Buggles than anything else you might expect (which Drama definitely wasn't.) It also reminds me of Squire and Nardelli's album that resurrected The Syn a bit.

When the album was announced, people kept writing about their expectations of it. The feeling I got was that they expected things to be going towards "Going for the One". Chris Squire kept telling people that they were heading back towards the way they did things during "Close To The Edge". That may not necessarily mean the sound itself but that's the way many took it to be.

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

I personally wouldn't put it up against any Camel album prior to The Single Factor except maybe for Breathless. (I happen to llike most of I Can See Your House From Here.) If I heard Yes for the first time on Fly From Here and heard nothing else about them, my reaction would be that that's a decent ablum but I've heard better things that I'm more interested in exploring.

I do love Camel. I specially like "I Can See Your House From Here". I even dedicated one of my songs to the late Pete Barden. Camel was a great band but they always had a lighter touch than let's say, Yes, Genesis or Gentle Giant. Their productions were always extra-clean and in that respect, "Fly From Here" reminds me of them. Perhaps I should have gone further in my description of the context.

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

Legacy bands like Yes make most of their money off their history and their touring and their merchandising. This point doesn't really make much sense when discussing their most current work, except to point out that Yes does have a certain dedication to moving forward instead of resting on their laurels. Skipping ahead....

Even though that is the practicality of it, most of what you call "legacy bands" do not see themselves as that. I know, I worked for a few of them. They like to keep moving forward and often do not like the fact that they have to keep going to the old catalogue in order to sell tickets. Also, many of those bands do not have enough money to "rest on their laurels". The point is valid regarding the new recording because it influences what sort of output they will have to create in order to grow their audiences. Keep in mind that to us is about music, to them, it is a business which premises are changing rapidly.

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

It's ok to miss Jon. David does an excellent job on vocals, but Jon brought much more to Yes than that.

Indeed, it is OK to miss Jon. Dwelling on it going past three years and still rant about it is just pointless. It will not bring him back into the band, (and that's not saying that he'd never come back because like I pointed out before, it is a business).

ghost_of_morphy wrote:

Well, Anderson and Wakeman claim they don't!

Looks like Anderson/Wakeman is going on the road again soon too. Best Yes affiliated project since Bruford!!!! Skipping the rest....

Believe me, to these guys not making much money still brings at least an income in the high six figures. Unless you are the CEO of something, I doubt you make that much. I know I don't. LOL

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Posted: July 31 2011 at 12:14

^ There are some valid points from both in this segment of the thread, but, as one of the "ranters", I'll make a couple of comments:

1. Of course they have the right to call themselves Yes. I just think it might have been better if they had not. Incidentally, I am of this opinion with my favourite band, Marillion. After Fish left, I think they should have changed the name - so, BTW, does Steve Hogarth.

2. What none of this debate takes away is how Anderson was treated. He is a founding member of the band, and, like it or not, the instantly recognisable face/voice of the band. For Squire or Howe to not even contact him when he was on death's door is nothing short of appalling. You'd get better treatment with 99% of employers, let alone your so-called friends and colleagues. That is not a "rant" - it is simple human dignity and the truth.

3. The tour is nothing more than a cash cow. Good luck to them, I suppose, but to describe it as anything else is a travesty of the truth. I also think they have been "found out". I don't take any pleasure in that fact, either.

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Posted: July 31 2011 at 12:27

lazland wrote:

^ There are some valid points from both in this segment of the thread, but, as one of the "ranters", I'll make a couple of comments:

Can't disagree Laz...watched those videos and even ignoring the issue of being prepared for paying fans, which is bad enough, I see very little passion in the eyes of the guys on stage. This is what we used to call "phoning it in."

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Posted: July 31 2011 at 12:48

lazland wrote:

^ There are some valid points from both in this segment of the thread, but, as one of the "ranters", I'll make a couple of comments:

1. Who could blame Hogarth?

2. Hmmmm.... Was it the same illness that forced Rick to stop touring?

3...You weren't specific.. Is it Yes that is milking the cash cow? I think most of that figured that 20 or 30 years ago. Or is it Anderson / Wakeman? Aren't those guys both way too sick to tour?

Frankly, if Rick and Jon can tour together and make a few bucks and please a few fans I'm all for it. And it is the best Yes affiliated project going now (The Steve Howe Trio is in the running though.)

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Posted: August 01 2011 at 12:20

lazland wrote:

^ There are some valid points from both in this segment of the thread, but, as one of the "ranters", I'll make a couple of comments:

Thanks as always, Lazland! Rant away! Here, let me spell you:

I'm disappointed that Yes has taken a very predictable, 1970's band-in-21st-Century approach to all of this. Hire the tribute singer off of YouTube (Journey and Boston did it first, as have others); recycle old material & make minimal effort with new product (FFH, which incorporates 30 year old Buggles tunes??). Then tour mostly small venues and hope for the best.

Yes would have impressed me much more if they brought in another groundbreaking singer altogether, such as Annie Haslam (who did an impressive "Turn of the Century" with Howe, and was also involved in Starcastle's last attempt at a comeback.)

Why not a woman to freshen the sound of the band? Women singers in rock are the leading edge, and it would have invited much curiosity to the gigs, perhaps even a younger fan dynamic.

Instead, this "tour" reeks of similar "comeback" stuff by REO Speedwagon, Peter Frampton and other AOR war-horses of the '70s. Fer God's sake, when Styx of all people are reportedly blowing you off the stage night after night, something isn't right!!

Been here, done that....I worked very hard to help Captain Beyond in their comeback back in 2000-2001 (I have promo material that is very rare, to die for) & they went the same route. They couldn't get core members Rod Evans and Lee Dorman back, so guitarist Rhino and drummer Bobby Caldwell tried to make do with stand-ins on vocals and bass. Old fans heard the product and checked out, CB never got farther than a few gigs in Florida.

You can fool some of the fans some of the time, but ya can't fool us all of the time. Anderson/Wakeman will sell out some impressive, huge venues and play a limited number of gigs because they want to, and they will avoid the day-to-day touring grind Yes is going through because they can. They'll sell the tickets, watch for it.

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Posted: August 01 2011 at 12:40

cstack3 wrote:

lazland wrote:

^ There are some valid points from both in this segment of the thread, but, as one of the "ranters", I'll make a couple of comments:

Thanks as always, Lazland! Rant away! Here, let me spell you:

Why not a woman to freshen the sound of the band? Women singers in rock are the leading edge, and it would have invited much curiosity to the gigs, perhaps even a younger fan dynamic.

I think you've hit the nail on the head about what turns me off about the current Yes. They aren't bad, they're just..... playing to the 'comeback tour' cliche, which makes the music itself drab and dull.

Fly From Here is also not particularly progressive at all, which wouldn't be a problem if it didn't try to be progressive, but it does. It tries very hard to use odd time signatures, big key changes.... not to mention to length of the title piece. 20 minutes, how predictable! These elements aren't progressive any more, they scream "1970s". Take 'Bumpy Ride' for instance.... apart from it not really fitting with the surrounding music, it is obvious that Howe is trying to impress or 'lure' prog rock fans in with this piece of music, because every odd bar is in 7/8 and the chords are a bit funny. Does that make it good? no.

In fact, the best moments on the album are the (probably Horn-penned) choruses.... the vocal hooks and the uplifting chord sequences. Are these progressive? No, but if a band is able to create them, and they are good (and I think they are, at times, very good), then why not go in that direction?

In short, attempting to be progressive by using 40-year old musical building-blocks is both bad for the music, and embarrassing to the band. Creating something really progressive, i.e. innovative and fresh, would have been much better, but obviously not within this group's reach. So, proving that they are able to write decent pop choruses, I think Yes should be focussing on that market.

Oh wait, that's what Asia's for.

Maybe we just don't need Yes any more!!!