Things you're really, really NOT into. (not music)

Epignosis wrote: Saperlipopette! wrote: GaryB wrote: Do I believe Oswald acted alone?   No Do I believe Marilyn accidently ODed?   No Do I believe pot makes you stupid?   No (it makes everyone else seem stupid) Do I believe in global warming? No  (but it is a mistake to cut down rain forests so people can eat more Big Macs and Whoppers) Do I believe in gun rights?   You bet your AK47 I do I have very little intrerest in the three first points, but the two last ones are pretty important. Its comforting to know that you're a very old man, as most gunswinging environmental sceptics are.  I'm 27.  I think global warming alarmists are silly.  I like people having guns to protect their homes, families, and persons. A pity you missed the long discussion we had here several months ago about the incredible futility of gun control legislation in decreasing violent crime.  It's probably in the first Libertarian thread somewhere.

Saperlipopette wouldn't be easy to sung in any language in any opera...

Global warming is real. Just ask a polar bear.  It will probably claw you to death and eat you, but what the hell?

Dean wrote: The T wrote: Epignosis wrote: Saperlipopette! wrote: GaryB wrote: Do I believe Oswald acted alone?   No Do I believe Marilyn accidently ODed?   No Do I believe pot makes you stupid?   No (it makes everyone else seem stupid) Do I believe in global warming? No  (but it is a mistake to cut down rain forests so people can eat more Big Macs and Whoppers) Do I believe in gun rights?   You bet your AK47 I do I have very little intrerest in the three first points, but the two last ones are pretty important. Its comforting to know that you're a very old man, as most gunswinging environmental sceptics are.  I'm 27.  I think global warming alarmists are silly.  I like people having guns to protect their homes, families, and persons. A pity you missed the long discussion we had here several months ago about the incredible futility of gun control legislation in decreasing violent crime.  It's probably in the first Libertarian thread somewhere.   And I'm 32. I believe in global warning. I also believe now firmly in gun rights. You can't put people in the same basket, Saperli... whatever.  I don't believe in your right to have such a horrible nickname though..  I'm 54 and accept the possibility of global warming though I am pragmatic enough to appreciate that predicting anything to do with climate is a futile endevour, especially when basing those predictions on disparate measurements over relatively small geological timeperiod.

I think it's pretty obvious from the overwhelming scientific consensus that the planet has overall warmed (~2 degrees Celcius) in the past...half century or century I think. If it gets up to 7, many parts of the world are pretty much f**ked (Rob, you might be interested to note that Florida would be mostly underwater if that temperature change happens). I'm willing to grant that a little bit of that could be due to the natural course of events for earth, but I think it's plain hubris to think humanity isn't doing a lot of damage when you understand how greenhouse gases work.

Global Warming (more accurately Global Climate Change, given the effects of the warming) is real, but I believe we'll run low on fossil fuels right about the time it becomes a huge issue. We're already developing alternative fuels, but the best sources (solar, wind, tidal) are kind of hard to harness. As long as we keep developing the alternate sources, we'll be ok.

If not, then I have a drastic point of view on humanity. It's hard to shake the notion (brought up in the Matrix and elsewhere) that humanity is a virus. Most organisms live in some semblance of balance with nature, living and dying according with natural selection. In many ways, humanity moved past that and began raping nature after the Industrial Revolution, thinking it will all grow back. Some of it might, but a lot of things like fossil fuels don't come back for millennia. We may kill ourselves off, through war, famine, lack of water, or climate change, and trying to think of earth from an alien's perspective...good riddance. The earth will have finally shaken off a horrible pest and can go back to a less chaotic life until it dies.

Just a few months ago, one of the UN Climate Council bigshots on this issue was being interviewed by a European journalist.  He came right out and publicly admitted that they don't care if man made "climate change" is real or not, because the issue has now become more of a tool of wealth redistribution primarily, and this was what is important.  In other words they could force through litigation with this issue monies from "wealthy" countries that they could not extract by other means. 

So if there ever is evidence that climate change is not caused by our activities, or impacted only a very little, will the people in this field ever admit it? Or will they obscure it and bury it because they *need* the issue to remain a crisis?

Henry Plainview wrote: Epignosis wrote: stonebeard wrote: I think it's pretty obvious from the overwhelming scientific consensus that the planet has overall warmed (~2 degrees Celcius) in the past...half century or century I think. If it gets up to 7, many parts of the world are pretty much f**ked You may be interested to know that about 35 years ago, we were in a global cooling crisis Yes, everybody knows that. The model was completely different (and, obviously, flawed) and that really has no bearing on the current issues. We've realized a lot of things from the seventies were actually stupid. Like bell bottoms and disco. Going buh buh buh they were wrong before! is completely missing the point and ignoring the evidence that has been presented so far. I'm not interested in getting into a long citations-ridden debate with you, but while I agree people should think critically about the information they receive (and I'm not saying Al Gore didn't get a little hyperbolic to try to get people to pay attention), AGW "skepticism" is either willfully ignorant or kind of stupid. Although at least I can be thankful that the Republican party and their cronies like the Washington Times generally aren't anti-vaccine too, like the damn Huffington Post, because then I would go crazy.

You obviously missed my point, because you took my remark out of context.

I never called myself a "global warming skeptic."  I said earlier that I think global warming alarmists are silly.  In other words (and to bring this back on topic), fearmongering is something I'm really, really NOT into.

Time for Q&A with Jammun .  I am always a reliable source.  (I'm 57 by the way, have seen it all, and never prevaricate, except sometimes.)

Q.  Were bell bottoms stupid?
A.  No, not in the 60's.  In the 70's, the pot smokers moved to boot-cut jeans anyway.  Them big shirt collars were pretty stupid.  Let's not get into leisure suits here. 

Q.  Was disco stupid?
A.  Yes, actually, though it thrived until the subculture that liked it most started killing themselves off at about the same time.

Q.  Would you blame this love of disco on the subculture?
A.  No.  It was strictly a result of subpar Broadway musicals during the era.

Q.  Does global warming exist?
A.  Yes, apparently.

Q.  Does at the same time localized cooling exist?
A.  Yes, apparently.

Q.  How do we reconcile this discrepancy?
A.  Legalize marijuana.

Q.  Should unrestricted ownership of guns be allowed?
A.  See 70's bumper sticker:  when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.

Q.  I saw a case in India, where a rogue elephant had killed many villagers.
A.  Elephants don't worry, but they ought to be more careful...they're setting a bad example.

Q.  I saw a case in Peru, where a bus plunge killed many travellers.
A.  Bus drivers ought to be more careful...

Q.  How'd you feel about that hawk ripping apart a live starling in your back yard yesterday?
A.  Rats and starlings, Big Macs of the raptor world.

Q.  How about the incessant rain in Seattle this year?
A.  What's new?

Q.  Consider global warming.  What about the 100-year floods that now occur biennially?
A.  This ain't no party, this ain't no disco.

It's easy to be a weather forecaster in Seattle

Saperlipopette! wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Saperlipopette! wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Saperlipopette! wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Saperlipopette! wrote: - Advertisment in our streets on TV, at the movies, on radio etc... - ... gun right activism - Taking the bus, tube of tram. Train is ok. - ... marjuana - ...self-proclaimed anarchists - So called enviromental skepticism - 911 Truth Movement (Truthers) - Massproduced crap from IKEA and similar concepts - Parenthood Looking back at your list you're like the anti-me. Wow, a conservative sociopath with a head full of conspiracy theories. But I like a little danger and you're not into dreadlocks, incense or emoticons so I might have a crush on you after all. I"m about the furthest you can get from a conservative. Conservatives hate Anarchists more than Communists. I don't think I believe in any conspiracy theories either. As you customised my list, kept the stuff you kept and called yourself the anti me, how could I not assume you weren't portraiting yourself as a gun right activist/global warning sceptic and truther who enjoyed massproduced crap, anarchy and marihuana? It reminded me of a Ted Kaczynski kind of conservative. 9/11 truther does not imply conspiracy theorist. But yes I am a gun activist, global warming skeptic, who enjoys marijuana, mass produced crap. I'm also an anarchist which is like a conservative's anti-matter. A truther might not think of him-or herself as a conspiracy theorist, but everyone else thinks of you as one. Same goes for the "global warming scepisism". I've also met plenty of Marihuanasmoking conspiracy theorists, so it kind of makes sense. Nobody outside the US understands your gun right activism, and I've always associated it with your countries conservatives. But you seem to be a  more a complex fella who cherrypicks your extremes from the worst of both worlds. Where I live hardly no one ever gets killed, and we've never had a high school massacre. Because we don't have all these weapons lying around. Simple as that.

Edited by Equality 7-2521 - January 15 2011 at 12:12

I'd say I disagree with Newton's laws of motion, but I wouldn't want to cause any friction.  I already said the gravity of global warming is overstated.