The Voice Of Gabriel or Collins in Genesis Songs |
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Formentera Lady
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 20 2010 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 1795 |
Posted: December 12 2010 at 06:18 | |
Absolutely agree. I'd like to add that Peter Gabriel sings the lines with more compassion and meaning, e.g. the line "Through the door a harvest feast is lit by candlelight" the "through" is a half tone lower than "the door" and "lit" is the highest note in the line, which makes perfectly sense, whereas Phil Collins sings the whole song, as if it does not mean anything at all to him (and probably it does not). |
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CCVP
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 15 2007 Location: Vitória, Brasil Status: Offline Points: 7971 |
Posted: December 12 2010 at 08:59 | |
Wow, somebody actually agreed! That's unheard of. |
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Negoba
Prog Reviewer Joined: July 24 2008 Location: Big Muddy Status: Offline Points: 5208 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 08:31 | |
Singing can be a million things, how well do you produce pure tones, how well do you do complex melodies, can you do a deep dragonvoice, but what matters most is how do you communicate with your audience.
Neither Phil Collins or Peter Gabriel can produce pure tones like Art Garfunkel. Collins is probably a little better, and from live tapes was much less likely to actually sing out of tune. But neither can do vocal acrobatics very well.
But Gabriel was one of the best vocalists ever in the range of dramatic expression and range of emotional communication.
I've been watching video of Collins doing Supper's Ready and Musical Box and Carpet Crawlers and it's just weak. There's just not enough pathos in his voice or his soul to pull that stuff off.
One other important point, however, is that going back and watching the Gabriel-era video, you realize how much having Collins' second voice really was an integral part of the classic sound.
And finally, gotta have the flute. and the makeup. and costumes.
Collins plays a mean trapset though. He was a beast on the skins.
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You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 20030 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 08:43 | |
Gabriel has a menace in his voice that Collins cannot match. Compare and contrast the "me, I'm just a lawnmower" bit in the original and live versions. Also, Collins adds some annoying bits such as "Stickleback, back back" in Carpet Crawlers (which I recently saw a Genesis tribute band do as well). Collins is a great singer but he lacks Gabriel's character.
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DisgruntledPorcupine
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 16 2010 Location: Thunder Bay CAN Status: Offline Points: 4395 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 09:01 | |
Edited by DisgruntledPorcupine - December 13 2010 at 09:01 |
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thehallway
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 13 2010 Location: Dorset, England Status: Offline Points: 1433 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 10:34 | |
Both are rather nasal and annoying for long periods, Gabriel less so.
In fact I would go as far as to say that they are my least favourite vocalists from "all the greats" in prog.....
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Icarium
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: March 21 2008 Location: Tigerstaden Status: Offline Points: 34055 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 10:59 | |
well they are definitly not Freddy Mercury
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Hercules
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 14 2007 Location: Near York UK Status: Offline Points: 7024 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 17:40 | |
Collins was, in the early years after he took over, a perfectly competent vocalist, especially considering what he had to follow.
But he isn't Peter Gabriel by a very long way. But few, if any people, are fit to compare with this most charismatic of all 70s vocalists.. |
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A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life.
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DomValela
Forum Groupie Joined: January 02 2010 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 71 |
Posted: December 13 2010 at 17:50 | |
I think that they're both great vocalists, but for different reasons. On a technical level, PC is probably better...you hear his seemingly infinite range jump around throughout Seconds Out, really. But PG is more soulful and dramatic, and his rasps and nasal notes add to the effect that he tries to give his vocal parts (at least in the Genesis material. His 80's and 90's vocals are much more controlled and...normal. Still great! )
Edited by DomValela - December 13 2010 at 19:17 |
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...all around, all around, all around, all around...
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cemego
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 18 2010 Location: Philadelphia PA Status: Offline Points: 515 |
Posted: December 14 2010 at 12:42 | |
I have always loved Genesis. Musically I like the PG years more, but for music AND voice, I would say my favorite era of Genesis is 1976-78. The hackett/collins years (including andthentherewere3). Collins was a good singer then. I heard he didn't start his bombastic shouting until Conny Plank told him he was "a soul singer" in 79-80. I don't know if there is any truth to that, but I think that's when his voice drifted away from my liking. After 79, it seemed like he did more screaming and shouting then singing. I think his ego took over. Thank god Banks and Rutherford were still writing or Genesis, I think, would have totally gone down the tubes. I personally still lean to the Banks written stuff anyways. |
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listen to streaming stuff! no commercials!
http://wmom.servemp3.com:8000/listen.pls |
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friso
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 24 2007 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 2506 |
Posted: December 14 2010 at 14:39 | |
I do not understand why this topic isn't moved.
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Mystery
Forum Groupie Joined: August 17 2010 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 41 |
Posted: December 15 2010 at 09:19 | |
Gabriel has a nice voice, and I've grown to love it, but at the start I sort of hated it.
Collins, on the other hand, has a more refined voice, which I don't like quite as much. It's still fairly good, though. |
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Rabid
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 20 2008 Location: Bridge of Knows Status: Offline Points: 512 |
Posted: December 15 2010 at 12:06 | |
I'm not too sure that PG would be interested in singing PC's sentimental slop. PC can't put any real feel into old Genesis stuff cos' he did'nt write the songs, and does'nt know the motivation behind them. That's the difference for me.......Collins may be the singer, but Gabriel was the song.
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"...the thing IS, to put a motor in yourself..."
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ferush
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 26 2006 Location: Mexico Status: Offline Points: 363 |
Posted: December 15 2010 at 15:40 | |
Phil made it great as soon as Gabriel left.
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pinegard
Forum Newbie Joined: December 12 2010 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 2 |
Posted: December 15 2010 at 15:43 | |
I think Phil is a good singer (and a fantastic drummer) at least the last years of the seventies.But he lacked Peter Gabriels warmth. I´ll go for feeling any time over technique.
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esky
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 12 2009 Location: Los Angeles, CA Status: Offline Points: 643 |
Posted: December 15 2010 at 17:31 | |
I wouldn't go as far as light years for this comparison. The bravura Phil added to the In the Cage medley on Three Sides Live made Gabriel's album version seem flat. I mean it's everything you'd want Collins to be on an old Gabriel-sung song. And I'll contend till my dying day that what Collins achieved with A Trick of the Tail greatly lessened the drama of Gabriel's flight from the band.
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meeka2661
Forum Newbie Joined: December 10 2009 Status: Offline Points: 15 |
Posted: December 18 2010 at 00:02 | |
Peter
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sorcerer kermes
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 02 2008 Location: Iran Status: Offline Points: 102 |
Posted: December 22 2010 at 15:15 | |
both great but gabriel is beyond great!!
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 27 2004 Location: Peru Status: Offline Points: 19535 |
Posted: December 22 2010 at 17:15 | |
Are you crazy? In the Cage is one of the worst tracks by Colins Gabriel version expresses fear, claustrophobia, and panic, his semi yodel creates a sensation of anguish and being hopelessly trapped, while Collins version is flat with no changes. An artist must convince, and while Gabriel version creates the sensation of being trapped in a cage, Collins transmits nothing, it's well sung, but emotionless. Now, A Trick of the Tail is no Gabriel album, but being you entered into that territory, I must say that is beautiful, but closer to the way you will narrate a fairy story to a child, compare with the brutal violence of The Knife, Musical Box or the dramatic capture of Hermafroditus body in Fountain of Salmacis. I insist, miles behind. Iván Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - December 22 2010 at 17:19 |
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JeanFrame
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 01 2010 Location: London, England Status: Offline Points: 195 |
Posted: December 22 2010 at 17:38 | |
Phil did a good job of taking over - a very good job - but a copy isn't an original. Gabriel wasn't necessarily the better singer, but he had character and depth and a voice of his own. It's not really fair to expect Phil to do the early Gabriel songs and yet transcend what was there before; generally, that doesn't work, and I don't think you can say that Phil outdid Gabriel in that respect, though he too had a voice of his own when it came to the 'new' Genesis songs.
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