Would You Die For Your Country? |
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Textbook
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 08 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3281 |
Topic: Would You Die For Your Country? Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:24 |
I wouldn't.
I think one of the more profound sociological changes in the last few decades (the sentiment doesn't begin with Vietnam but it snowballs from there) is that people feel a lot more resentful about things their government/countries ask them to do. The internet is increasingly making us feel like citizens of the world itself and less beholden to a particular region or system. Which I think is a good thing because it's paving the way for global organisations and co-operation which we'll need to tackle global problems. Countries sink things like fighting climate change because they all try to get everybody else to do everything and play the blame game. The less importance people give them, the more people might be inclined to ignore borders and boundaries and just do what's best.
Personally, the more I learn and experience the more obvious it becomes that countries are essentially fictitious and that politicians do not care about the individual human lives of their populace. (Arguably though, being a politician would be unworkable if they did.) What is important to me is human life and I would die to save family, friends and even strangers. But my country? Preserving a particular political agenda? No. I would go to the toilet on the flag, set it on fire and then do a little dance on the ashes on camera if a terrorist said the alternative was for me to be shot, because respecting a little piece of cloth is hardly more important than surviving to be with my family and raise my children.
Often the two get mixed up- for example I would've taken up arms against Hitler had I been eligible to do so, but not "for the country" but rather because he posed a direct threat to human wellbeing. But the idea that I would lay down my life simply because a member of my country's government asked me to is anathema. Edited by Textbook - November 17 2010 at 21:28 |
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The Truth
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 19 2009 Location: Kansas Status: Offline Points: 21795 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:28 |
No, but I'm just a selfish teenager.
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:29 |
Hell, no. We pay for people to do that for us.
I still respect those who serve in the military. Hell of job when people are trying to kill you for doing it. Edited by Slartibartfast - November 17 2010 at 21:31 |
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Man With Hat
Collaborator Jazz-Rock/Fusion/Canterbury Team Joined: March 12 2005 Location: Neurotica Status: Offline Points: 166178 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:30 |
No.
But there are few things I would die for.
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Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
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thellama73
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: May 29 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8368 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:40 |
I certainly would. I love my country, even it has been moving in the wrong direction for a long time. I always hold out hope that we can pull back before we go over the precipice.
God bless America! (whether you believe in him or not) |
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WalterDigsTunes
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 11 2007 Location: SanDiegoTijuana Status: Offline Points: 4373 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:48 |
Screw imagined communities, polities founded on national myths and the whims of power. |
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Textbook
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 08 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3281 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:48 |
Isn't America traditionally a she? Oh wait you meant god, sorry.
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Textbook
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 08 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3281 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:49 |
Walter: Traditionally I find you to be an a****le but after that last post I want you to make wild passionate love to me.
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WalterDigsTunes
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 11 2007 Location: SanDiegoTijuana Status: Offline Points: 4373 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:51 |
I love you too, but let's keep our pants on. |
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Textbook
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 08 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3281 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:52 |
That's not what she said.
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Textbook
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 08 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3281 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:52 |
You gotta love someone who cheerfully derails their own serious threads.
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 21:56 |
Eh probably, as long as Tom Hanks makes a movie about me.
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WalterDigsTunes
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 11 2007 Location: SanDiegoTijuana Status: Offline Points: 4373 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 22:01 |
It's also amusing when he makes a movie about a man with no country |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 22:18 |
Probably not.
The only way I could see it happening was some honest to god civil war/revolution type situation, and I have to truly believe in what's happening of course. As time has gone on I've become more apathetic about nationalism and all that jazz. All this trouble over lines we drew up all over the Earth and really...we're all the same just trying to live every day and get by.
Although THAT would make it tempting... |
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Lozlan
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 09 2009 Location: New Mexico Status: Offline Points: 536 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 22:20 |
Um, no. Patriotism is a lie devised to feed the poor into a nation's war machine.
I'd kill for a decent White Russian, though. |
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Certified Obscure Prog Fart.
The Loose Palace of Exile - My first novel, The Mask of Tamrel, now available on Amazon and Kindle |
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 22:26 |
Hell, I'd kill for a just alright one. |
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Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 26 2008 Location: Declined Status: Offline Points: 16715 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 22:39 |
Nah, I'm pretty cowardly, but I would like you to elaborate on what you mean "For your country". Does dying in Iraq/Afghanistan count? Vietnam? What about preventing the USSR, Russia, or England from taking control of your government? What about preventing the government from being overthrown by anarchists so there is no government? Because I am pretty sure you are not going to find many people who are willing to die for a flag, and probably not even a symbolic statement of allegiance, although most people would agree that dying would be very noble, even though I'm sure you would disagree. And, to be fair, the terrorist almost certainly is not going to let you go anyway. Maybe if someone is in the military, but there are other factors at work there than just patriotism, like possibly being courtmartialed if you get back, and getting back is even more unlikely for them.
People in general are much less respectful of symbols: my dad was in the military (non-combat in Vietnam) and thinks flag burning should be illegal, but I remember when I was younger, some people were moving a large flag at school, and some mother said "Be careful not to let it touch the ground!" And I said "It's not like the Feds are here to bust you" and she replied contemptously "It's called respect" I really didn't understand why should be annoyed by that, it's reasonable to be careful with your country's flag if you like your country, but how does it matter at all if a piece of cloth touches the ground? The President doesn't know, the people who died in the 1700s don't know, that guy who just got the Medal of Honor doesn't know. At least when people complain about the abuse of religious symbols there's an actual entity that (presuming it exists) would be upset about that and whom you would not want to upset. Although I still think it's silly to get upset about Piss Christ and Madonna, who was even getting SHOCKED OUTRAGE on her latest tour, because you're feeding the trolls, but now we're wandering off-topic.
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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The T
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 16 2006 Location: FL, USA Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
Posted: November 17 2010 at 22:44 |
I wouldn't. I would do that only for my family.
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Any Colour You Like
Prog Reviewer Joined: May 15 2009 Status: Offline Points: 12294 |
Posted: November 18 2010 at 00:47 |
Short answer: yes.
Long answer: no. CBF'd explaining. |
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JJLehto
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 34550 |
Posted: November 18 2010 at 00:50 |
That's a shame because I kinda want you to explain this one Edited by JJLehto - November 18 2010 at 00:51 |
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