On the burning of books ...

Far easier to ignore history.  Otherwise how else would we think we could still sort out Afghanistan.

The T wrote:   On most accounts, I agree with Mike's view here. No book should be so holy and sacred that it can't be burnt...  (Well, maybe cooking books... we'd be hopeless in a world without them...)

The T wrote: I may not agree with the reasons behind burning books... but even less do I agree with restricting the right to do so...

1. If the USA Congress decides that evolution is dangerous, can they burn all Darwin books?
2. If the Supreme Court decides that the books about another political system different to democracy is wrong (And believe me I'm anti-Communist), would you deffend their right to burn all Marx books?
3. If they decide that no other language than English should be spoke in USA, can they burn all books in Spanish?

Please Theo, burning books is the end of the rights you claim to deffend.

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - September 12 2010 at 21:24

Mr ProgFreak wrote: Have a look at this "controversial" video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4XJQO3qol8 I agree 100% ... what's the big deal? Why should anyone be offended - and isn't it kind of ironic that before the announced burning of the Qur'an books by Terry Jones we see Islamists protesting in the streets, burning American flags in the process?

Quoting TheAmazingAtheist immediately should have made everybody disregarded everything written after. Just a little advice: he is the joke of the internet for being blantly biased and unwilling to have any conversation that doesn't revolve around the little world of his.

About the burnings themselves, well, they are of an incredible bad taste, but so do are the "protests", if that is the name we can call them, of muslim residents in Europe against the own countries that are hosting them. Besides, the USA constitution does allow you to be this racist, as long as nobody is phisicaly hurt.

stonebeard wrote: It's a far cry from burning a book to make a point that Muslims should not be so uptight to THE F**KING HOLOCAUST. You 100% miss the point that not all book burnings have the same intention.

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - September 12 2010 at 21:33

stonebeard wrote: CCVP wrote: Besides, the USA constitution does allow you to be this racist, as long as nobody is phisicaly hurt. Burning a Koran for the reason of making a point that 1) our Constitution allows such freedom of expression and 2) that Muslims are getting upset about the dumbest things.... IS 100% VOID OF RACISM. There could be intensely racists reasons for burning a Koran, but most of the ones I've seen (except for that dumbass preacher recently) are not among them.

Racism is not something restricted to the artificial concept of "race", you know? If this happened here all people involved would have been arrested from 2 to 5 years, without any chance of leaving sooner. THis is one of the reasons why race violence is so apparent in the USA.

Go ahead and burn this post.

Now if you try to burn me....that's a different story.

CCVP wrote: Racism is not something restricted to the artificial concept of "race", you know?

No I actually don't know. If I burn a Koran that doesn't make me racist (or to be inclusive, anti-Muslim culture...whatever) unless I'm doing because I'm xenophobic or something like that. Then it could apply. A lot of the atheists who do it are thoughtful people who are liberal as all hell, but burn it because it is precisely the sort of thing people should get over. It's not hurting anyone, DEAL WITH IT, to all the horrendously offended Muslims protesting out there. Did they hurt your wittle feelings? Boo hoo. Sadface. :(

CCVP wrote:  If this happened here all people involved would have been arrested from 2 to 5 years, without any chance of leaving sooner. THis is one of the reasons why race violence is so apparent in the USA.

So in Brasil, if you burn a book it's 2-5 years in prison?

Christ Almighty...


Edited by stonebeard - September 12 2010 at 21:54

stonebeard wrote: CCVP wrote: Racism is not something restricted to the artificial concept of "race", you know? No I actually don't know. If I burn a Koran that doesn't make me racist (or to be inclusive, anti-Muslim culture...whatever) unless I'm doing because I'm xenophobic or something like that. Then it could apply. A lot of the atheists who do it are thoughtful people who are liberal as all hell, but burn it because it is precisely the sort of thing people should get over. It's not hurting anyone, DEAL WITH IT, to all the horrendously offended Muslims protesting out there. Did they hurt your wittle feelings? Boo hoo. Sadface. :( CCVP wrote:  If this happened here all people involved would have been arrested from 2 to 5 years, without any chance of leaving sooner. THis is one of the reasons why race violence is so apparent in the USA. So in Brasil, if you burn a book it's 2-5 years in prison? Christ Almighty...

It is not burning JUST a book. You know pretty damn well that this is not just burning a book. The whole media revolved around this and it became quite clear that it was more than a demonstration of philosophical disagreement. It is an active gesture in order to hurt people that are members of that religion.

And North-Americans still wonder why people from the Middle-East hate them. You claim to be free, yet the own population do not allow other people to be free, think freely and to have a religion, free from social judgement.

edit: I bet that if he was trying to burn Talmuds he would be arrested for racism and judged as if he was a neo-nazi and you know that damn well. Some people can't be MORE equal that others.

edit 2: So, if those are acts of freedom of expression, why can't people still dress in white and burn crosses around? Same damn thing, with the exception that black people actually had numbers to fight back in the USA and to make that stop. Once again, that shows that this kind of "democracy" is nothing more that the dictatorship of the majority.


Edited by CCVP - September 12 2010 at 22:07

CCVP wrote: stonebeard wrote: CCVP wrote: Racism is not something restricted to the artificial concept of "race", you know? No I actually don't know. If I burn a Koran that doesn't make me racist (or to be inclusive, anti-Muslim culture...whatever) unless I'm doing because I'm xenophobic or something like that. Then it could apply. A lot of the atheists who do it are thoughtful people who are liberal as all hell, but burn it because it is precisely the sort of thing people should get over. It's not hurting anyone, DEAL WITH IT, to all the horrendously offended Muslims protesting out there. Did they hurt your wittle feelings? Boo hoo. Sadface. :( CCVP wrote:  If this happened here all people involved would have been arrested from 2 to 5 years, without any chance of leaving sooner. THis is one of the reasons why race violence is so apparent in the USA. So in Brasil, if you burn a book it's 2-5 years in prison? Christ Almighty... It is not burning JUST a book. You know pretty damn well that this is not just burning a book. The whole media revolved around this and it became quite clear that it was more than a demonstration of philosophical disagreement. It is an active gesture in order to hurt people that are members of that religion. And North-Americans still wonder why people from the Middle-East hate them. You claim to be free, yet the own population do not allow other people to be free, think freely and to have a religion, free from social judgement.

maybe it is an active gesture to hurt the FEELINGS of Muslims. That's all a book burning might do. Hurt their feelings. Boo-f**king-hoo. I wonder if it's in their Constitution that their cultural feelings aren't allowed to be hurt. Because we're sure as hell allowed to do things that hurt others' feelings in our country. What kind of country has laws specifically in place that makes it a crime to hurt someone's feelings? Is that not crazy?

And as far as your second paragraph let's be clear here; the day America bents over backwards not to hurt the feelings of people that demand we all treat their religion with respect is the day the simpering pansies win. I'm not a racist, and I am not anti-Muslim. I am against curving freedom of expression and speech just because some overly sensitive people who are not afraid to blow themselves up enough times to get certain unnamed governments to make insulting their beliefs illegal. There's a word for that: cowardice. Maybe I'm insensitive, but it's better than letting fear run amok.

About your edits: "Arrested for racism." I genuinely laughed. You can't be arrested for a belief here, only an act. Also, burning a cross in the front yard of a black person is illegal (I'm supposing it is) because it's an act of intimidation. Also, it's not on the person's land. If the person wants to burn a cross on their own property and dress as a KKK member, I'm quite certain they're allowed to, barring any home owner's accommodation agreements or city ordinances.


Edited by stonebeard - September 12 2010 at 22:12