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Anthony H. 
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 11 2010
Location: Virginia
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Points: 6088
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 Topic: Albums That Define Their Respective Sub-Genres
Posted: August 02 2010 at 09:39 |
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If somebody asked you to define one of the prog sub-genres, and the only thing you could do to answer them was to give them one album to listen to, what album would you give them? In other words, what albums define the sub-genre that they belong to? In my opinion, Magma's MDK defines Zeuhl, and Godspeed You! Black Emperor's Lift Your Skinny Fists Like Antennas to Heaven defines post-rock.
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VanVanVan
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 08 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 756
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 09:44 |
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Interesting. As much as some people would disagree I think that I would say that DT's Images and Words defines prog metal and BTBAM's Colors defines Extreme/tech Prog Metal.
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"The meaning of life is to give life meaning."-Arjen Lucassen
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harmonium.ro
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Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 18 2008
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 09:54 |
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How I would introduce people to
Zeuhl: Magma's KA
Post Rock: GY!BE's Moya EP
Math Rock: Don Caballero's 2
Fusion: Miles' Bitchess Brew
Extreme Prog Metal: one of Opeth's albums
Experimental/Avantgarde Metal: Kayo Dot's Choirs Of The Eye
Post Metal: Isis' Wavering Radiant
Krautrock: Amon Duul II's Tanz Der Lemminge
I wouldn't try to "define" the Art Rock subgenres because eclecticism is their first feature. RIO/Avant is also too diverse and eclectic to do it justice with just one album.
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Raff
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 10:29 |
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I believe In the Court of the Crimson King to be the defining album for Eclectic Prog. Five tracks, each one different from the other... How more eclectic can you get? As regards Crossover, I think Supertramp's Crime of the Century may fit the bill. For Heavy Prog things get a little bit more complicated, because you have so many different strains within a single subgenre. However, I would be inclined to choose Atomic Rooster's Death Walks Behind You.
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omri
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Joined: April 21 2005
Location: Israel
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Points: 1250
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 11:02 |
I think I would choose Deep purple self titled album to represent heavy prog or Rush's 2112.
For RIO I would go for Henry cow's "In praise of learning" and for Canterbury Matching mole's "Little red record".
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omri
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Zombywoof
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 26 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 1217
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 11:14 |
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Prog Folk: Comus: First Utterance or Jethro Tull: Songs From The Wood
Symphonic Prog: Camel: The Snow Goose
Eclectic Prog: Gentle Giant: Octopus
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Continue the prog discussion here: http://zombyprog.proboards.com/index.cgi ...
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TheGazzardian
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 11 2009
Location: Canada
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Points: 8693
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 11:19 |
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Space Rock: Gong's Flying Teapot perhaps?
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 11:25 |
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Neo-Prog - either IQ's The Wake or Pendragon's The Masquerade Overture
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The Truth
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Joined: April 19 2009
Location: Kansas
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Points: 21795
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 11:25 |
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Raga rock: Raga - Seventh Sons.
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harmonium.ro
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 11:31 |
 TheGazzardian wrote:
Space Rock: Gong's Flying Teapot perhaps? |
I'd pick Pink Floyd's Live In Pompeii, it's got the psychedelia and the space. But I never met anyone with a certain degree of musical knowledge unaware of psychedelic rock/prog.
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The Runaway
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 28 2009
Location: London
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Points: 3144
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 13:37 |
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Magma - MDK - Zeuhl
ELP - Brain Salad Surgery - Symphonic
King Crimson - In the Court - Eclectic
Mahavishnu Orchestra - Birds of Fire - JR/F
Rush - Hemispheres - Heavy
Phideaux - Chupacabras - Crossover
maudlin of the Well - Part the Second - Experimental/Post Metal
Dream Theater - Octavarium - Prog Metal
Neu! - Neu! - Krautrock
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presdoug
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Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
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Points: 8619
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Posted: August 02 2010 at 16:23 |
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Triumvirat-Illusions On A Double Dimple-Symphonic
Passport-Doldinger-Fusion
Birth Control Live (74)-Krautrock
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
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Points: 20251
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 08:25 |
harmonium.ro wrote:
How I would introduce people to
Zeuhl: Magma's KA
Post Rock: GY!BE's Moya EP
Math Rock: Don Caballero's 2
Fusion: Miles' Bitchess Brew
Extreme Prog Metal: one of Opeth's albums
Experimental/Avantgarde Metal: Kayo Dot's Choirs Of The Eye
Post Metal: Isis' Wavering Radiant
Krautrock: Amon Duul II's Tanz Der Lemminge
I wouldn't try to "define" the Art Rock subgenres because eclecticism is their first feature. RIO/Avant is also too diverse and eclectic to do it justice with just one album.
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I agree totally with your first four choices
I'm not going to comment the progmetal sub-genres because I'm not sufficiently versed to make a valid advice.
I did separate Space from Psych and RIO from Avant, like Post and Math were separated before my post.
nb: since I hate this single genre categories enforced on PA, I didn't care for the album's actual placemlent in the database. So you'll find a few genre nominees of mine not in the genre they are stuck on this site.
So:
Zeuhl: Magma's Kontarkozh
Post Rock: GY!BE's Slow Riot EP
Math Rock: Don Caballero's 2
Fusion: Miles' Bitchess Brew
but:
Krautrock: Can's Tago Mago
Canterbury: Soft Machine's Third
Neo-prog: Marillion's Script For A Jester's tears
Prog Foilk: Tull's Song From The Wood or Pentangle's Basket Of Light
indo/raga: Third Ear Band's Alchemy
Psych prog: Dashiell Hedayatt's Obsolete or Gong's Angel's Egg
Space prog: Tangerine Dream's Zeit
RPI: PFM's Storie De Un Minuto
Symph prog: Either ITOTCK or SEBTP
Heavy Prog: Atomic Rooster's Death Walks Behind You
Proto-prog: Vanilla Fudge's Renaissance or Deep Purple's Book Of Taliesin.
RIO: Univers Zero's UZed or Samla's Maltid
Avant-prog: Miriodor's Jonglerie Elastique
Art Rock: Supertramp's Crime Of The Century
Electronic prog: Schulze's Timewind or Dionne-Brégent's Et Le 3ième Jour
There ya go!!! 
NB: I'm not going to give any answers to eclectic and crossover, since neither are real and valid subgenres. They're only artificial subdivisions born to separate Art Rock.
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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tamijo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 06 2009
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 4287
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 08:40 |
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Genres are #"Q¤% in general, becomes even more %¤#¤#¤#% when put up against a q like this.
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Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours
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harmonium.ro
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 08:56 |
Sean Trane wrote:
harmonium.ro wrote:
How I would introduce people to
Zeuhl: Magma's KA
Post Rock: GY!BE's Moya EP
Math Rock: Don Caballero's 2
Fusion: Miles' Bitchess Brew
Extreme Prog Metal: one of Opeth's albums
Experimental/Avantgarde Metal: Kayo Dot's Choirs Of The Eye
Post Metal: Isis' Wavering Radiant
Krautrock: Amon Duul II's Tanz Der Lemminge
I wouldn't try to "define" the Art Rock subgenres because eclecticism is their first feature. RIO/Avant is also too diverse and eclectic to do it justice with just one album.
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I agree totally with your first four choices |
Thanks Hugues, this means I haven't been around PA for years for nothing!  I like your list too, though I avoided Soft Machine's Third because though it is the best album of the genre IMO it's not very representative of it, and Can's Tago Mago who despite being my favourite Krautrock album I also thought it emphasizes more the jam & avantgarde side of Kraut, leaving other aspects of Kraut (like pastoralism, electronic soundscapes, or even interplay a la classic prog) unrepresented.
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Snow Dog
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Joined: March 23 2005
Location: Caerdydd
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 09:03 |
Symphonic Tales From topographic Oceans Prog Hard Rock 2112 Neo Script From a J's T Space Warrior on the e of tttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt can' t be botehred
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Klogg
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 10 2010
Location: Goiânia-Brazil
Status: Offline
Points: 682
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 11:32 |
The Runaway wrote:
Magma - MDK - Zeuhl
ELP - Brain Salad Surgery - Symphonic
King Crimson - In the Court - Eclectic
Mahavishnu Orchestra - Birds of Fire - JR/F
Rush - Hemispheres - Heavy
Phideaux - Chupacabras - Crossover
maudlin of the Well - Part the Second - Experimental/Post Metal
Dream Theater - Octavarium - Prog Metal
Neu! - Neu! - Krautrock
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In the court of the Crimson King defines symphonic prog, not ecletic.
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omri
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 21 2005
Location: Israel
Status: Offline
Points: 1250
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 11:33 |
Sean Trane wrote:
harmonium.ro wrote:
How I would introduce people to
Zeuhl: Magma's KA
Post Rock: GY!BE's Moya EP
Math Rock: Don Caballero's 2
Fusion: Miles' Bitchess Brew
Extreme Prog Metal: one of Opeth's albums
Experimental/Avantgarde Metal: Kayo Dot's Choirs Of The Eye
Post Metal: Isis' Wavering Radiant
Krautrock: Amon Duul II's Tanz Der Lemminge
I wouldn't try to "define" the Art Rock subgenres because eclecticism is their first feature. RIO/Avant is also too diverse and eclectic to do it justice with just one album.
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I agree totally with your first four choices
I'm not going to comment the progmetal sub-genres because I'm not sufficiently versed to make a valid advice.
I did separate Space from Psych and RIO from Avant, like Post and Math were separated before my post.
nb: since I hate this single genre categories enforced on PA, I didn't care for the album's actual placemlent in the database. So you'll find a few genre nominees of mine not in the genre they are stuck on this site.
So:
Zeuhl: Magma's Kontarkozh
Post Rock: GY!BE's Slow Riot EP
Math Rock: Don Caballero's 2
Fusion: Miles' Bitchess Brew
but:
Krautrock: Can's Tago Mago
Canterbury: Soft Machine's Third
Neo-prog: Marillion's Script For A Jester's tears
Prog Foilk: Tull's Song From The Wood or Pentangle's Basket Of Light
indo/raga: Third Ear Band's Alchemy
Psych prog: Dashiell Hedayatt's Obsolete or Gong's Angel's Egg
Space prog: Tangerine Dream's Zeit
RPI: PFM's Storie De Un Minuto
Symph prog: Either ITOTCK or SEBTP
Heavy Prog: Atomic Rooster's Death Walks Behind You
Proto-prog: Vanilla Fudge's Renaissance or Deep Purple's Book Of Taliesin.
RIO: Univers Zero's UZed or Samla's Maltid
Avant-prog: Miriodor's Jonglerie Elastique
Art Rock: Supertramp's Crime Of The Century
Electronic prog: Schulze's Timewind or Dionne-Brégent's Et Le 3ième Jour
There ya go!!!
NB: I'm not going to give any answers to eclectic and crossover, since neither are real and valid subgenres. They're only artificial subdivisions born to separate Art Rock.
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Some very nice picks you made IMO.
Yet I want to claim that both Krautrock and Canterbury are not real sub-genres (just as you said about crossover and eclectic). Krautrock is a mix of bands with lots of improvisation and use of dysonant sounds (ADII, Can and others) and bands which does neditative / indo inspired music (Yahta sydrah is a perfect example while Popol vuh is the only band I know that are doing both in different albums). Canterbury bands are very diverse (National health are JR, Soft machine and Matching mole are Avant-garde, Egg are closer to Symphonic and Khan are space rock) so those 2 sub-genres are realy a mater of place and / or time.
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omri
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Morningrise
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Joined: March 18 2009
Location: Buenos Aires
Status: Offline
Points: 2766
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 12:30 |
Neo Prog: The Masquerade Overture-Pendragon
Symphonic Prog: Close To The Edge- Yes
Jazz Rock/Fusion: The Inner Mountain Flame- Mahavishnu Orchestra
Progressive Metal: The Divine Wings Of Tragedy- Symphony X
Tech/ Extreme Prog Metal: Symbolic- Death
Krautrock: Tago Mago- Can
Prog Folk: Minstrel In The Gallery- Jethro Tull
Eclectic Prog: Anabelas- Bubu
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sleeper
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 09 2005
Location: Entropia
Status: Offline
Points: 16449
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Posted: August 04 2010 at 13:12 |
The Runaway wrote:
maudlin of the Well - Part the Second - Experimental Metal
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Thats a joke right, you just picked maudlins non metal album to represent Experimental metal? 
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Albums That Define Their Respective Sub-Genres
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