For my Libertarian friends

Teddy is the only Roosevelt. 

I am pretty sure you all did not  know this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Roosevelt_Boettiger the world is full of suprises

Epignosis wrote: JJLehto wrote: Epignosis wrote: I was pulling for either Fred Thompson or Mike Huckabee last time round. And one by one, my ponies got culled. Happens. In 04 I liked Howard Dean, then John Edwards. The Dems ended up with that walking corpse know as John Kerry John Edwards is a sleazeball.  I knew this before the recent incidents.  I grew up in NC.  As for Howard Dean.

stonebeard wrote: Teddy is the only Roosevelt.

f**k teddy

The T wrote: Epignosis wrote: thellama73 wrote: The T wrote: Epignosis wrote: thellama73 wrote: Slartibartfast wrote: Back in 1863 Abraham Lincoln delivered his brilliant Gettysburg Address. In it he spoke of "government of the people, by the people, for the people." My fellow Americans, there is no big government...only your government. You pay taxes, and government, your government, owes you something in return. It owes you the promise that it will help you when you're down and in need, and it owes you the assurance that it will intervene and help prop up the economy when grave circumstances threaten your well-being. It does not have the right, as the Republicans would love, to turn its back on you and represent only the wealthy and big corporate interests. Remember, "government of the people, by the people, for the people..."   The Ostroy Report. That's very generous of it, but I didn't ask it to do those things for me, and indeed I would prefer if it didn't. The government is for the people.My income is not. It's all about income and taxes in the end isn't it? It's all about freedom in the end. Having the freedom to do what you want with your money is a big part of it. Also, cutting back the government's revenue by lot greatly reduces the harm they can cause. Additionally, we've already discussed a lot of the civil liberties issues. Don't pretend you didn't notice. When the question is about if the government can take my income by force or not, then yes, it's all about income. Oh wait, no it isn't.  It's about preserving the freedoms and rights of individuals rather than treating us as mere resources. If the government has given itself a right to 15% of your income, it can give itself the right to all of it. Funny how it hasn't happened and it will never happened. It hasn't happened anywhere in the world since the times of the Khmer Rouge (which is a complete different atrocious phenomenon of course).  Sorry but I really think Libertarianism has at least a little of paranoia as an ingredient.

Yeah...we've gone down that road already....the government is a grizzly bear, correct llama?
I do llama credit, when I called him out he did admit the government scares him. Why I dont share the shame fear as you guys I dont know, guess Im just a sheep.

In theory you are right, taking 15% of your income entitles me to take, let say 100% of it!
But theory is theory. In real life, (sans communist regimes/dictatorships) it just does not happen.
Just like when I said, look at the Europe and the Nordic countries as proof that socialistic aspects will not bring a country to Authoritarianism. Though you guys will say "but the gvmt is by nature!" and all that lets face it. Sweden, Denmark, Finland and Norway, nor France, the UK, Germany, etc are authoritarian....


Edited by JJLehto - July 22 2010 at 17:27

The T wrote: Epignosis wrote: JJLehto wrote: Epignosis wrote: I was pulling for either Fred Thompson or Mike Huckabee last time round. And one by one, my ponies got culled. Happens. In 04 I liked Howard Dean, then John Edwards. The Dems ended up with that walking corpse know as John Kerry John Edwards is a sleazeball.  I knew this before the recent incidents.  I grew up in NC.  As for Howard Dean. Edwards is a sleazeball, it has been proven.  As for Dean, does his ridiculous yell really mean something? Does that make him worse than any other candidate? Are these things the ones that the people have to think about when they choose a president?

Yes, they are.
Leading candidate to dead campaign over night...
Us Americans can be very, very dumb people.....
And wubya could've lost too, a president re-elected with 49% approval at the time?????
But with 51% popular vote? Sounds to me like some undecided voters saying "Bush is meh...but Kerry that guy is a "insert here" " And I couldnt blame em for thinking that


Edited by JJLehto - July 22 2010 at 17:28

The T wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: stonebeard wrote: Teddy is the only Roosevelt.  f**k teddy So much anger.  Valeriana is the key.

I have this thing about murderers who hide behind facades of office and idealism.

The T wrote: Sorry but I really think Libertarianism has at least a little of paranoia as an ingredient.

 

manofmystery wrote: Government should exist to protect my liberties

And doing that will require at least a little bit of taxes, so I hope you're on board with that.

JJLehto wrote: Yeah Teddy was quite a fella. Remember a political cartoon I saw of him dressed up in a small child's outfit pulling naval ships around attached by a string, like those duck toys. One of the icons of the Progressive Era yet had a foreign policy that was "yay the navy is my toy! Lets play!" I think he may have liked war Also, he is a large part of creating the "US empire" and I can't believe he still cited the Monroe Doctrine

He loved war.

T. Roosevelt wrote: Frankly I don't know that I should be sorry to see a bit of a spar with Germany. The burning of New York and a few other sea coast cities would be a good object lesson in the need of an adequate system of coast defenses, and I think it would have a good effect on our large German population to force them to an ostentatiously patriotic display of anger against Germany.