Beatles Prog?

SergiUriah wrote: And talking about Pet Sounds, I can´t hear the prog elements there.

What the heck?  Both Yellow Submarine and especially the artsy Magical Mystery Tour predated the over-rated, in my opinion, Sgt. Pepper's.  They included movies.  This was a very progressive concept too.  Revolver and Magical Mystery Tour are my favorite mid period Beatles albums, and the added symphonic elements, provided by the genuisly eccentric John Lennon on especially "Magical Mystery Tour," are simply genius.  I love the Beatles from Revolver to the very artsy Abby Road.  I think The Beatles had a major impact on the progressive rock scene and they didn't have multi-tracking past a few takes, maybe 4 track then?  Also, all the symphonic sounds are mosly played with real instruments by mostly John, he did have a mellotron he played wonderously, starting with revolver or the E.P.'s, not sure.  I'm sure George Martin had help from an Orchestra, RPO.  I'm speaking in reference to The E.P. "Magical Mystery Tour."  They didn't have a Moog or Taurus Pedals, and especially, all the new technology now.  I consider "The Beatles," post "Revolver" or even starting with "Revolver", a proto art rock band.  If they made a few more albums, without Yoko involved, post Abby Road, I think we would be talking about a full on art rock band that started as pure pop rock and blues.  Mr. Lennon used a moog, mellotron, and other keyboards that were then available and the tracking has grown enourmously since then.  People need to realize, these early progressive rock inspiring bands didn't have near the technology, at the time, to produce horns, etc, from a keyboard and tracking was basically one take until the mid 60's a la mono, which makes these aforementioned bands, all the more amazing. Yes, I agree the Moody Blues "Days of Future Past," gets overlooked as a proto-prog release just a bit too much and really it's a full on Symphonic Progressive Rock album, in my opinion and not all pop inspired.  Songs like the "Nights in White Satin" suite are artsy/symphonic/progressive, and the poetry and using the Philharmonic Orchestra are all very progressive ideals.  Zappa, I love too, but I don't find his first mother's release progressive just because it has an extended length, for the times, song called "The Return of the Son of Monster Magnet," or because it's the first Double concept kinda, album.  Now Hot Rats is a different story, but I believe that came out in 70, and it was very jazz rock fusion orientated.  The Great Wazoo is good too, but too late.  I love Apostrophe, but this is the mid 70's time-period.  So, I still hold camp that King Crimson's ITCOTCK was the first full on progressive/art rock album.  I believe "The Beatles," were more of an influence than Zappa at the time and it started, for real, with the "Magical Mystery Tour" release, that's what I call the start of proto art rock.  I feel The Moody Blues had the biggest impact on Symphonic Prog, for the time.  In conclusion, I feel "The Beatles," should be included in "Art Rock," or a new sub-genre, I know it's all we need, more confusion, but Proto Art rock, I feel, should be a sub-genre, and the Beatles, I believe, started it with "Magical Mystery Tour."                                

Well, I remember reading about that, even they made Rubber Soul before. The Beatles sailed, inevitablement , to Revolver, MMT and Sgt. Peppers. They were always over ther rest.

I think most of their albums post-Revolver had progressive elements, and consider the wonderful suite of songs on side two of Abbey Road to be one of the first and best prog epics.

Progist wrote: Malve87 wrote: Progist wrote: To be honest, Sgt Pepper is still mostly a pop album,  Yes, but there's that little thing called "A day in the life" which...you know... Yeah I know. As I said there are a couple of tracks, but the album is generally poppy 4/4 simple tunes stuff. When I'm 64, A Little Help, Lovely Rita etc. A Day In The Life achieves what it does mainly through production technique. I'm still not sure I would cal it Prog? Certainly not in intent anyway.

Well...4/4 time signature's not a problem in prog, Pink Floyd wouldn't be prog for that, anyway "A day In The Life" has a strong prog element in its structure; it's divided in 3 specific sections, you've got the first sung by John and then after the orchestral climax Paul's bit and then John again...it's not a suite ok, but somehow this was very innovative.
Anyway the "White album" for sure had a huge influence with certain songs...

Progist wrote: Malve87 wrote: Progist wrote: To be honest, Sgt Pepper is still mostly a pop album,  Yes, but there's that little thing called "A day in the life" which...you know... Yeah I know. As I said there are a couple of tracks, but the album is generally poppy 4/4 simple tunes stuff. When I'm 64, A Little Help, Lovely Rita etc. A Day In The Life achieves what it does mainly through production technique. I'm still not sure I would cal it Prog? Certainly not in intent anyway.

Malve87 wrote: rod65 wrote: TheLastBaron wrote: I would agree that these was stuff at the same time as peppers that was more progressive but lets consider the following elements of The Beatles that made them important to the birth of prog, not to say that they where more important than any other band but that they did have a role in progs formation. Songwriting: The Beatles wrote their own songs. this is a huge deal for music but also for prog, The Beatles had some cryptic sh*t, wrote stories in the lyrics and moved beyond simple boy wants girl or life is hard stuff, a huge part of prog. mix of styles: the beatles experimented with various sytles and blended them with the pop of thier day, again something that is a staple of prog. finally the biggest thing would be the studio is an instrument in itself, evident on sgt. peppers. the beatles experimented with recording techniques and were able to create interesting unique sounds with different in studio effects, this is a huge influence on what a group of musicians could do with a record, moving music beyond mere entertainment and into more of an art, not to say that it never was art, it always has been, but this definitely emphasized that point.   I think your observation of studio as instrument is excellent, and really gets to the heart of prog. by the way, "Electric Ladyland" was one of the first albums in which the studio was used "as an instrument"  IMO

Maybe but as usual the Beatles did it first - check out how the "noises" in Tomorrow Never Knows and the organ sounds in "Being for the benefit of Mr Kite" were created.

The studio was quite literally used as an instrument in "Tomorrow Never Knows". The various tapes were threaded onto machines and wound by hand and pencil. The actual track was then recorded "live" in the studio. Quite an achievement when you think about it.

Even though they arent 'prog' prog, they have been one of the most progressive groups (in terms of the latter half of their career.)

can we agree that the Beatles after 1966 are proto-prog, and before then just pop?