UK election televised debate!

akamaisondufromage wrote: Dean- You saying there is no such thing as the British Class System or that there are only two classes - those that own the means of production and those that don't ?    I still think that our 'Class System' has a lot to do with what school Daddy sent you to - oh and the fact we still have a Royal Family

Well, obviously there is such a thing as a British class system, but it's a well screwed archaic system rooted in the Industrial Revolution that is not reflected in the political system that is supposed to represent it.

Billy Bragg made some great points on BBC News' Hard Talk programme earlier.  I'm not sure if it'[ll be repeated as it's a part of News 24, I think.

He was basically saying that Immigration isn't really the full issue but it's rather the lack of jobs and housing.  People are blaming it on the immigrants who are supposedly taking their jobs when it really isn't the issue at all.  Everyone is having the issue; immigrants included.

He's in full favour of multi-culturalism.  He also thinks there should be some kind of written constitution and also disagrees with the first-past-the-post system.  He also has no issues with the proposed Lib Dem Amnesty but disagrees with a cap on immigrants.

He has actually voted Lib Dem the past three elections due to tactical voting in his constituency in West Dorset.  He is still very much a left-of-centre voter though.

How do you feel about her selling her story, Chris?

Unfortunately, Mrs. Smeg reminds me of my late grandmother who always had something to say about the "coloured".

She always came out with comments that sounded bigoted.


Edited by James - May 03 2010 at 07:19

True but she could have made a statement on her doorstep rather than getting convinced to sell her story for money by whoever offered her the most.

And personally, I had a good chuckle at Gordon.  I felt it actually made him look more human and has actually made me respect him more.

But then I'm weird.

Jim Garten wrote: Dean wrote: of late have preferred to order a G&T rather than a pint of ale CLASS TRAITOR!

Purely a volume of liquid vs. intoxication quotient old bean. Just can't handle 8 pints of anything anymore.

Well, I stayed up until half bloody five this morning, (the last hour spent swearing a lot and refreshing the results page for my constituency), watching "the drama unfold" as the BBC journalists would have me believe. Hours later and we're really none the wiser on how this country is going to be governed. I don't know whether to be excited or terrified.

I'm dismayed but not wholly surprised at the poor result for the Lib Dems. I don't know what the national vote share will look like (so many seats still to declare!) but I have a feeling it will paint a very different picture to the number of seats they've taken. The journalists are scratching their heads and saying "but we thought you all loved Clegg now?" but we never did. A sizeable minority in a lot of seats wanted to give him a chance, but under this stupid bloody system our votes count for nothing.

One crumb of comfort for us lefties is Caroline Lucas' win for the Green Party. Whilst I don't agree with them on absolutely everything (especially their funny relationship with science issues), having a Green MP or two in the House of Commons won't do this country any harm. I also think she has come across far better than any other party leader this election, and fought a truly positive and optimistic campaign throughout.

And as for the shambolic way the polling stations have operated in some areas... well, it's staggering, quite frankly. I have little sympathy for the people who cared so much about their vote that they thought they'd roll up a ten minutes before the stations are due to close and then get all uppity when they realise a hundred other people chose to do the same thing. Perhaps the polls should be closing an hour later, but we were all informed of the time for this election well in advance so there's no excuse, really. What does worry me is the tales of stations running out of ballot papers. WTF, quite frankly. WT friggin' F? YOU KNOW HOW MANY VOTERS ARE ON THE REGISTER. IS IT REALLY THAT HARD TO MAKE SURE YOU HAVE ENOUGH BALLOT PAPERS FOR ALL OF THEM?! Unbelievable.

But still, this has been a fascinating election. My one real hope is that it paves the way for electoral reform. This result is surely a testament to the fact that FPTP is a rotten way to conduct a supposedly democratic election, and blows the Tories claims that FPTP is the only way to deliver "a strong government" completely out the water.

Anyway, that's enough from me. Over to you, Mr Paxman.

LibDems on the decline....what a shame! Mind you looks like the Green Party got Brighton

Victory for a new Conservative Labour?

Oh and I still only know a few people who voted Tory.  So I have no idea where all these closet Tories are coming from...

I actually quite like Gordon Brown but I am looking at it from a Labour viewpoint.  It's potentially best for him to stand-down.

I don't think he will, mind you.

However, Clegg has staunchly said he cannot work with Brown in a coalition but would likely join them if Brown wasn't their leader.

And yes, I'd stop voting Lib Dem (who I voted for on the council elections, as they run second to the Tories in my Ward and a Labour vote there is pointless) too if they joined forces with the Tories.

I spent the evening watching the election at a someone's house and they were all Anti-Tory, Lib Dem voters.  So if the Lib Dems joined forces with the Tories, that's potentially a lot of anti-Tory Lib Dem voters lost.  So it's a bad thing for Clegg to do... if he actually has a soul.  Of course, it'd give him more power and if it's greed he wants, then of course a deal with the Tories is beneficial to him.

This is a disaster yet still better than a Tory overall majority.


Edited by James - May 07 2010 at 08:05

Not that it matters much (we'll be having another General Election within 18 months), but Glegg has to go with the side that gives him the greatest slice of power, which is the coalition that has the most commanding majority - a lib-lab coalition will only give a ~10-seat majority - that is not enough to survive a non-confidence vote - siding with the "enemy" will give a 90-seat buffer which will enable Lib-Dem policies and policy-consessions to go through with less rsistance and lower risk of rejection - it will also give the coalition more chance of (not success) but of lasting more than a few months..

Edited by Dean - May 07 2010 at 08:20