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Easy Money View Drop Down
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Points: 10618 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:39
Your making a point by jamming two sentences together out of context, hold on a second, I can top that, give me a minute.
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Points: 10618 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:43
Here I strung two of your quotes together:
I'm actually drinking ...the poor stay poor because they prefer booze and Jerry Springer.

Edited by Easy Money - April 01 2010 at 20:43
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:44
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Why is it in these discussions it's always

rich = evil 

No Robert. It's not that simple. But: 

rich=more power=more liberty to let human nature darkest impulses reign supreme=evil

vs

poor = good?

Not at all. Just less powerful. Therefore in the losing side. 

In my experience, it's usually that the rich earn what they have through hard work, and the poor stay poor because they prefer booze and Jerry Springer.  I've seen plenty of the former become the latter very quickly. Maybe only in America man. Try checking the rest of the world. Not everybody can get rich just by hard work. And even here: what about mental illness? What about the glass ceiling that stops people from getting rich? What about the poor having to get survival wages so they can't do anything else in order to get rich? 

Sorry folks. Until you prove to me that most of the poor are completely unfortunate being poor have you ever been poor? We can't generalize , and that rich people are evil same here. But with money comes power. With power comes more possibilities of becoming greedy, and yes, in a way, evil (despite hiring willing people who, to be redundant, would be worse off if they didn't work paying them ridiculously low wages , this whole discussion is skewed in a silly way. No... I see two sides and not one is really being favored here... 


First, the ability to show evil does not mean you are not evil.  If you are a quadriplegic who wants to murder someone, but cannot, you are no less evil than someone who has arms and legs.

Second, for the purposes of this thread, which you started, I am not interested in the rest of the world.  I have never even been there, so I am not interested with respect to this topic.  But of course you make the same fallacy most people do.  I never said "Hard work in America makes you rich."  I said in my experience AND usually...the rich earn what they do through hard work.  Please pay attention.

Now, to your question, "Have I ever been poor?"  As I've said, that is relative.  I've eaten every day of my life and had a place to live.  Yet I've never had more than $108 in savings, nor any valuable assets.  But I've known people worse off than I am be greedier and crueler than I am.
__________

Now my turn to ask a question:

How many rich people are greedy and evil as opposed to rich people who are good?  Please list names of both.
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:47
Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Here I strung two of your quotes together:
I'm actually drinking ...the poor stay poor because they prefer booze and Jerry Springer.


I deny that I took his comments out of context, but if I did, I am giving him an opportunity to clarify that context.

The solution isn't to take two things I've said out of context and say, "A ha!"

The solution is to let the author of those comments explain what he means so there is no contradiction.  If he cannot, then there may be weakness in his argument.
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Points: 10618 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:50
^ Re two quotes up: Seeing as how there are only a few people who technically qualify for the term 'rich' (yes, it is a set amount, if you don't know now, you never will) that should take just a few minutes.

Edited by Easy Money - April 01 2010 at 20:52
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:52
I like Libertarianism.

I don't know if I've mentioned this yet.
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 20:55
Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

^ Re two quotes up: Seeing as how there are only a few people who technically qualify for the term 'rich' (yes, it is a set amount, if you don't know now, you never will) that should take just a few minutes.
Citation Needed
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:12
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Why is it in these discussions it's always

rich = evil 

No Robert. It's not that simple. But: 

rich=more power=more liberty to let human nature darkest impulses reign supreme=evil

vs

poor = good?

Not at all. Just less powerful. Therefore in the losing side. 

In my experience, it's usually that the rich earn what they have through hard work, and the poor stay poor because they prefer booze and Jerry Springer.  I've seen plenty of the former become the latter very quickly. Maybe only in America man. Try checking the rest of the world. Not everybody can get rich just by hard work. And even here: what about mental illness? What about the glass ceiling that stops people from getting rich? What about the poor having to get survival wages so they can't do anything else in order to get rich? 

Sorry folks. Until you prove to me that most of the poor are completely unfortunate being poor have you ever been poor? We can't generalize , and that rich people are evil same here. But with money comes power. With power comes more possibilities of becoming greedy, and yes, in a way, evil (despite hiring willing people who, to be redundant, would be worse off if they didn't work paying them ridiculously low wages , this whole discussion is skewed in a silly way. No... I see two sides and not one is really being favored here... 


First, the ability to show evil does not mean you are not evil.  If you are a quadriplegic who wants to murder someone, but cannot, you are no less evil than someone who has arms and legs. But we don't need to regulate the man with no limbs, not in the same way as we need to regulate the excesses of the four-limbed man anyway. 

Second, for the purposes of this thread, which you started, I am not interested in the rest of the world.  That's my main problem with libertarianism. Is far too localist. It looks at the US as if it was an island in an ocean of nobody... I have never even been there, so I am not interested with respect to this topic.  You should check... and learn... And maybe you'd confirm your views but with a broader perspective But of course you make the same fallacy most people do.  I never said "Hard work in America makes you rich." I said in my experience AND usually...the rich earn what they do through hard work.  Please pay attention. Ok Point taken here

Now, to your question, "Have I ever been poor?"  As I've said, that is relative.  I've eaten every day of my life and had a place to live.  Yet I've never had more than $108 in savings, nor any valuable assets.  But I've known people worse off than I am be greedier and crueler than I am. I'm sure of that.
__________

Now my turn to ask a question:

How many rich people are greedy and evil as opposed to rich people who are good?  Please list names of both.



The amount of good that good rich people do with their money/power is, sadly, far outweighs by the amount of bad that even just a few bad rich people do with theirs.... 


Edited by The T - April 01 2010 at 21:16
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Points: 10618 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:13
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I like Libertarianism.I don't know if I've mentioned this yet.
It looks like the guy with the big mustache is actually saying that ... I think I'm trippin
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:14
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Why is it in these discussions it's always

rich = evil 

No Robert. It's not that simple. But: 

rich=more power=more liberty to let human nature darkest impulses reign supreme=evil

vs

poor = good?

Not at all. Just less powerful. Therefore in the losing side. 

In my experience, it's usually that the rich earn what they have through hard work, and the poor stay poor because they prefer booze and Jerry Springer.  I've seen plenty of the former become the latter very quickly. Maybe only in America man. Try checking the rest of the world. Not everybody can get rich just by hard work. And even here: what about mental illness? What about the glass ceiling that stops people from getting rich? What about the poor having to get survival wages so they can't do anything else in order to get rich? 

Sorry folks. Until you prove to me that most of the poor are completely unfortunate being poor have you ever been poor? We can't generalize , and that rich people are evil same here. But with money comes power. With power comes more possibilities of becoming greedy, and yes, in a way, evil (despite hiring willing people who, to be redundant, would be worse off if they didn't work paying them ridiculously low wages , this whole discussion is skewed in a silly way. No... I see two sides and not one is really being favored here... 


First, the ability to show evil does not mean you are not evil.  If you are a quadriplegic who wants to murder someone, but cannot, you are no less evil than someone who has arms and legs.

Second, for the purposes of this thread, which you started, I am not interested in the rest of the world.  I have never even been there, so I am not interested with respect to this topic.  But of course you make the same fallacy most people do.  I never said "Hard work in America makes you rich."  I said in my experience AND usually...the rich earn what they do through hard work.  Please pay attention.

Now, to your question, "Have I ever been poor?"  As I've said, that is relative.  I've eaten every day of my life and had a place to live.  Yet I've never had more than $108 in savings, nor any valuable assets.  But I've known people worse off than I am be greedier and crueler than I am.
__________

Now my turn to ask a question:

How many rich people are greedy and evil as opposed to rich people who are good?  Please list names of both.



The amount of good that good rich people do with their money/power is, sadly, far outweighs by the amount of bad that even just a few bad rich people do with theirs.... 


Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

 Citation Needed
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:17
^I edited my post and added some comments to your comments BTW. 
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:19
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

^I edited my post and added some comments to your comments BTW. 




Really?  Come on.  Okay.  Gimmie a second.
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Points: 8368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:25
Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I like Libertarianism.I don't know if I've mentioned this yet.
It looks like the guy with the big mustache is actually saying that ... I think I'm trippin


While my actually moustache is not quite as impressive as my avatar's, it's getting pretty close. I am growing it as hard as I can!
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Points: 32524 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:29
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:


First, the ability to show evil does not mean you are not evil.  If you are a quadriplegic who wants to murder someone, but cannot, you are no less evil than someone who has arms and legs. But we don't need to regulate the man with no limbs, not in the same way as we need to regulate the excesses of the four-limbed man anyway.



I'll just focus on this one, since international travel isn't an interest of mine since I cannot afford it:

So by your logic, tall muscular people should be more "regulated" than short skinny people?  What do you mean "regulated?"
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 21:29
Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I like Libertarianism.I don't know if I've mentioned this yet.
It looks like the guy with the big mustache is actually saying that ... I think I'm trippin


While my actually moustache is not quite as impressive as my avatar's, it's getting pretty close. I am growing it as hard as I can!

Be careful of letting it get too big... the goverment can come and cut it to spread the hair around! WinkTongue
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 01 2010 at 23:28
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

Originally posted by Easy Money Easy Money wrote:

Originally posted by thellama73 thellama73 wrote:

I like Libertarianism.I don't know if I've mentioned this yet.
It looks like the guy with the big mustache is actually saying that ... I think I'm trippin


While my actually moustache is not quite as impressive as my avatar's, it's getting pretty close. I am growing it as hard as I can!

Be careful of letting it get too big... the goverment can come and cut it to spread the hair around! WinkTongue


Yep, there might be welfare scrounging immigrants hiding in there Wink
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Points: 29630 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 07:11
This health care thread is making me sick. DeadLOL
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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Points: 8543 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 07:32
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:


As for the following gem, I'll let you rebut yourself:

Originally posted by The Doctor The Doctor wrote:


Government simply provides a means to, at least to some degree, hold the evil side of human nature in check. 


Originally posted by The Doctor The Doctor wrote:

After all, government is made up of individuals



 
I see no contradiction here.  Perhaps evil is too strong of a word, but individuals are selfish, with only their own interests at heart and left unchecked will exploit others to further their own interests.  The masses be damned.  While government is made up of those very same self-interested individuals, which means that government is not immune to the weaknesses of human nature, it, as an institution (at least in democratic countries) is responsible to the masses not the individual.  The government as an institution is also ruled by a certain amount of inertia, which doesn't allow for one person, or a small group of people to wield too much power within it, no matter what you may think. 
I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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Points: 8543 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 07:33
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

This health care thread is making me sick. DeadLOL
 
Is internet induced illness covered by your health care plan? 
I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 02 2010 at 12:36
Originally posted by The Doctor The Doctor wrote:

Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

This health care thread is making me sick. DeadLOL
 
Is internet induced illness covered by your health care plan? 

It's not a pre-existing condition so probably it is... Tongue
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