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Topic ClosedDo you ever feel sorry for "Prog" fans who just do

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Progfan1958 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Do you ever feel sorry for "Prog" fans who just do
    Posted: November 23 2009 at 06:16

OK, let's take another thread and reverse the question posed so we can approach it from other angles. Do you ever feel sorry for "Prog" fans who just don't "get" other musical genres or styles ? You would actually think that the very broad range of ideas and musical directions that a "progressive" definition could lead to, that it would actually bring you to almost any musical form. Granted, not just any collection of sounds and words will have broad appeal, but shouldn't open musical ears lead to open musical minds ?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 06:23
Originally posted by Progfan1958 Progfan1958 wrote:

shouldn't open musical ears lead to open musical minds ?


yes
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 06:25
I take it from the color of your text you like the blues. Tongue
I'd have to say 90-95% of my collection now is prog.  I blame this site. Prog Archives, give me back my life!!!LOL
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 06:32
Provided it's not a matter of principle, it's ok.
 
I think most prog fans have arrived there via dissatisfaction with other genres, and the ones I've had contact with mostly tend to delve in other directions out of interest, mostly to come scuttling back under cover quite fast.
 
Apart from that I also think that a lot of Prog fans are also into other genres. It's not mutually exclusive.
 
As another afterthough: Most other genres are quite adequately covered in Prog anyway, ableit in a few second bursts here and there, that those genres themselves tend to stretch out over years and discographies. Big smile


Edited by npjnpj - November 23 2009 at 06:34
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 06:36
I started my interest to music from pop ( shortly in earlier teens), after - hard rock, heavy metal, than - punk and new wave. Heavy metal  once again, than ... jazz. I returned back to some rock music from jazz ( whenever after that you can only listen progressive music), but it doesn't means I am prog-maniac! Yes, it sometimes pity, that some prog fans are closed in their kingdom and can't make a short step outside - to modern jazz, avantgarde,etc. But - when people like just progressive instead of Green Day, Celine Dion and 50 Cent, it's a really big deal! 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 06:38
Not nececarrily. If somebody doesn't like music that's less comlicated than the avarage prog song I'm not sorry for him, neither am I sorry for someone who listens to pop and can't get into prog. They probably are happy with the music they listen to. I do feel sorry for those who can't get into "non-prog" and therefore bash the specific music style. Musical elitism really annoys me now and then.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 07:17
I too feel irritated at anyone who goes all posh and haughty about listening to prog vs. other genres. I suppose that for some people it's just another way of showing off their intellectualism. But speaking of those who just don't 'get' other kids of music...well, sure, I'm sorry for them, in general.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 07:51
Originally posted by Progfan1958 Progfan1958 wrote:

OK, let's take another thread and reverse the question posed so we can approach it from other angles. Do you ever feel sorry for "Prog" fans who just don't "get" other musical genres or styles ? You would actually think that the very broad range of ideas and musical directions that a "progressive" definition could lead to, that it would actually bring you to almost any musical form. Granted, not just any collection of sounds and words will have broad appeal, but shouldn't open musical ears lead to open musical minds ?


True.

Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

I take it from the color of your text you like the blues. Tongue
I'd have to say 90-95% of my collection now is prog.  I blame this site. Prog Archives, give me back my life!!!LOL


And money! OuchLOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 09:43
Originally posted by Progfan1958 Progfan1958 wrote:

OK, let's take another thread and reverse the question posed so we can approach it from other angles. Do you ever feel sorry for "Prog" fans who just don't "get" other musical genres or styles ? You would actually think that the very broad range of ideas and musical directions that a "progressive" definition could lead to, that it would actually bring you to almost any musical form. Granted, not just any collection of sounds and words will have broad appeal, but shouldn't open musical ears lead to open musical minds ?

Sometimes it can be difficult to feel sorry for "Prog" fans that just don't "get" other musical genres or styles. I have witnessed on many occasions where prog fans slaughter in verbal volumes, blues musicians or musicians that played in rock bands who may have been diverse as players and could have easily joined the ranks of any prog band. Most common examples would be Paul Kossoff from Free or Peter Frampton from Humble Pie. As Frampton plays jazz/blues improv on "I Walk On Gilded Splinters" from Humble Pie's Fillmore East cd, many prog people just don't hear it. Maybe the style of the music is a direct turn-off for them or maybe they base their critical points from a common judgement that Frampton was a pop star and is laughable. When I first heard him he was a young kid and stood quietly on stage turning out serious solos. He just wore a t-shirt with jeans and he wasn't out for the thrill of stardom. I've listened to fans of rock music run this guy to the ground so, imagine how proggers feel about him?

Many prog fans that I've met don't appreciate the blues genre and it confuses the H out of me. aLL the jazz improv in blues, the boogie woogie piano, slide guitar, opening tunings. They are so ignorant to blues that they can't tell the difference when someone is singing blues and sounding too like Frank Sinatra or Davy Jones on the "Head" film where Zappa says it sounds real .....W..........then when someone is really complimenting the blues with a glorious voice. Many British Blues Boom singers sounded to me as if they were trying too hard and it's real distasteful sounding to the core. They can't even understand a point like that, due to their reality which says that blues is basically garbage.

The broad range of ideas and musical directions that a "progressive" definition could lead to, that it would actually bring you to almost any musical form is something to ponder over. I mean they are just snobs about it and it would be a difficult  feat to try and changed or re-direct their minds. My church is better than yours kind of attitude is what we are dealing with. A person like me was more drawn into the blues due to my interest in the lyricism and the folklore. That is another point to make, proggers I've met don't seem to comprehend that old blues lyrics are written in puzzles. Sorry, I've been drinking and I'm talking in circles.
 
Collections of sounds and words that have broad appeal is unfortunately something for proggers to ridicule for an evening of what they would consider simply a good time. I don't know technically the percentage of proggers that would feel this way but, after reading your thread I get the impression that the percentage is high. There are many blues artist like Howlin Wolf, Muddy Waters and Buddy Guy or Willie Dixon, British Blues Boom era, that crossover into progressive territory especially due to their expanding on an instrument. The care or concern for that to be put on the judgement stand is not entered into too often at a prog concert. Muddy Waters name is not mentioned along with Steve Howe's or Magma for the most part. 
  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 11:50
I mayself enjoy multiple styles of music besides Prog - Other kinds of Rock, Blues, Reggae, Classical, Celtic, Jazz, anything with good guitar playing, Native American, music from around the world (Africa, India, Japan, etc.), all of which exist in broad categories.  My openess to variation is what allows me to enjoy Prog along with all these other. 
 
Toddler makes an excellent point - many of the characteristics of Prog are found in other musical genres as well.  Good music is good music, no matter in what category we place it.  Yet no one has to like anything that someone else says is good.  I've heard some Rap that I thought was very well done, yet no one can convince me like the style.  There is a difference between appreciation and enjoyment, a distinction I'm not sure all proggers make.
 
Case in point for the Blues: Jethro Tull always has, and always will, play exclusively within the Blues.  Most Rock, including all our listed proto-prog bands, played and play within the Blues.  Yes, the Blues rock.
 
On another point, I challenge any progger to find a guitar player as good as Chet Atkins (and frankly, you won't find a better).
 
Do I feel sorry for proggers who don't get other genres?  Only when they have closed their minds to those other genres, only when pretentions get in the way of appreciation.  They don't have to like any of them, but if they know how to listen, they can appreciate more, and possibly enjoy more.  But then, itsn't there that side of human nature that just likes to gripe?  Or feel superior?  I think so, but isn't that also a side for us to overcome as well?
 
As the old saying goes: "A mind is like a parachute - it only functions when it's open."
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The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 12:16
Do these people who like only like Prog Rock actually exist?
What?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 13:33
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Do these people who like only like Prog Rock actually exist?


I've seen it before.  It's pretty sad.

I don't feel sorry for them if they're going to be as narrow minded as the ones I've met who bad mouth any other bands that apparently have no creativity and sound the same Dead
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 13:53
I feel sorry for people that reject any music that is popular in an attempt to feel superior and look cool on the internet.  These people let their psychological problems get in the way of enjoying music, which is quite a shame.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 14:58
Originally posted by Progosopher Progosopher wrote:

 
On another point, I challenge any progger to find a guitar player as good as Chet Atkins (and frankly, you won't find a better).
 
His right hand was God sent. Just to learn one of his pieces, you have to spend time developing his technique. He was influenced by the Merl Travis right hand finger picking style but, he took it into more complex areas. He jazzed it up a bit. His left hand was amazing as well with crazy chord stretches. He was a very determined player and once he appeared on television, guitar players were ready either to give up or have a stroke. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 15:30
Well, still if you only listen to prog, it depends in part on how broadly or narrowly you define it.  If broadly, there's still a broad variety of music out there.
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 15:56
depends... if thesh*ts good or notLOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 16:06
I have NEVER met someone who only listens to Prog...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 16:15
I've gotta say, there's huge value in not being boxed in.

Sure, exploration and discovery depend on knowing where the borders are so a muso can go outside of them when it suits.

I think the early proggers didn't consider themselves a genre, prog was just a description of how they did things: musical evolution thru  trying stuff out.
The past and present often provide answers that take us to the future, so to exclude other genres is to exclude the progressiveness of Prog!

Prog in many ways isn't even a path of invention but of trying to express something of consequence that was always there... if we knew how to hear it. Sometimes we don't have the words to say it but we recognise when someone else has found a sound that says it. Fuse it in to what we already have and we get to say it even better!

Prog should be probing the final frontiers, to borrow a term!

Cheers
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 17:04
Sorry to get all meta-whizzical on ya there folks!
Better introduce myself!
I'm all new here, I'm not a diehard progger by decision, I just "am what I am," what ever it turns out to be, to quote the pipe smokin' philosopher Popeyecrotes.
I'm a cartoonist/illustrator by trade but that's just work.
For me a good bit of music (whatever the genre) is like a good novel or a recollection of a damn good dream!
Hopefully it uncovers the bits that I forgot when I woke up.

I'm spending half my time on some hammond forums where I'm pimping my road rig.

Cheers lads and lasses, pleased to be here!

-Brendooon
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2009 at 19:52
Originally posted by Progfan1958 Progfan1958 wrote:

OK, let's take another thread and reverse the question posed so we can approach it from other angles. Do you ever feel sorry for "Prog" fans who just don't "get" other musical genres or styles ? You would actually think that the very broad range of ideas and musical directions that a "progressive" definition could lead to, that it would actually bring you to almost any musical form. Granted, not just any collection of sounds and words will have broad appeal, but shouldn't open musical ears lead to open musical minds ?



Definitely. I usually try an album lot before having any kind of opinion about any album and i think a large amount of people just don't give the music the time it needs.

For example, this past 5 years have been outstanding to progressive rock and metal in general, but the grades are usually very low, even for the albums of the year!+.
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