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Topic ClosedShould ELO be added to prog archives?

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Poll Question: Should ELO be added?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
13 [22.03%]
40 [67.80%]
6 [10.17%]
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greenback View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 10 2004 at 19:14

ELO: NO

ELOY: YES

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gdub411 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 10 2004 at 19:40

I do not know enough of ELO to make a good judgement call. The only stuff I have heard is on the radio and it sounds vaguely proggish, but still more poppish to me. I would have to hear more of their"non commercial" stuff before coming to a conclusion

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 10 2004 at 20:58

Of course they should be added, I mean if so many recomend Radiohead, ELO is then just as good (even better IMHO).

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 02:45
I don't see the connection between Radiohead and ELO.Radiohead have adopted a less commercial approach to music that makes them worthy of serious consideration while ELO were a pop band from about 1975 onwards.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 03:03

I think that ELO produced more proggy music (early in their careers) than, say, Procul Harum, or Styx - and definitely more than Uriah Heep, all of whom are far less proggy than Deep Purple or Supertramp - does everyone think that "Dreamer" and "Breakfast in America" are all Supertramp did? "Crime of the Century" and "Even in the Quietest moments" are magnificent prog albums without a Mellotron in sight! And as for the Purps, well, if you think that "Smoke on the Water", "Black Night" and "Highway Star" are their limits, then you haven't heard "In Rock", "Made In Japan" or a dozen other great albums where the music goes way beyond rock'n'roll and well into prog territory. I mean, excluding Deep Purple because they have a strong rock'n'roll link is like excluding Jethro Tull because they have a strong folk link, or excluding Gong because they're too Jazzy.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 05:28
That's as maybe, Cert, but IMO ELO are simply too simplistic in their approach to composition and arrangement to be classified as prog. So they used strings. So did Robbie Williams. ELO weren't really doing anything that new.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 08:28

...so did the Moodies - and I'm not saying that they should be in the archives either...

How silly of ELO to rip off Robbie Williams like that.



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 10:29

Blurring the lines here, I agree that ELO are not prog but they have used all the ingredients of prog at one time or another eg, long songs (Kuama), concept albums (Eldorado), orchestras (any album really), really silly loon pants (see previous example) and were on the Harvest label in the UK (home to many prog rock acts).

They seem to be caught in a genre of their own making - lucky sods  

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 13:28

Trouserpress wrote:

Quote That's as maybe, Cert, but IMO ELO are simply too simplistic in their approach to composition and arrangement to be classified as prog. So they used strings. So did Robbie Williams. ELO weren't really doing anything that new.

Have to agree 100% with you, as I said a few posts ago ELO played Rock, POP and Disco Music with a few violins and Cellos, the same did James Last and Ray Coniff and that doesn't make the prog.

Even the tracks like Rockaria that try to sound operatic (even if it's a joke) are only some chords and a a guy singing as a So´prano over a classical rock & roll rhythm, the same gose for other good songs like Living Thing, etc, only attacches applied over simp´le arrangements.

Remember Stevie Wonder used massive Mellotron (A 100% progressive rock instrument) and he's not even near to prog.

Iván

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 13:34
just say no to elo. they mave have some talented stuff and blah blah blah, but i don't think they are prog.
*Remember all advice given by Asuma is for entertainment purposes only. Asuma is not a licensed medical doctor, psychologist, or counselor and he does not play one on TV.*
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 11 2004 at 18:49
THEY WOULD BE CONSIDER AS A PROG BAND IF WE TAKE THE EXAMPLES OF STYX OR ALAN PARSONS, THEY BEGAN AS PROG BANDS, BUT THEY LOST IN SOME WAYS THE STRENGHT THEY GAINED IN THEIR PREVIOUS WORKS. ELO'S FIRST FIVE ALBUMS ARE QUITE PROG, BUT THEY JUST BECAME  AS A SYMPHONIC BASED POP-BAND (GOOD SONGS INDEED)...IF YOU ASKED ME I WOULD SAY THAT NO, BUT IF BANDS LIKE STYX ARE ON THE WEB. SO WHY DO NOT ELO. IMAGINE SOMEONE BELIEVING THAT MR. ROBOTO IS PROG
Democracy=A form of government in which the supreme power is vested in the people...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2004 at 15:34
Hell..NO!!!! Knew a guy once, bragging about all his prog albums by ELO.  What a geek
marching on together!!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2004 at 16:25

I'd like to hear a few "pro" comments from those who voted in favour, as I listened to "Time" and "Out of the Blue" tonight to see if I could hear any prog.

What I heard was great rock'n'roll with an eye on disco(very!), with very clever arrangements and synth/string parts - and even a prologue and epilogue on "Time"; but all-in-all, two collections of 3-4 minute rock songs with flat 4/4 beats. Jeff Lynne's voice serves to underline that - pure rock'n'roll!

"The News" on "Time" had probably the proggiest flavour of all, but was still a 3 minute song with sound effects that didn't really journey anywhere. I think that anyone who hears prog in ELO should have a listen to Boston, Dire Straits or even ABBA: All three have progressive tendencies and all wrote fine music - but not prog.

I had a very enjoyable evening's listening, thanks to this thread



Edited by Certif1ed
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2004 at 18:22

All:

First, Cert, although I love both albums, I do not agree with you that Crime of the Century or Even in the Quietest Moments is "prog" as generally defined.  Which brings me to a point I have made before.

There is an "unspoken" category of prog called "progressive pop."  No, this is not an oxymoron or an attempt to be humorous.  In my opinion, that category would include: Supertramp, 10CC, XTC, Klaatu (though they come close to "real" prog on "Hope"), Styx (or at least some of it), Starcastle (...), some Queen, and other groups.  I have tried to make this case a number of times, with no success.

Perhaps some of the new members will see the reasoning behind this idea.

What think ye?

Peace.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2004 at 18:51
The next thing you know someone will say Enimen is Progressive Rap
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 13 2004 at 04:45

I'd second a progressive pop category, it would make sense to me.

ELO for me is a great band (I have a 2CD 'best of' collection), which brings back memories of the seventies. Consistently high quality singles, which still sound fresh 25 years later. No prog rock though. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 13 2004 at 05:43

We'll have to agree to disagree then, maani - "Crime of the Century" contains all the subjective "feel" of "real prog" to my ears - and many objectively identifable elements too.

I understand the term progressive pop to include the Beatles and other pop bands whose albums go way beyond the standard collection of 3 minute tunes - even into concept territory, but do not develop thematic material, rather choose to experiment within the confines of a song. This is where Supertramp differ, especially on COTC, where thematic material is developed, tempi shift, and song structures are elongated. Admittedly, COTC isn't pure concept - but neither is ITCOTCK

On the other hand, I hear nothing in, for example, Uriah Heep or ELO that is remotely proggy, or even progressive in the strict sense. Now Queen...

 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 13 2004 at 07:28
Originally posted by maani maani wrote:

There is an "unspoken" category of prog called "progressive pop."  No, this is not an oxymoron or an attempt to be humorous.  In my opinion, that category would include: Supertramp, 10CC, XTC, Klaatu (though they come close to "real" prog on "Hope"), Styx (or at least some of it), Starcastle (...), some Queen, and other groups.



Have to agree with you on this one - take, for example, 'A Night At The Opera'; an album containing an eclectic mix of styles, including progressive rock (The Prophet Song) - nobody would ever call Queen a prog band, but they definitely came up with some material which fits perfectly within the genre.

The same can be said of ELO, Supertramp, Styx, 10CC XTC, Radiohead, and another band whose inclusion within the Archives caused much dissent many moons ago - Opeth: they have already stated publicly they will not be recording another album like 'Damnation', concentrating instead on the darker death metal scene of the previous albums - this does not preclude them from being in the Archives, but they cannot be referred to as a prog rock band (one swallow does not make a summer, and all that).

Personally, I would like to see ELO included within the Archive, as I believe their first couple of albums deserve a mention here; perhaps bands can be included, but instead of including their entire discography, the recognised progressive albums alone be listed.

Oh God - I can feel a resurrection of the old "how do you define progressive rock" argument coming on....    

Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 13 2004 at 08:06

ELO IN THE ARECHIVES?

IN A WORD...NO DEFINATELY NOT(OKAY THREE WORDS THEN!!)

like many bands from the late 60s/early seventies they were influenced by the musical"attitudes"of the time and having formed at a time of psychadelic and general EXPERIMENTATION they may have elements of the style that led to what we generally consider to be prog(as many bands at the time (eg Deep Purple in their very ealy days "Book Of Talysin "etc) did)

BUT LIKE BANDS SUCH AS PURPLE they did not pursue that path  and although i partly agree With Jim(GASP!!!) in That some of their early albums had at least a progressive feel(at times)) i would have to be in the no camp

perhaps we could have some sort of "disputed" section!!

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 13 2004 at 12:54

C'MON...What About the great prog masterpiece they did with Olivia Newton John.....Xanadu



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