Do you enjoy watching DVDs? Then ...

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... even if you're an audiophile, you should also be able to enjoy listening to MP3.

Why? Well, because it's the same principle. DVDs are created from the original film material by applying lossy compression. MP3s are created from the original CDs by applying lossy compression. 

Does lossy compression always render the result unusable for serious enjoyment? Well, maybe it depends on the level of compression - and on the quality of the compression method used. 

Go to YouTube and watch a movie. Or try to find a 64kbit MP3 sound sample on the internet and listen to it (or listen to the sound of your typical YouTube movie - it will most likely have 64kbit sound at the most). You'll immediately see/hear the effect of the compression.

Then turn on your TV set and put in a good DVD. The same lossy compression is at work ... but do you notice it while watching the DVD? I doubt it.

It's the same with high bitrate MP3s. The files are smaller and contain less information, just like DVDs contain only a fraction of the actual amount of data of the original film material.

Well, what do you say ... do I have a point here? 

Edited by Mr ProgFreak - July 03 2009 at 15:46

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Mr ProgFreak Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Forum Senior Member Joined: November 08 2008 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 5195	Topic: Do you enjoy watching DVDs? Then ... Posted: July 03 2009 at 15:46
	... even if you're an audiophile, you should also be able to enjoy listening to MP3. Why? Well, because it's the same principle. DVDs are created from the original film material by applying lossy compression. MP3s are created from the original CDs by applying lossy compression. Does lossy compression always render the result unusable for serious enjoyment? Well, maybe it depends on the level of compression - and on the quality of the compression method used. Go to YouTube and watch a movie. Or try to find a 64kbit MP3 sound sample on the internet and listen to it (or listen to the sound of your typical YouTube movie - it will most likely have 64kbit sound at the most). You'll immediately see/hear the effect of the compression. Then turn on your TV set and put in a good DVD. The same lossy compression is at work ... but do you notice it while watching the DVD? I doubt it. It's the same with high bitrate MP3s. The files are smaller and contain less information, just like DVDs contain only a fraction of the actual amount of data of the original film material. Well, what do you say ... do I have a point here? Edited by Mr ProgFreak - July 03 2009 at 15:46

rdtprog Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Special Collaborator Heavy, RPI, Symph, JR/F Canterbury Teams Joined: April 04 2009 Location: Mtl, QC Status: Offline Points: 5285	Posted: July 03 2009 at 15:56
	Good question because with the new technology of the blu-ray i found difficult to appreciate the picture quality of a standard dvd, who has as you said some level of compression. But that's me, i am one of few people who care more about the picture quality then the music. It's just sad that we all have to wait a little longer to see a lot of bands put their concert on a blu-ray who is more expensive. Only major bands that make a lot of money can afford to jump in this new technology right now. Edited by rdtprog - July 03 2009 at 15:57
	Music is the refuge of souls ulcerated by happiness. Emile M. Cioran

Mr ProgFreak Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Forum Senior Member Joined: November 08 2008 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 5195	Posted: July 03 2009 at 16:13
	I love watching Blu-Ray discs ... but of course they also have pretty much the same lossy compression as DVD ... only that the resolution has increased, and the compression algorithm is more efficient.

Snow Dog Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995	Posted: July 03 2009 at 18:54
	Yes you have a point. But then again. I'm not one of the ones that need convincing. I agree with you anyway!


cobb2 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Forum Senior Member Joined: November 25 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 415	Posted: July 03 2009 at 20:37
	But all digital music is sampled. CD's use a rate of 2000 to 3000 samples per sec. This (in effect) is still lossy from the original.

Mr ProgFreak Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Forum Senior Member Joined: November 08 2008 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 5195	Posted: July 04 2009 at 03:21
	^ very true. But what does it have to do with my point? Or to put it another way: Does your knowledge of this loss of information render CDs unlistenable to you?

Bear Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Forum Groupie Joined: August 14 2009 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 75	Posted: August 17 2009 at 16:47
	You make a good point. But I'm a bit weird when it comes to this debate. I've decided that if an album was originally released as an LP I try to find it in that format. For more recent music that isn't in the LP format I'll settle for CD/mp3. Vinyls just have such a great raw, almost live sound to them. As for video I don't really have an opinion because I haven't seen any films on Blu-Ray yet. The only reason I buy DVDs is because my VCR broke.

Queen By-Tor Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 13 2006 Location: Xanadu Status: Offline Points: 16111	Posted: August 17 2009 at 17:05
	I don't think many people could store uncompressed music or watch film on an actual reel. It's impractical. 'Nuff said.

Slartibartfast Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Reviewer page Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630	Posted: August 17 2009 at 17:23
	You know I'm getting older, harder of hearing, sight is dimming. Not to mention my original LCD TV has been having picture issues that are getting worse. When they get the equipment for Blue-Ray and the discs to a level where I can afford it, I'll avoid it unless I have no choice. But back to your original point. I think you may be making a mistake to try to make one sense equivalent to the other. On a tangent, one may liken enjoying a real scent to a scratch 'n' sniff. An artificial flavor to the original thing. Those peeled grapes in a bowl that make you put your hands in when you have a blindfold on at Halloween in a makeshift haunted house and tell you that you are feeling eyeballs. I think when you boil it all down and it comes to audiophiles or anyone else for that matter, sometimes it's just in your head.
	Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...