Dream Theater's BC&SL Discussion

I think that sentence Harry posted sums it up, it's better than Systematic Chaos but that's about it.  Funny, my initial impressions were pretty good, no I didn't say "Images &  Words" but this would do very well.  Soon, the delight melted away and the album began to sound rather uninspiring (to me, of course).  For all of you who liked it, good for you, enjoy many more spins, nothing more to say.   And yeah, I agree with the person who sounds LaBrie sounds better here than in a while, which probably explains my initial favourable reaction.

IMO SC was "business as usual" for the band. in the months leading up to BC&SL i opened my mind to SC more and actually found it to be a superb album (Prophets of War bring it down A LOT!!!)

with the new one, i feel they could have trimmed some of the songs a bit (the solo trade off section in ANTR is a little too long and in TSF, i dont think The Root Of All Evil reference makes sense in the song)

but other than that, ive been able to get into this new one much easier than SC, and not because SC is "underrated, needs many listens to understand!". I think thats true for BC&SL, but IMO there's something more to the new album, something that brings the listener back.

btw if you let lyrics decide if you like a song or not, i laugh at you. If you listen to music for the lyrics, then why not get into poetry?


Edited by darkshade - June 29 2009 at 13:48

i guess. but i could give 2 Sh*ts about lyrics, unless they are GOD-AWFUL, which they arent on BC&SL. They are bad, but ive heard much worse. Besides, i mostly focus on the music most of the time when i listen to music, even if i know the lyrics well. I guess thats why i listen to jazz/jazz-rock/fusion, and love instrumentals.

I've played BC&SL twice and really like it.  My favourite track is The Shattered Fortress, closely followed by The Count of Tuscany.  I wasn't keen on Wither on first listen, but it sounded better second time round.  The Best of Times made me cry!! 

I'm listening to a few of the songs on Franz Keylard's show right now as I decide whether to refund my ProgNation tickets.

Edited by Negoba - July 01 2009 at 13:20

Negoba wrote: I'm listening to a few of the songs on Franz Keylard's show right now as I decide whether to refund my ProgNation tickets.   I honestly don't think I've listened to any Rudess-era DT before and while he's not a musician he certainly adds his share of cool noises to the mix.   The songs are good enough, I think I'd enjoy seeing them again after 14 years since the Awake tour. Pertucci is an average shredder, Portnoy is his usual self, LaBrie actually is more listenable now that he's lost his high range.   The drummer in my former band, who learned by ear, when he was first introduced to Portnoy, remarked "Man that dude can count." That about sums it up for me.     ed. Alright, "Best of Times" is awful....."But most of all, thank you for my life." "My heart is bleeding blood." I understand using your art to deal with loss, but not everything one writes needs to be for general consumption.

^Well, maybe Petrucci is average in the sense you're thinking of, but I find his soloing in DT's material often very good and fitting, shredding or not.

Negoba wrote:   I honestly don't think I've listened to any Rudess-era DT before and while he's not a musician he certainly adds his share of cool noises to the mix.

Edited by cobb2 - July 02 2009 at 04:23

cobb2 wrote: Negoba wrote:   I honestly don't think I've listened to any Rudess-era DT before and while he's not a musician he certainly adds his share of cool noises to the mix. Couldn't resist this... 'Jordan Rudess has the distinction of taking classical piano training at the Juilliard School of Music at nine years old. Rudess has played with Steve Morse, both in his solo career and in Dixie Dregs. He has also recorded with David Bowie, Annie Haslam, and Vinnie Moore. He and fellow Dregs man Rod Morgenstein have a side project called the Rudess Morgensein Project. He is a member of the progressive rock supergroup Liquid Tension Experiment and also the third keyboardist for Dream Theater. ' Not bad for a non-musician addition: I think this album is their best since six degress. I am enjoying it immensely.

Negoba wrote: The main reason we're reconsidering is the loss of PoS and Beardfish. I pretty much knew what I was going to get with DT. I didn't mean to say Rudess wasn't a musician at all, just that he's more of a player and less of a big picture guy like Moore is.   I was a big fan of the shred scene long before Pertucci was its standard bearer and he's pretty average. He just hasn't added anything as a guitarist to what had already been done. You have to remember, Varney was putting out a new guy every 6 months in those days, and many of those guys are legends of the shred scene now. I had all their debut albums (Greg Howe, Jason Becker, Tony MacAlpine, Vinnie Moore....on and on.) What I liked about him most was his riffs, which were the first to use mathematical subdivisions to create strange syncopations. But with bands like Meshuggah taking that ball and running so much further with it....   Anyway, I'm leaning toward going, mainly after watching some youtube of Zappa play Zappa.   If I'm going to check out a Rudess-era album, where would start?

Not a fan of the Rudess-era, but if there would be one that is Metropolis Part 2: Scenes From a Memory. Though not sure if you have already heard it. That is pretty much the best record they've pulled together with Jordan.

As far as I know: Systematic Chaos and Train of Thought are pretty heavy. The former introducing Mike's annoying "growls". While ToT is based more on Petrucci's solos and Mike's double-bass drumming. Both feature a very dark mood, unlike those from Moore and Sherinian.

Octavarium is supposedely a return to a balanced band. While I understand why some can say so, it's really nothing as balanced as in Images & Words, Awake, CoS and FII. And by the way, I find it pretty un-inspired, though enjoyable all through must admit, even if only 3 of the songs in there are Prog.

Six Degrees seems like a interesting mix of their straight-forward heavy stuff ala Metallica, and some of their most Proggy stuff, though headed more to Symphonic rather than Prog Metal.

However if you haven't checked out Falling Into Infinity and Change of Seasons and you really like Moore, those 2 with Sherinian are musts. While not as heavy, the Moore-vibe is there and all the musicians have a lot of space to shine.




Edited by The Quiet One - July 02 2009 at 09:25