The Atheist - Agnostic - Non religious thread

avalanchemaster wrote: What, so the rest of us have to prove some kind of intellectual prowess to you?  Or some kind of token of being part of the "in" crowd at progarchives?   How's that superiority/god complex working out for ya?  alienate people much?

KoS wrote: The T wrote: The purpose of this thread is to discuss the origins of your beliefs, or actually, lack thereof (in the case of Atheism) As I'm pretty sure that, unlike most cases with religion, atheism and similar secular school of thoughts are not imposed or taught by parents, it's more than likely that in most cases you will have reached the decision not to believe (or at least the decision to DOUBT) by your own free will (this doesn't mean ALL religious people haven't made their choice out of free will)  How did that happen? When, how old where you? Are you happy about your choice or at times you long for the days when you had something to believe?   I'd also love to hear about people who have their own versions of God, not dependant of churches or holy books or prophets.... I wish we'd stick to this.

I urge all followers of JRR TOLKIEN ( not the flicks) to read Silmarillion and follow the Creation beginning with Illuvatar and the Music Of The Ainur. Many here could relate........

SergiUriah wrote: Do atheists say: "Oh, my God!"?, or that exclamation set phrase is prohibited for them?

It's not prohibited. I say it occasionally.

Last time I checked, there was no similarity among atheists and I often don't even call myself an atheist; I just choose not to involve myself with religion. If I had to label myself, however, I would definitely be an atheist.

Atheism does not have a structure. There are always people in every stream of thought who take it as a personal challenge to try to "prove" that they're right to everyone else constantly, and I know many religious and non-religious people who are like that.

The whole debate on the previous pages of whether atheism is "structured" or not is completely pointless; everything needs to be taken on a completely individualist level when it comes to atheism, and even when it comes to religion. In the end, even if one person is restricting their spiritual beliefs to a certain set of values (say: Buddhist, Catholic, whatever), each person has their own thoughts and beliefs on every matter---there is just more variation in atheism and non-religious people than religious because they're not restricting themselves to a set of faith-based beliefs in some way.

There is a general consensus when it comes to any "label" or religion, but I doubt you'll find that every Catholic agrees with each other on every issue concerning anything spiritual, or likewise anywhere else. It's even less likely that you'll find that "atheists" agree with one another, because there's hardly anything to discuss.

I am a firm believer in the rejection of organized religion--I'm much more comfortable with the idea of people expressing their religions on a completely individualistic basis, but never would I consider forcing or imposing that idea on anyone else, since they're allowed to do what they want.

....keep it civil Avalanchemaster, your viewpoints on the subject are most enlightening, let's not dumb down the debate with personal attacks, even unintentionally. You have much to share.

MovingPictures07 wrote: SergiUriah wrote: Do atheists say: "Oh, my God!"?, or that exclamation set phrase is prohibited for them? It's not prohibited. I say it occasionally. Last time I checked, there was no similarity among atheists and I often don't even call myself an atheist; I just choose not to involve myself with religion. If I had to label myself, however, I would definitely be an atheist. Atheism does not have a structure. There are always people in every stream of thought who take it as a personal challenge to try to "prove" that they're right to everyone else constantly, and I know many religious and non-religious people who are like that. The whole debate on the previous pages of whether atheism is "structured" or not is completely pointless; everything needs to be taken on a completely individualist level when it comes to atheism, and even when it comes to religion. In the end, even if one person is restricting their spiritual beliefs to a certain set of values (say: Buddhist, Catholic, whatever), each person has their own thoughts and beliefs on every matter---there is just more variation in atheism and non-religious people than religious because they're not restricting themselves to a set of faith-based beliefs in some way. There is a general consensus when it comes to any "label" or religion, but I doubt you'll find that every Catholic agrees with each other on every issue concerning anything spiritual, or likewise anywhere else. It's even less likely that you'll find that "atheists" agree with one another, because there's hardly anything to discuss. I am a firm believer in the rejection of organized religion--I'm much more comfortable with the idea of people expressing their religions on a completely individualistic basis, but never would I consider forcing or imposing that idea on anyone else, since they're allowed to do what they want.

Movingpictures07, I agree with almost all that you have to say; except one aspect:  I think Buddhism, while having basic tenants or aspects shared by most who call themselves Buddhist, it is still largely open to interpretation, just like interpretation of any other organized movement should be.  I like many ideas in buddhism, but do not follow any rigorous practice that I would call strictly Buddhist per se.... Moreso, I like the idea that through meditation (or carefully watching thoughts go by and interpreting the nonsense of it) one can help to ascertain a certain control over one's self. 

I do not subscibe to any fundamental Atheistic views (I really think some people here are really stretching to show atheism as a religion here).  But I feel a kinship to many atheists... however, I like my atheists (and anybody else for that matter) to be independent thinkers.  What good is structure if it cannot be broken and revised?   What good is thought and will if it is not free (of dogma and tyranny of thought control)?

KoS wrote: SergiUriah wrote: Do atheists say: "Oh, my God!"?, or that exclamation set phrase is prohibited for them? Yes. I also say "Jesus Christ" "Jesus effin' Christ"  and various other violations of the Commandment explicitly forbidding that language.

I only take the Lord's name in vain whenever I see commercials hawking religious crap or televangelists when channel surfing.  I'm pretty sure God will forgive me.

avalanchemaster wrote: MovingPictures07 wrote: SergiUriah wrote: Do atheists say: "Oh, my God!"?, or that exclamation set phrase is prohibited for them? It's not prohibited. I say it occasionally. Last time I checked, there was no similarity among atheists and I often don't even call myself an atheist; I just choose not to involve myself with religion. If I had to label myself, however, I would definitely be an atheist. Atheism does not have a structure. There are always people in every stream of thought who take it as a personal challenge to try to "prove" that they're right to everyone else constantly, and I know many religious and non-religious people who are like that. The whole debate on the previous pages of whether atheism is "structured" or not is completely pointless; everything needs to be taken on a completely individualist level when it comes to atheism, and even when it comes to religion. In the end, even if one person is restricting their spiritual beliefs to a certain set of values (say: Buddhist, Catholic, whatever), each person has their own thoughts and beliefs on every matter---there is just more variation in atheism and non-religious people than religious because they're not restricting themselves to a set of faith-based beliefs in some way. There is a general consensus when it comes to any "label" or religion, but I doubt you'll find that every Catholic agrees with each other on every issue concerning anything spiritual, or likewise anywhere else. It's even less likely that you'll find that "atheists" agree with one another, because there's hardly anything to discuss. I am a firm believer in the rejection of organized religion--I'm much more comfortable with the idea of people expressing their religions on a completely individualistic basis, but never would I consider forcing or imposing that idea on anyone else, since they're allowed to do what they want. Movingpictures07, I agree with almost all that you have to say; except one aspect:  I think Buddhism, while having basic tenants or aspects shared by most who call themselves Buddhist, it is still largely open to interpretation, just like interpretation of any other organized movement should be.  I like many ideas in buddhism, but do not follow any rigorous practice that I would call strictly Buddhist per se.... Moreso, I like the idea that through meditation (or carefully watching thoughts go by and interpreting the nonsense of it) one can help to ascertain a certain control over one's self.  That's true. I would say Buddhism is the most easily open-to-interpretation of the established/organized "religions", but I was just thinking of the first examples that came to my mind. I agree with you in that I like the ideas of Buddhism the most of any organized sets for that reason. I do not subscibe to any fundamental Atheistic views (I really think some people here are really stretching to show atheism as a religion here).  But I feel a kinship to many atheists... however, I like my atheists (and anybody else for that matter) to be independent thinkers.  What good is structure if it cannot be broken and revised?   What good is thought and will if it is not free (of dogma and tyranny of thought control)? I agree entirely with that. I typically avoid labels or "groupings" of any kind, for that reason. It's easy for people to get locked into patterns of thinking.

avalanchemaster wrote: Ha!  open to interpretation I suppose, but none of my posts have been intended as trolling.  But I could interpret your actions as such if I wanted.....

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - June 06 2009 at 21:30

King By-Tor wrote: SergiUriah wrote: Do atheists say: "Oh, my God!"?, or that exclamation set phrase is prohibited for them? we say, "Oh my science!"

That would be interesting to actually hear someone use that.

Jedi is a religion these days.




I find it funny that the atheists opened this discussion as a topic to chat and the religious folk have crusaded our asses and turned it into a huge debate. You guys are silly with your opinions which you hold as fact - at least we don't go door to door saying, "hi, have you found faith in life and no longer have need for an idol which to fear and give thanks to? Let me tell you about Atheism."