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Nightfly View Drop Down
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Points: 3659 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Judas Priest go Prog?
    Posted: June 16 2008 at 16:29
I've just got the new Judas Priest album through the post today. It's a concept album based on Nostradamus. I've only played it the once and I'm not suggesting them for inclusion here by any means but it's pretty much a Prog Metal album. Of course Priest are a Metal band through and through but it's good to see them taking a chance and stretching out a bit.
 
Think I'll have to go and dig out Sad Wings of Destiny now, the nearest they probably came to Prog in the past.
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Points: 2492 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 16 2008 at 16:43
How is the album? I've got too many reservations to list.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 17 2008 at 08:48
I thought the album was far too long and had too many filler tracks. Some of it was good.
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 18 2008 at 04:59

Heh!

"Nostradamus" is awesome - pure, blistering Priest, with all the bits you'd expect in a Priest track - and some nice surprises in the arrangement too. Love the keyboard work - nothing fancy, but it creates exactly the right atmospheres. The cycle of fifths stuff (like much of the song) hearkens back to "Exciter", and reminds me of Yngwie Malmsteen or even Randy Rhoades compositions (just as "Exciter" did).
 
The parallel movement in the choruses is a neat touch - really conjoures up an atmosphere of mediaeval chanting.
 
I don't think it's Prog in EXACTLY the same way I don't think that, say, Death are Prog - recalling that Death covered "Painkiller" virtually note-for-note, just down-tuning it to make it sound heavier - co-incidentally at the same time that Death's style changed into what some people seem to see as progressive - but I do think it's essentially the same as a lot of Prog Metal I've heard.
 
For old times' sake, I had another listen to "Painkiller" - what an amazing song that is, given it was written and released in 1990. Again, clearly the band that wrote "Exciter", but with a harder edge, and more tempo changes, more variety in episodic structure, and tasty little technical nuggets (won't get a Vai fan excited, but nonetheless, vastly improved over the "Exciter" days).
 
I'm still not saying it's Prog, mind - just seeing one or two passing similarities...
 
 
Listened to both here
 
 
Originally posted by Nightfly Nightfly wrote:

 
Think I'll have to go and dig out Sad Wings of Destiny now, the nearest they probably came to Prog in the past.
 
Dig out "Rocka Rolla" - it's even closer. Rodger Bain's production is awesome too, which is why it sounds so Sabbath-like.


Edited by Certif1ed - June 18 2008 at 05:03
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Points: 3659 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 18 2008 at 05:18
^ Rocka Rolla and Point of Entry are the only Priest albums I don't have. Maybe I'll have to invest in them, especially RR.....you've got me curious about that now.
 
As for the new one, I can't make up my mind if I like it or not. First impressions were not enough classic Priest moments but I'm going to sit on it for a while before making my mind up.
 
I can't see any reference to anyone playing Keyboards on the liner notes so I suspect most of that is actually Guitar Synth, something they used quite a lot on Turbo.
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Points: 21206 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 18 2008 at 05:53
Listened to Nostradamus today ... I think it's prog related at best. It's surely much more symphonic than their previous albums, but overall the harmonic progressions are quite tame ... it takes more than occasionally using Phrygian mode for a slightly mystical touch. Furthermore they often stay in one pace/rhythm for too long ... and it's usually on the slower side, which is a bit boring considering we're talking about a 120 minute album. On the whole I think it's a nice album, very much recommended for any Judas Priest fan, but it's not an enticing Prog Metal concept album. Some tracks venture briefly into prog territory, but it ultimately fails to be more than traditional metal enhanced with symphonic elements. Compare it for example with Ayreon - The Final Experiment, and the difference is quite obvious.
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Points: 2492 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 18 2008 at 23:14
Nostradamus is one of the most boring concept albums I have ever heard, and I've listened to Scarsick and that Torman Maxt album. Jesus, you really didn't think you could trim the material down to one CD boys?
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 19 2008 at 04:09
I was tempted to buy the album from what I've heard of the title track - are all the tracks pretty much along the same lines, then?
 
How does it compare to Painkiller?
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Points: 21206 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 19 2008 at 04:39
^ I wouldn't say that the tracks are all similar ... but from what I recall there are very few aggressive parts. One of the things I love about Painkiller is that the whole album - even the mid-tempo tracks - has this aggressive "in your face" attitude, and that's completely gone on Nostradamus. Halford also rarely ever screams ... most of the time he "wails" in the lower register, almost sounding like a depressed Peter Hammill (without the quirky bits).

Edited by MikeEnRegalia - June 19 2008 at 04:40
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Points: 3928 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 19 2008 at 04:44
I haven't bought 'Nostradamus'- I feared the worst when I heard they were adding orchestrations as I can't stand that symphonic metal stuff, and the sample tracks I heard didn't do a thing for me. I haven't played 'Angel Of Retribution' much since I bought it either- the last album they did that I enjoy was 'Screaming For Vengeance'!
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Points: 3491 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 19 2008 at 13:10
Im looking forward to geting this album, it seems very intresting, nice seeing em trying something new. Thumbs%20Up
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Points: 3659 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 20 2008 at 09:49
Originally posted by MikeEnRegalia MikeEnRegalia wrote:

Listened to Nostradamus today ... I think it's prog related at best. It's surely much more symphonic than their previous albums, but overall the harmonic progressions are quite tame ... it takes more than occasionally using Phrygian mode for a slightly mystical touch. Furthermore they often stay in one pace/rhythm for too long ... and it's usually on the slower side, which is a bit boring considering we're talking about a 120 minute album. On the whole I think it's a nice album, very much recommended for any Judas Priest fan, but it's not an enticing Prog Metal concept album. Some tracks venture briefly into prog territory, but it ultimately fails to be more than traditional metal enhanced with symphonic elements. Compare it for example with Ayreon - The Final Experiment, and the difference is quite obvious.
 
I agree, it does tend to stay at one pace, usually on the slower side for too long and these passages don't normally have any Drums either. I find myself wishing they would just kick ass a bit more than they do.
 
I'm not so sure your typical Priest fan is going to be overwhelmed by the material here, especially the die hard Metalheads. Those previously mentioned Symphonic passages may just leave them a bit cold, especially with the sheer abundance of them.
 
 
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

I was tempted to buy the album from what I've heard of the title track - are all the tracks pretty much along the same lines, then?
 
How does it compare to Painkiller?
 
Nothing like Painkiller. I think Painkiller was a response to much of the new metal around at the time like Pantera, as if to say look at us, we can be just as heavy as them. On Nostradamus the more riffy metal moments are spread too thinly and there's nothing in that area that they haven't done much better in the past.
 
I think the verdict on this album in the future is going to be an okay experiment but wont be up there with the classic Priest albums.
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Points: 438 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 20 2008 at 10:10
Nostradamus was good, but it was too long. The symphonic elements on the album were interesting and some songs venture into the prog territory (something they haven't really done since their first two albums) but this is no sign that Judas Priest has turned (or turning) prog. Still, Judas Priest rules, and this album is yet another Priest album I like (The only one I didn't like was Turbo; that album was just terrible. I haven't (and don't really want to) listen to the Tim Owens stuff)...

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Points: 5898 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 21 2008 at 03:25
Am I the only one who thinks Nostradamus is very similar to Bruce Dickinson's The Chemical Wedding? Considering that both are concept albums about historical occultists, I have a feeling that similarities between the two might not be totally coincidental. Wink
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Points: 3449 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 21 2008 at 17:21
I picked up the album today (was buying a book and saw it, so why not?) and it's playing even as I write this.  I think this is a pretty strong JP album, considering how long the guys have been at it.  There's nothing here to make me sit up and say WOW, but it's a pretty decent listen for this day and age. 
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Points: 3659 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 19 2008 at 13:51

Accepting this album for what it is rather than what I was hoping for and having lived with it for a couple of months I've come to the conclusion that it's pretty good. Far from their best of course but very worthwhile.
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Points: 12 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 20 2008 at 20:10
I tend to agree Nightfly.
I am a big fan of a band that breaks out of it's own mold and I think Priest has done that here.  It would have made a killer single disc.  A good take but, I don't think it will make the CD player that often.
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