Christian prog vs secular prog |
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: February 21 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 15585 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 09:50 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
I appreciate the sincerity of the debate here, but we in danger of getting bogged down in a religious debate and the views of Neal Morse in the prog music area. Can we stick to the original topic please, which is a much wider discussion about Christian Prog and religion in prog in general. Detailed observations on religion per se are better reserved for the non-music areas of the forum.
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el böthy
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 27 2005 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 6336 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 10:29 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
On the subject of ELP First Impression lyrics, were they not written by Sinfield?... and isn´t Sinfield jewish? That must certainly be of relevance, right? I mean, in the first place, I don´t see why a jew would say anything good about Jesus (not that they do otherwise by any means!), so when mentioning Jesus it´s either with incredulity or... I don´t know, humor maybe¿ Of course I can be wrong, as this might not be the case, and Sinfield might not be jewish after all... anyone knows if this is the case?
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"You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 10:32 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
OK, I'll try again. Anyone familiar with Rick Wakeman's In the Beginning or the Resident's Wormwood? Wakeman's is certainly Christian. Wormwood is more old Teastament. Wakeman's is more mellow to the point of being wimpy. And the Resident's one is almost diametrically opposite in it's creepiness....
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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el böthy
Prog Reviewer Joined: April 27 2005 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 6336 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 10:55 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Of course, so let the man write what ever he likes! I for one am Christian Catholic, as I was baptized, but I don´t feel very close to this religious, I think I have my own "spiritual" beliefs, so it´s natural I don´t get offended by Morse lyrics, but at the same time, if I was more into cathlicism I don´t think I would be offended either... the man has a point, the Papacy was (I really don´t feel I should talk about the now) incredibly corrupted and did what ever they feel like it for centurys, and that´s no secret either, so what´s so wrong with talking, or singing about it? And if it is an "attack" to our days Catholic institution well, let him do it, as you said yourself "Rock must be free". Ah and, and I mean no disrespect, if he attacks the Papacy its an attack to all your beliefs? I´m no expert, but I would think that there is more to the Catholic religion than just the Papacy, so why does that attack ALL your beliefs? |
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"You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: February 21 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 15585 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 11:42 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Please see my post above!!
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Space Dimentia
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 25 2005 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 440 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 11:58 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Man am I the only one who has mentioned Saviour Machine, Orphaned Land and Narnia? Or don't they count in this very interesting conversation?
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Prog is music for the mind
Hear your Orphaned child! Check out my bands myspace site: www.myspace.com/equinox17 |
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Lofcaudio
Forum Senior Member Joined: November 04 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 444 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 12:45 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
So far. I loved Eric Clayton's voice on The Human Equation, but have found Saviour Machine to be almost a bit too intense for my taste. I've heard great things about Narnia but never had the chance to give them a try.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 27 2004 Location: Peru Status: Offline Points: 19535 |
Posted: December 20 2007 at 13:39 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
I will accept Bob's request, so will only talk about the central issue.
Yes Rock must be free, but IMO Catholic, Christian, Jewish or any other religious Rock is aything but free.
I believe that used as an instrument of evangelism is a tool,. an instrument, noi different than a TV conmmercial trying to convince you of buying a determined soda because it's "better" than all the others.
And yes he or anybody may write about what they want, satanic Rock is a prove of that and there's nothing we can do to stop it, but we are also allowed strongly disagree and express that disagreement.
Iván
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endlessepic
Forum Senior Member Joined: June 22 2006 Status: Offline Points: 354 |
Posted: December 21 2007 at 00:57 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Anathallo! I've never heard anyone mention them on here before. Great band and very prog but still Christian! |
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Norbert
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 20 2005 Location: Hungary Status: Offline Points: 2506 |
Posted: December 21 2007 at 09:07 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
I mentioned Orphaned Land some posts above.
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MrBertstown
Forum Newbie Joined: April 07 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 26 |
Posted: December 21 2007 at 22:19 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
"Lay Down" by the Strawbs is about the 23rd Psalm.
And I'm surprised that there's no recording of this song by a Christian Band!
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Thank God for Kids who love Obscure Things.
Lee Hazelwood (1929-2007) |
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Walker
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 20 2005 Location: Atlanta Status: Offline Points: 824 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 11:28 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
I have never heard Neal Morse "rant" on any his cd's. What I have heard is him telling a story about what he believes. By the way, I am atheist, not christian.
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steve j
Forum Senior Member Joined: September 30 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 164 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 16:26 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Wormwood ................................There's that word again. What does it mean?
My interpretation is that it's a herb, only found in the Ukraine. The word has a Ukrainian translation. Its called Chernobyl. Does the word sound familiar?
The bible mentions this herb. It says: -
Rev 8:10 The third angel sounded his trumpet, and a great star, blazing like a torch, fell from the sky on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water - the name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters turned bitter, and many people died from the waters that had become bitter.
The interpretaion is in the ears of the receiver, but to me the interpretation is clear. It is no accident that the word Wormword is used.
Thank you Rick (Wakeman). Wormwood seems more New Testament to me, but I am not unhappy if others disagree with me.
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E-Dub
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 24 2006 Location: Elkhorn, WI Status: Offline Points: 7910 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 16:32 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
I agree that music must be 'free', but still don't understand how focusing on God isn't free. For them and for anyone willing to listen, it's freedom. You've used that word before and I guess I need further explanation on what you mean by 'free'.
Just curious.
E
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 27 2004 Location: Peru Status: Offline Points: 19535 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 16:48 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Not being used a tool of conversion and Evangelism in this case.
God is a good issue to write about, but trying to convince others that our belief is the real and only or that you must follow it, is no different than telling people drink Pepsi and not Coca Cola in a jingle.
That's my honest opinion.
Iván Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - December 22 2007 at 16:49 |
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E-Dub
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 24 2006 Location: Elkhorn, WI Status: Offline Points: 7910 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 17:36 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
That clears it up for me. Not sure I agree, but we're all different and I respect your opinion, Ivan.
E
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JesusisLord
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 30 2006 Location: Hawaii Status: Offline Points: 320 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 19:01 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, and changed the glory of the uncorruptible God, into an image made like to corruptible man.......
Romans 1: 22
Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more then the Creator, who is blessed forever, AMEN....
Romans 1: 25
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And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father. Phillipians 2:11
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 19:07 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
^ It's kind of hard to believe fully in quotes from a book which relies only on itself to prove its truth.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 27 2004 Location: Peru Status: Offline Points: 19535 |
Posted: December 22 2007 at 20:10 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
It's usual in some people to take the Bible out of context:
Romans 1 is specifiically directed to the Greeks and their unrightful behaviour that included fornication and homosexuality, an issue about which I won't talk but is not the case.
It's easy to know a book by memory, it's harder to understand it.
But our friend Jesus is Saviour is a prove of what I'm saying, he comes to a Prog Music site almost exclusively to evangelize people.
Iván Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - December 22 2007 at 20:18 |
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King Crimson776
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 12 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2779 |
Posted: December 23 2007 at 02:50 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
secular prog pwns
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