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Neil
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 04 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 1497
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Posted: August 14 2007 at 16:53 |
NaturalScience wrote:
Joke= "eugenics" sounds like "eurythmics" |
Only very tenuously
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When people get lost in thought it's often because it's unfamiliar territory.
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: August 14 2007 at 17:00 |
Heavyfreight wrote:
NaturalScience wrote:
Joke= "eugenics" sounds like "eurythmics" |
Only very tenuously |
Don't shoot the interpreter!
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Leningrad
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 15 2006
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 7991
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Posted: August 15 2007 at 01:35 |
1800iareyay wrote:
I swear if I go to one more R-rated movie and hear some kid crying I'm going to go to jail. If you can't find a sitter, you stay home. Those are the rules. It's not my fault you think condoms are weird. If you don't take your little failure-spawn out of the theater right now I'll punt it out. Then I'll go to jail, because everyone will have used their cell phone cameras to document my "crime". People should have to fill out an application to have children |
I like you more with every post.
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:05 |
Speaking of international finance...
This stock market meltdown that has apparently been a more serious crisis than genocide in Rwanda for 's sake has been triggered because apparently reputable institutions have been lending loads of money to people with bad credit ratings, no assets etc (NINJA - No Income, No Job, no Assets) and now they're ing surprised that they can't pay it back when interest rates go up. So what happens? All those financiers who parrot 'you can't interfere with the market' and 'the unseen hand of the market will regulate things' expect central banks to bail them out - which in many cases the ing, ing s have actually done to the tune of billions of dollars. Is any of this going to help the poor s whose homes are going to be repossessed? Like arse it is. Effectively it's like going into a bookmakers, betting your entire salary on a 100/1 outsider and then expecting the bookmaker to refund you when the 3 legged donkey you backed finally limps past the finishing post about a week late. If the dozy s want to be unregulated they should accept the ing consequences of their bad decisions (despite frequent protestations that they know what they're doing). Let's see these so-called libertarian capitalists stick to their principles when it all goes up for a change !
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:28 |
We had an adjustable rate mortgage for our last house - we sold it before the low rate term (5 years) expired. When we got the loan, the terms were as clear as could be - your rate will change after 5 years, and since rates are so low now, they will most likely be higher. Yet a lot of people seemed to just notice the low rate and got themselves buried in debt to afford overpriced houses - then cry foul, and "we didn't know!" when the term ends and they can't afford the payments AND, can't sell the house because the value dropped and they now have negative equity. I'm sorry, but you need to know what you're getting yourself into! Borrowing that much money and making a major purchase such as a home is a very non-trivial financial matter...might want to actually read that contract next time!!
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:45 |
Didn't I hear something about that t**t Rupert Murdoch buying out Dow Jones or something? I may have imagined it...
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:47 |
Geck0 wrote:
Didn't I hear something about that t**t Rupert Murdoch buying out Dow Jones or something? I may have imagined it...
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No, this happened. The venerable Wall Street Journal is now part of the NewsCorp family.
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:47 |
NaturalScience wrote:
We had an adjustable rate mortgage for our last house - we sold it before the low rate term (5 years) expired. When we got the loan, the terms were as clear as could be - your rate will change after 5 years, and since rates are so low now, they will most likely be higher. Yet a lot of people seemed to just notice the low rate and got themselves buried in debt to afford overpriced houses - then cry foul, and "we didn't know!" when the term ends and they can't afford the payments AND, can't sell the house because the value dropped and they now have negative equity. I'm sorry, but you need to know what you're getting yourself into! Borrowing that much money and making a major purchase such as a home is a very non-trivial financial matter...might want to actually read that contract next time!! |
So creating, marketing and selling sub prime mortgages is perfectly acceptable, and if a hedge fund makes serious losses as a result they'll be bailed out with taxpayer's money anyway.
If, on the other hand, anybody falls for the hard sell and actually takes a sub prime mortgage, it's their own fault if interest rates rise and they can't meet payments.
I agree that people should read the small print very carefully before signing a mortgage agreement, but lenders should lso execise diligence. Those mortgages didn't spring spontaneously from the aether and they didn't sell themselves. Hedge funds were not blackmailed into creating them and estate agents (or realtors) did not draw them up with guns against their heads; why absolve them from any responsibility?
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:49 |
Geck0 wrote:
Didn't I hear something about that t**t Rupert Murdoch buying out Dow Jones or something? I may have imagined it... |
Check the latest Private Eye; their take on it is hilarious.
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 16:55 |
Syzygy wrote:
So creating, marketing and selling sub prime mortgages is perfectly acceptable, and if a hedge fund makes serious losses as a result they'll be bailed out with taxpayer's money anyway.
No, this was despicable, if companies decide to give out bad loans to people who have no business getting credit, they should bear the burden of it. Some of this is happening, the company who gave me my aforementioned ARM is now bankrupt.
If, on the other hand, anybody falls for the hard sell and actually takes a sub prime mortgage, it's their own fault if interest rates rise and they can't meet payments.
If I had stayed in my house beyond the term and the interest rate rose such that I couldn't afford the payment, who would I have to blame? The terms were laid out to me in very clear language. I'll grant that there may have been shady practices and if there was outright deception than lawsuits and or prosecution should be pursued for those responsible. But I guess my sympathy only runs so deep...what happened to caveat emptor?
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We are in agreement that the subprime market was just a horrible idea, much like the savings & loan problems of ~15 years ago. The problem is our (USA) economy has become too dependent on "loose" credit.
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 17:07 |
NaturalScience wrote:
Syzygy wrote:
So creating, marketing and selling sub prime mortgages is perfectly acceptable, and if a hedge fund makes serious losses as a result they'll be bailed out with taxpayer's money anyway.
No, this was despicable, if companies decide to give out bad loans to people who have no business getting credit, they should bear the burden of it. Some of this is happening, the company who gave me my aforementioned ARM is now bankrupt.
If, on the other hand, anybody falls for the hard sell and actually takes a sub prime mortgage, it's their own fault if interest rates rise and they can't meet payments.
If I had stayed in my house beyond the term and the interest rate rose such that I couldn't afford the payment, who would I have to blame? The terms were laid out to me in very clear language. I'll grant that there may have been shady practices and if there was outright deception than lawsuits and or prosecution should be pursued for those responsible. But I guess my sympathy only runs so deep...what happened to caveat emptor?
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We are in agreement that the subprime market was just a horrible idea, much like the savings & loan problems of ~15 years ago. The problem is our (USA) economy has become too dependent on "loose" credit.
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Similar things have happened over here, and look set to happen again (mortgages are becoming increasingly - and IMO unrealistically - generous as house prices continue to rise almost unabated).
What I really object to is the way that the institutions who clamour loudest for freedom from regulation and government interference get bailed out by central banks when they screw up, partly because pension funds and the like have invested in them. Here in the UK, incidentally, the bank of England quite rightly left them to sort themselves out; it's been a different story elsewhere in the EU.
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 17:07 |
Ah, I thought I had heard it somewhere. I thought it was convenient how all these problems started after he got involved. I blame him, even if he has nothing to do with it.
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: August 20 2007 at 17:08 |
What upsets me is all these bigwigs with cash coming out their asses quivering in fear and asking "Whatever will we do if the market crashes!?!" As if human beings cannot sustain life without gasoline for their car and a cushy job behind a desk. We lived for thousands of years without these things, we can do it again. Stock up on nonperishables and start hunting in that thicket of woods behind you're really f**king big house.
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Jim Garten
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin & Razor Guru
Joined: February 02 2004
Location: South England
Status: Offline
Points: 14693
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 03:52 |
OK - just a quick rant.
Pete Docherty!
How the hell has he avoided prison - this is a guy who is constantly being arrested on charges of class A drug possession (most recently yesterday), yet he only gets warned that if this continues, he may face prison, yet a friend of mine was arrested for possession, 1st offence & spent 4 months inside!
Why is Pete Docherty not in ing prison?
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Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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mystic fred
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 13 2006
Location: Londinium
Status: Offline
Points: 4252
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 03:59 |
Jim Garten wrote:
OK - just a quick rant.
Pete Docherty!
How the hell has he avoided prison - this is a guy who is constantly being arrested on charges of class A drug possession (most recently yesterday), yet he only gets warned that if this continues, he may face prison, yet a friend of mine was arrested for possession, 1st offence & spent 4 months inside!
Why is Pete Docherty not in ing prison? |
££££££££ might have something to do with it!
no judge would put him in prison - they'd have a lot of fun with him in there...
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Prog Archives Tour Van
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mystic fred
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 13 2006
Location: Londinium
Status: Offline
Points: 4252
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 04:07 |
stonebeard wrote:
What upsets me is all these bigwigs with cash coming out their asses quivering in fear and asking "Whatever will we do if the market crashes!?!" As if human beings cannot sustain life without gasoline for their car and a cushy job behind a desk. We lived for thousands of years without these things, we can do it again. Stock up on nonperishables and start hunting in that thicket of woods behind you're really f**king big house. |
last time this happened in the 30's people were jumping from skyscrapers or forced to live in central park - or are these stories a myth?
good point - though unless you were a Scout many "survival" skills are unknown to most people, it doesn't take much to damage the thin membrane holding civilisation together -
without electricity there would be hardship, without "gasoline" there would be severe hardship, and without clean water survival would be impossible - in any of these circumstances anarchy, looting and the law of the jungle rules
it happened here just last month..
Edited by mystic fred - August 21 2007 at 04:11
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Prog Archives Tour Van
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 04:19 |
mystic fred wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
What upsets me is all these bigwigs with cash coming out their asses quivering in fear and asking "Whatever will we do if the market crashes!?!" As if human beings cannot sustain life without gasoline for their car and a cushy job behind a desk. We lived for thousands of years without these things, we can do it again. Stock up on nonperishables and start hunting in that thicket of woods behind you're really f**king big house. |
last time this happened in the 30's people were jumping from skyscrapers or forced to live in central park - or are these stories a myth?
good point - though unless you were a Scout many "survival" skills are unknown to most people, it doesn't take much to damage the thin membrane holding civilisation together -
without electricity there would be hardship, without "gasoline" there would be severe hardship, and without clean water survival would be impossible - in any of these circumstances anarchy, looting and the law of the jungle rules
it happened here just last month..
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Eat food from tin can, take water, create a fire, boil the water in tin can = sterilized water I'd welcome a situation like this. We've been living too comfortably for too long, and I always feel more alive after doing something constructive like building a fire. The problem in a situation like this would not be water (rain's good for that, unless your in the desert), but food. If nonperishables aren't nearby, and you don't live in the wilderness, you may be in a tough situation. But you know, it probably will never even come close to a situation like this.
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 7113
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 04:26 |
stonebeard wrote:
mystic fred wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
What upsets me is all these bigwigs with cash coming out their asses quivering in fear and asking "Whatever will we do if the market crashes!?!" As if human beings cannot sustain life without gasoline for their car and a cushy job behind a desk. We lived for thousands of years without these things, we can do it again. Stock up on nonperishables and start hunting in that thicket of woods behind you're really f**king big house. |
last time this happened in the 30's people were jumping from skyscrapers or forced to live in central park - or are these stories a myth?
good point - though unless you were a Scout many "survival" skills are unknown to most people, it doesn't take much to damage the thin membrane holding civilisation together -
without electricity there would be hardship, without "gasoline" there would be severe hardship, and without clean water survival would be impossible - in any of these circumstances anarchy, looting and the law of the jungle rules
it happened here just last month..
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Eat food from tin can, take water, create a fire, boil the water in tin can = sterilized water
I'd welcome a situation like this. We've been living too comfortably for too long, and I always feel more alive after doing something constructive like building a fire. The problem in a situation like this would not be water (rain's good for that, unless your in the desert), but food. If nonperishables aren't nearby, and you don't live in the wilderness, you may be in a tough situation. But you know, it probably will never even come close to a situation like this.
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Uh, you DO realize that without electricity, we'd have nothing to power our Moog synthasizer console units, right?
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 04:27 |
You do know about the coal-stove Moogs, right?
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The Whistler
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 30 2006
Location: LA, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 7113
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Posted: August 21 2007 at 04:32 |
stonebeard wrote:
You do know about the coal-stove Moogs, right? |
Oh, right, right...
This reminds me of the failed Moody Noobs "project" in which we tried to, ecologically soundly, record a non-electric album. Which meant not devices to use electricity to capture the sounds we made.
Of course, considering the sonic mess, I'm glad nothing survived...
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"There seem to be quite a large percentage of young American boys out there tonight. A long way from home, eh? Well so are we... Gotta stick together." -I. Anderson
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