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Sean Trane 
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20414
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 Posted: May 28 2007 at 07:37 |
Although I appreciated Chavez's politics a few years back, he's been losing the plot recently, really...
This is the hard thing about fighting against the US imperialism: They fight you back in every single dirty way possible, you start trying to find allies , and generally end up of course really getting on the wrong side of the tracks.
I don't really find his support to Bolivia, Ecuador (both fighting the indegenous cause as he is) or even Cuba a problem, but lately, he's been making friends with Iran, and this bugs me incredibly. This is exactly were the US want him to head in order to have him demoted.
The constant pro-US olligarchy harassment (as well as the US itself) is pushing him to become increasingly paranoiac and making idiot mistakes such as these.
Chavez is not (yet) a dictator (but it looks like if he keeps going in his direction, he could become one someday), since he is regularly elected and those elections have always been scrutinized by the UN as fair.
It would be useful for Lula and Morales to have a good talk to Chavez about lightning up on his authoritarian stances.
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let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Chus
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: Venezuela
Status: Offline
Points: 1991
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 18:12 |
 Syzygy wrote:
As reported in the UK press:
Given that the channel in question actually backed the military coup against Chavez in 2002 the reaction has been quite restrained; all that's happening is that their licence isn't being renewed. Imagine if one of the major networks in the USA openly called for the overthrow of the president and backed an armed coup against him - how long would it take for their 'right to free speech' to be called into question and revoked entirely?
Incidentally, I'm not defending Chavez here (I don't know enough about the situation for a start) but I do find the way that this has been reported in the mainstream media a little one sided, as is most of the reporting about Chavez. |
That isn't entirely true, , the channel's personnel were reported threatened by Chavez' partisans, so they could do nothing, but that's just a version of the story.
And in any case, Chavez has earn his reputation as a communist dictator by his own manner of expression and his sayings.
Edited by Chus - May 27 2007 at 18:16
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Jesus Gabriel
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markosherrera
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 01 2006
Location: World
Status: Offline
Points: 3252
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 16:34 |
NaturalScience wrote:
I'm very to sorry to hear the state of things in your country, Chus. I thought freedom of speech was curtailed already, though - isn't it illegal to criticize Chavez? I also heard a report on NPR not too long ago that described Chavez' attempts to curry favor with the people by providing a state-run "mercado" where people could obtain staples like milk, sugar, and chickens at reasonable prices (there are shortages in many places in the country, I gather). One woman stood on line for about eight hours to get said food, and was very thankful to Chavez for providing the opportunity. It occurred to me that it will be difficult for the populace to fight back against oppression if this is the way of things. |
ONE year before now..yes was easy buy chicken,etc in MERCAL ,THAT ARE UNITS OF the state for sell food,but I have five months that I cant find Milk,sugar,butter etc in this units and I ought to buy in a private supermarkets,more expensive, but are too important foods......I BELIEVE THAT RCTV MADE A LOT OF ERRORS with programs of low quality,bad tasteand service of hot calls propaganda, BUT CLOSE THE POSSIBILITY OF TRANSMIT CRITICS OPINIONS IS BAD..THE STATE could use pecuniary punish or multa but close the right of use vhf is bad. the state is the owner of.venezolana de tv,vive,antv,telesur..4 channels of 24 hrs of official propaganda..but now will have five with the new channel teves that will replace rctv
Edited by markosherrera - May 27 2007 at 16:42
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Syzygy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: December 16 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 7003
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 16:33 |
As reported in the UK press:
Given that the channel in question actually backed the military coup against Chavez in 2002 the reaction has been quite restrained; all that's happening is that their licence isn't being renewed. Imagine if one of the major networks in the USA openly called for the overthrow of the president and backed an armed coup against him - how long would it take for their 'right to free speech' to be called into question and revoked entirely?
Incidentally, I'm not defending Chavez here (I don't know enough about the situation for a start) but I do find the way that this has been reported in the mainstream media a little one sided, as is most of the reporting about Chavez.
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'Like so many of you
I've got my doubts about how much to contribute
to the already rich among us...'
Robert Wyatt, Gloria Gloom
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Padraic
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 16 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 31169
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 16:23 |
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I'm very to sorry to hear the state of things in your country, Chus. I thought freedom of speech was curtailed already, though - isn't it illegal to criticize Chavez? I also heard a report on NPR not too long ago that described Chavez' attempts to curry favor with the people by providing a state-run "mercado" where people could obtain staples like milk, sugar, and chickens at reasonable prices (there are shortages in many places in the country, I gather). One woman stood on line for about eight hours to get said food, and was very thankful to Chavez for providing the opportunity. It occurred to me that it will be difficult for the populace to fight back against oppression if this is the way of things.
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Atkingani
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: October 21 2005
Location: Terra Brasilis
Status: Offline
Points: 12288
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 16:20 |
We are following this issue closely here in Brazil, JG. 
There's no problem in having left-wing leanings if you don't have dictatorial leanings which unfortunately seems to be the case of Chavez, who was very close to Lula in the recent past but I think that after the 'Bolivia affair' our "leader", the bearded-man, solved to downgrade his admiration for Chavez.
Lula & friends themselves tried to open a public TV channel here but something isn't working properly - I guess that the Supreme Court blocked their intention.
Anyway, it's a pit that any voice (no matter which side) may be silenced.  |
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Guigo
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debrewguy
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 30 2007
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 3596
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 16:19 |
Chus wrote:
It's happening tonight, channel 2 called "Radio Caracas Television" will suspend their transmission tonight because the government won't renew their concession for open signal; obviously for political reasons. If that wasn't enough, all the equipment will be confiscated for further use in a future "state" channel (more like government channel), which clearly means abusing of private property to save budget money, and this was judicial sentence!! Freedom of speech is finally being questioned here. What also bugs me is the unwillingness for people here to make a decent protest, they just seem to take it lightly and they feel vulnerable and afraid. My conception of it all is that the government are just our employees, not our rulers; we rule, they just execute our rules. However people seem to take it differently, as if the president was a sort of limited monarch. They are in charge of public services and always act for the sake and will of the people, not viceversa nor the contrary. And yes, this administration has serious left-wing leanings (which reflects in Chavez' relationship with Fidel Castro, his admiration for Che Guevara, Allende, Mao Tse-Tung, etc.) |
Being an outsider, I will not claim in depth knowledge, but I assume some of Chavez's actions have brought him a a certain level of popularity among the poor in Venezuela. While he does have serious left leaning thinking, the thing to keep in focus is the possibility of the personality cult, & the ensuing concentration of power in the hands of any man or woman. No one is immune to the abuse of power, no matter how well meaning one may start out as.
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"Here I am talking to some of the smartest people in the world and I didn't even notice,” Lieutenant Columbo, episode The Bye-Bye Sky-High I.Q. Murder Case.
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Chus
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: Venezuela
Status: Offline
Points: 1991
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Posted: May 27 2007 at 16:09 |
It's happening tonight, channel 2 called "Radio Caracas Television" will suspend their transmission tonight because the government won't renew their concession for open signal; obviously for political reasons. If that wasn't enough, all the equipment will be confiscated for further use in a future "state" channel (more like government channel), which clearly means abusing of private property to save budget money, and this was judicial sentence!! Freedom of speech is finally being questioned here. What also bugs me is the unwillingness for people here to make a decent protest, they just seem to take it lightly and they feel vulnerable and afraid. My conception of it all is that the government are just our employees, not our rulers; we rule, they just execute our rules. However people seem to take it differently, as if the president was a sort of limited monarch. They are in charge of public services and always act for the sake and will of the people, not viceversa nor the contrary. And yes, this administration has serious left-wing leanings (which reflects in Chavez' relationship with Fidel Castro, his admiration for Che Guevara, Allende, Mao Tse-Tung, etc.)
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Jesus Gabriel
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