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Rocktopus View Drop Down
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Points: 4202 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2007 at 16:39
Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by Rocktopus Rocktopus wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

You all are doing EXACTLY what I asked you not to do.Angry
 
Why does every thread about downloading,even if the thread is dedicated to legal downloading,turn into an argument about the illegality of downloading????


And how is it possible to not see that coming? LOL

That Zoppa guy is the first one I've read here that can't seem to find one negative thing about illegal downloading.

That makes him the first person here who's just as narrowminded as the priveliged, well off fortysomething's who only see things in black and white, shouting: It's illegal! There's nothing to discuss! Bloody thiefs!
 
whenever you post and run like this I just have to laugh....LOL
 
Now how about explaining yourself adequately instead of making smart-ass comments..
 
 


When I jump in and out of this forum its my real life girlfriend I fear, not you. Haven't got more time tonight, but this is what I mean:

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Edited by Rocktopus - May 16 2007 at 16:41
Over land and under ashes
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Padraic View Drop Down
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Points: 31169 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2007 at 16:44
By the way, the NY Times (and other sources) have the news today that Amazon will soon be starting a digital music service selling DRM-free MP3s.  Right now it will only be EMI label artists (as they are the only label to have ditched DRM so far), but I'm hoping that more labels will see the light.  I'd rather have FLAC but if the MP3s are coded at a decent bitrate, that's cool.
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Tony R View Drop Down
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Points: 11979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2007 at 17:03
Originally posted by Rocktopus Rocktopus wrote:

Originally posted by Tony R Tony R wrote:

Originally posted by Rocktopus Rocktopus wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

You all are doing EXACTLY what I asked you not to do.Angry
 
Why does every thread about downloading,even if the thread is dedicated to legal downloading,turn into an argument about the illegality of downloading????


And how is it possible to not see that coming? LOL

That Zoppa guy is the first one I've read here that can't seem to find one negative thing about illegal downloading.

That makes him the first person here who's just as narrowminded as the priveliged, well off fortysomething's who only see things in black and white, shouting: It's illegal! There's nothing to discuss! Bloody thiefs!
 
whenever you post and run like this I just have to laugh....LOL
 
Now how about explaining yourself adequately instead of making smart-ass comments..
 
 


When I jump in and out of this forum its my real life girlfriend I fear, not you. Haven't got more time tonight, but this is what I mean:

Pantagruelcruel's poll

Back tomorrow.

 
wasnt suggesting you "feared" me but you surely must know that this type of posting is pure "troll". Not suggesting you are a "troll" just that one could interpret it that way.
 
Thanks for the link. I understand your postion better now.
 
I dont understand why you have to make your replies personal and thus aggressive seiing as you are quick to point out this failing in others...Smile
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2007 at 17:05
Originally posted by Frank Zoppa Frank Zoppa wrote:

Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by Frank Zoppa Frank Zoppa wrote:

Looking around at many recording artists I don't see many that are poverty stricken. For me they are grossly overpaid and want even more. If they do have problems financially maybe they should get a proper job like everyone else has to.


Now that's the kind of sucky, bigoted and blindfolded attitude we need to fight.


Not every artist is born rich, and it tends to be the pretty ones that attract the big piles of cash, while talented people slave away.


Imagine if Mozart had got a proper job because he was short of a bob or two (which he constantly was)?



A very narrow minded, somewhat naive point of view.

Now reread what you wrote and look at it this way...

If, hypothetically, Mozart's music was available to download illegaly he would have become very wealthy indeed. His work would have had a worldwide audience for his music, not just the domain of the aristocratic. The fact that he had high level of quality in his work would have guaranteed that the sales of whatever hypothetical media we are using for this debate, would have been very high. He would have become very wealthy.
The record industry stinks to high heaven.
Would you buy a car you haven't seen? No you wouldn't so why should you buy music you haven't heard before
 
 
OK, I re-read what I wrote, and I look at this way:
 
If I make something and people don't buy it, then I don't make any money. To date, I have made no money from my music - but I don't try as hard these days, since I have a family, etc.
 
When I was working on the circuits trying to make a crust from music by gigging every night, I didn't consider myself rich as I took my share of the night's takings and tried to find a floor to sleep on somewhere.
 
I didn't consider myself rich as so-called managers ran off with the kitty.
 
I didn't consider myself rich when I found a load of our tapes had got ripped off (stolen) one night - I cursed people who steal music as I still do.
 
 
Yes, the record industry stinks.
 
Stealing from the artists does not make it smell better.
 
You don't have to download illegally in order to hear music - there are streaming sites all over the place - here, for instance - and legal ways to get music for free - so that argument carries no weight whatsoever.
 
 
It's not a debate - this thread is about joining the legal campaign - I'm sorry I lost my temper; I should have just ignored your ignorant post.
 
 
If you think my point of view is narrow minded, then you might be right - but I have reason to feel this way.
 
If you think it's naive - think again about who the naive one is.
The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Tony R View Drop Down
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Points: 11979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2007 at 17:07

Sorry Cert, no point in addressing that person as he is barred from this topic....
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2007 at 17:11
Ah - I just went back over the replies and noticed that...
 
I hope he reads it and thinks, though Smile
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Points: 14693 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 03:20
Well, speaking as one of those perceived as "priveliged, well off fortysomething's who only see things in black and white, shouting: It's illegal! There's nothing to discuss! Bloody thiefs!" (thieves, actually, but... ) and as one who uses a copyrighted image as an avatar (which incidentally does no harm whatsoever to Robin Trower, as I'm not stealing his music) I'd just say that I do download music (legally, using iTunes). However, 9 times out of 10 will buy the album (if I can find it), as I want the cover art, lyrics, credits etc; I may not always pay full price, in fact rarely do - you can buy most albums at considerably reduced prices legally via Amazon's 'marketplace' - despite the common perception, I am not 'well off' (40 something, yes, but not rich).

There are perfectly legal ways of getting music at less than list price, and as for a certain person's assertion that no-one should buy a new album without hearing it first...

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Points: 21483 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 04:05
^ you could save quite some money if you used the Napster subscription instead of iTunes to "sample" the music ... fixed monthly fee vs. fixed amount per track.Smile
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Points: 2808 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 04:48
The Nick Barrett/Prog-chick situation seems so unfair when the likes of Sting, who is currently on tour, books a separate hotel suite each night of the tour just for his lute!
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 04:49
Some of the better bands will let you hear their music FREE before they release it;
 
Radiohead appalled Parlophone by putting the entire Kid A album online for free download BEFORE it was officially released.
 
It sold extremely well.
 
Muse put the entire "Black Holes and Revelations" album onto their MySpace page before general release - many bands have official MySpace pages with either streaming or downloadable tracks, and more sites like MySpace are springing up all the time - so you don't have to sponsor Rupert Murdoch!
 
Finally, YouTube (and other streaming video sites) are a fantastic way to explore a huge wealth of music - the streaming videos may be generally poor quality, but they add life to the music, and there's stuff on there that's really, really hard to track down in any other format, including rare Prog Rock.
 
I've certainly been topping up my CD and LP collection as a result of YouTube browsing - and it really helps with research.
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 04:50
Originally posted by NutterAlert NutterAlert wrote:

The Nick Barrett/Prog-chick situation seems so unfair when the likes of Sting, who is currently on tour, books a separate hotel suite each night of the tour just for his lute!
 
Unlike Murdoch, who books a separate suite for his loot...
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Points: 14693 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 07:23
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Radiohead appalled Parlophone by putting the entire Kid A album online for free download BEFORE it was officially released.
 

It sold extremely well.


You mean people actually paid for that album after hearing it???



Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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Points: 421 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 09:23
I'm sorry, but the RIAA and its draconian ways simply must be stopped.  If this means downloading and selling albums illegally, I'm all for it.
Free downloads provide an artist with a much greater audience.  People that like the music will still buy it. 
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Points: 1823 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 09:34
Originally posted by NaturalScience NaturalScience wrote:

By the way, the NY Times (and other sources) have the news today that Amazon will soon be starting a digital music service selling DRM-free MP3s.  Right now it will only be EMI label artists (as they are the only label to have ditched DRM so far), but I'm hoping that more labels will see the light.  I'd rather have FLAC but if the MP3s are coded at a decent bitrate, that's cool.
 
That's very good news that the record companies are finally seeing the light. DRM was one of the reasons why I never got into downloading. DRM never worked to stop illegal downloading anyway. 


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Tony R View Drop Down
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Points: 11979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 09:40
Originally posted by Certif1ed Certif1ed wrote:

Originally posted by NutterAlert NutterAlert wrote:

The Nick Barrett/Prog-chick situation seems so unfair when the likes of Sting, who is currently on tour, books a separate hotel suite each night of the tour just for his lute!
 
Unlike Murdoch, who books a separate suite for his loot...
 
arf,arf.arf...LOL
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Certif1ed View Drop Down
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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 10:40
Originally posted by yargh yargh wrote:

I'm sorry, but the RIAA and its draconian ways simply must be stopped.  If this means downloading and selling albums illegally, I'm all for it.
Free downloads provide an artist with a much greater audience.  People that like the music will still buy it. 
 
Please differentiate between FREE as in legally free and STOLEN, as in illegally free - it's not a hard distinction to make - and the principle's the same, except that with legally free downloads, the artist has chosen to have that greater audience.
 
If the artist has not chosen that route, please respect that decision.
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Points: 421 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 10:53
"Please differentiate between FREE as in legally free and STOLEN, as in illegally free - it's not a hard distinction to make - and the principle's the same, except that with legally free downloads, the artist has chosen to have that greater audience."
 
I'd rather not make a distinction.  If artists have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the new era, so be it.  I heartily encourage everyone and anyone to download whatever they want -- legally or illegally -- and then purchase the album if you deem what you have heard to be purchase-worthy.   
 
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Dean View Drop Down
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 11:30
Out of interest, how many artist permit 100% free download of their entire catalogue?
 
I was just wondering exactly how many Artists have voluntarily entered into the new era.
What?
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Points: 2696 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 12:29
Originally posted by yargh yargh wrote:

"Please differentiate between FREE as in legally free and STOLEN, as in illegally free - it's not a hard distinction to make - and the principle's the same, except that with legally free downloads, the artist has chosen to have that greater audience."

 

I'd rather not make a distinction.  If artists have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the new era, so be it.  I heartily encourage everyone and anyone to download whatever they want -- legally or illegally -- and then purchase the album if you deem what you have heard to be purchase-worthy.    

 


ok...... we are not being dragged kicking anywhere. We offer plenty of free downloads in a variety of places, to take yet more is disrespectful, rude and damaging.......and lets face it a tad on the greedy side.
We ask fair payment for fair goods. It's not unreasonable.


Originally posted by NutterAlert NutterAlert wrote:

Sting, who is currently on tour, books a separate hotel suite each night of the tour just for his lute!


Hotel suite???

I always thought that Stingo was a smug git!

A tour isn't a tour unless you get to breathe the fragrant air of the tour bus!


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Points: 7559 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2007 at 12:41
Originally posted by yargh yargh wrote:

I'd rather not make a distinction.  If artists have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the new era, so be it.  I heartily encourage everyone and anyone to download whatever they want -- legally or illegally -- and then purchase the album if you deem what you have heard to be purchase-worthy.   
 
 
You like being dragged kicking and screaming everywhere?
 
Now that's a good idea Evil%20Smile
 
 
So, if you want to find out if you really like a particular stereo, you'd rather steal it first and find out if you like the sound of it before you buy it?
 
I'm sorry, but in most countries, that's a crime.
 
What if I wanted to find out if I liked something you owned before I bought it, so came round your house and stole it?
 
Would you be happy with that?
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