The next Holocaust will be different

Forgotten Son wrote: Blacksword wrote: In all fairness, there is clearly something rotten in the state of Iran. Indeed. Iran is one of the worst human rights abusers in the world. Blacksword wrote: Ahmadinejad's views are fairly clear, even if what he said is attribuatble to someone else. Yes, he's a disgusting anti-semite. I'm not trying to apologise for him. That doesn't mean that Iran wants to nuke Israel. I think they've made it fairly clear that they don't want to get involved in a war, particularly not a nuclear war. I wholeheartedly believe that their bid for a nuclear weapon is solely for self-defence, which is understandable given US and Israeli unilateralism and the number of nuclear powers that surround them.

Yes, I fully understand their desire for a bomb. Any country with WMD will not be attacked by the US. North Korea had proved this. It's the language that comes out of the Iranian leadership, and the fact that they host holocaust denial conferences that set alarm bells ringing.

Dont get me wrong. I believe that it's the hypocrisy of Israel that is central to the ME problem.

Forgotten Son wrote: That's been one of the more foolish mistakes of several middle eastern regimes and peoples. They need to draw attention to the fact that the Holocaust was one of the worst events in human history, but that they aren't responsible for it. It's pretty disgusting the way Israel often cheapens the memory of those that perished in the Holocaust by comparing the oppressed Palestinians to Nazi genocidists.

Jewish, American born historian Norman Finklestein, believes there to be a 'Holocaust industry' where the memories of those years are being exploited by dark elements of the Jewish establishment to extort money out of Germany, Switzerland and Austria. Himself, the son of holocaust survivors, believes that the new wave of anti Semitism across Europe and the US is being fuelled by this lobby..

Norman Finklestein

Edited by Blacksword - February 25 2007 at 07:48

Blacksword wrote: [ Jewish, American born historian Norman Finklestein, believes there to be a 'Holocaust industry' where the memories of those years are being exploited by dark elements of the Jewish establishment to extort money out of Germany, Switzerland and Austria. Himself, the son of holocaust survivors, believes that the new wave of anti Semitism across Europe and the US is being fuelled by this lobby.. Norman Finklestein

I like Norman Finkelstein's work a lot. I own "The Holocaust Industry", in fact, though I've yet to read it. Too many books, not enough time. I'm currently reading an essay by the late great Edward Said, in a compilation entitled "The Politics of Anti-Semitism", which has an essay by Norman Finkelstein in it.

Slightly Off-Topic but I thought it worth posting here:

Open Letter to Angela Merkel

Federal Chancellor Mrs. Angela Merkel
Office of the Federal Chancellor
Willi Brandt Platz 1
10667 Berlin

19th February 2007

Open Letter

Dear Mrs. Federal Chancellor and EU Council President

We, the undersigned of this open letter are turning to you with the urgent request to do anything in your power to prevent a US war against Iran.

Everything points to an impending comprehensive aerial war against Iran waged by the United States of America. Studies of the International Crisis Group show that an attack would not be confined to the destruction of nuclear facilities alone. The aircraft carriers Stennis and Eisenhower have already been stationed in front of Iran's shores and according to The Guardian of February 10th there is a third aircraft carrier on its way to the Persian Gulf.

Those three aircraft carriers and their formations are equipped with weapons, sufficient to completely wipe out all military and civil infrastructure of Iran, including bridges, highways, power plants, refineries and water supply facilities.

To protect US warships against Iranian missiles, Patriot rockets have been installed in the South of Iraq. With alarming appeals renowned experts such as Sam Gardiner, Seymour Hersh and Daniel Elsberg have been warning for many weeks against a new war of the US-Administration. On February 4th three former commanders of the US military spoke up in the Sunday Times to warn most urgently against the disastrous consequences of an air strike. A similar warning was expressed by former NATO commander-in-chief Wesley Clarke in Munich.

The New York Times of 9th of February is bluntly supplying some pretexts for the attack on Iran by holding Iran responsible for the death of 170 US-soldiers in Iraq. No one less than Zbiniew Brzezinski turned against the distribution of such pretexts. Early in February he warned President Bush at the US-Senate's Foreign Affairs Committee not to make up fake evidence for a "defensive" military action against Iran. The situation today reminds us of the false propaganda during the months prior to the Iraq war. Unfortunately there are no indications that the US-President is working towards a diplomatic solution. He declines the dialogue with Iran in spite of the recommendations of the Baker Commission. His permanent protestations that he would prefer a diplomatic solution just serve to cheating the American people as well as the Europeans. It seems, that within the political leadership of the United States those have succeeded, who are determined to eliminate the regime of the Islamic Republic and want to bomb the Iran back into a completely irrelevant political factor in the region by the destruction not only of its nuclear facilities but also of all its military and relevant economic capacities. If this actually happens, the entire region of the Middle East will tumble into chaos, which will cause a major threat for peace in the world - not to mention the political and economic effects for the world, last not least also for Germany. With his insane war plans the US-President is acting against the majority of the Americans as well as against many of his own party. In our opinion, there is no political and moral legitimacy whatsoever for any further co-operation with Bush in the Iran conflict since any such co-operation would be understood as consenting to his aggression plans.

Dear Mrs. Merkel we ask you to act because danger is looming. Do prevent this war! Otherwise Germany and the European Union could be made responsible for a disaster of unthinkable dimensions.

- Declare an unmistakable refusal to military aggression against Iran in the name of Germany.

- Demand the EU and its member states to express themselves accordingly.

- Speak out in favour of new negotiations with the Iranian leaders without preconditions but on the legal basis of the Non-Proliferation-Treaty.

Stand up for a Conference of Security and Co-operation in the Middle East to begin as early as possible, in order to start the peaceful dialogue in the region. Either there is a common solution for the actual conflicts in the region or there will be a fire storm, chaos and new calamity for the whole of mankind.

Hoping that peace can be secured through the efforts from many sides we remain

Yours sincerely

Hans Christoph Graf von Sponek (former UN-Representative of the project “Oil against food” in the Irak)

Koppe (peace researcher)

Krippendorf (politics scientist)

Schorlemmer (civil rights activist)

Negt (sociologist)

Morgenroth (physiotherapist)

Grottian (politics scientist)

Mader (peace researcher)

Ruf( politic scientist, North Africa expert)

Buro (peace researcher)

Massarrat (politics scientist, Middle East expert)

Strutynski (peace researcher)

Claussen (chairman of German section of IPPNW)

Gottstein (Honorary chairman of IPPNW German Section)

Dürr (core physicist)

Signed by Prof. Dr. Mohssen Massarrat
Alfred de Zayas
www.alfreddezayas.com

This tickled me. Israels entry to the Eurovision song contest this year, performed by 'Teapacks' is called 'Push the Button' and seems to be about the Iranian nuclear threat..

'I dont want to go Kaput - kaboom!'

Edited by Blacksword - February 28 2007 at 16:15

sonic_assassin wrote: Blacksword wrote: ...To be frank, I think the SOSW project is to counter a still very real threat from Russia and China.. No one has ever agreed with me on this, but thats my opinion.. Well, then, let me be the first!It's common knowledge that many US missiles in the 80s were pre-programmed with the co-ordinates of certain Soviet targets.It would be interesting to know the default settings of today's missiles. <font size="-1">Pyongyang and Tehran, for sure, but Beijing and Moscow too, I daresay. Or, at the very least, I bet the co-ordinates of those last two cities are written on Post-It notes in fairly prominant places near the Red Button.

Part of the deal, after the fall of the USSR, was that the US and Russia de-target their ICBM's. In other words, delete the co-ordinates for Moscow and Washing etc, respectivly off their systems. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't. Who knows? Is it really such a hardship to reprogram them? Is the UN monitoring the targetting of each sides ICBM's. I doubt it, I cant imagine the US allowing 'weapons inspectors' to query the pentagon databases.

Russia and China are a threat to the west, especially China as it's economy booms louder every day! With Russia within 20 years of owning all the gas that flows into Europe, and their constant objections to our activity in the ME, I have to question if Vladimir Putin - ex head of the KGB - is really Mr Bushs best 'new friend' as he put it. I dont think so.

Anti-Teutons.

It doesn't seem logical for the writer to say Iran will develope a nuke and then use it to hit Israel.  If Iran wants to get the land back to the Palestinians, a Nuke wouldn't only hurt their chances aside from political and miltary retaliation there would be the radioactive fallout.

I agree that it is propoganda.   

Relating to the Tom and Jerry video posting (which I saw on Youtube) there was another video I saw that was a capture of a show from Iranian tv on why Woody Allen is an evil jewish man that will brainwash you.  I'm sure the agnostic, neurotic Allen has brainwashed us all with his stange philosophies and complaints about the world.