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micky 
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 02 2005
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 46833
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 Posted: January 01 2007 at 16:30 |
 The T wrote:
Kennedy was not only charismatic but a believer in democracy, true democracy. His father made a fortune bootlegging alcohol into the US, let's agree on that, but his sons received a great education and, even if just for patronizing purposes or something, they meant good, they were forward-thinking people, not only JFK but Bobby and even much maligned yet very good senator Edawrd Ted Kennedy (very favorable to us latins, I may say). I just don't agree with qualifying presidents because of sex life, that's their private life; I'd rather have a sexomaniac who made the people richer and happier (not in a populist, Chavean way), created jobs and drove his country into the new era than a hypocritical, disguised "moral authority" who, behind the scenes, screws everybody and not only figuratively, but literally; Give me 20 Clintons and not one "Christian" like Bush who, as a "good christian" sends thousands to their deaths because of his oil-and-power-hunger.... Nixon, a paranoid sycho who did a few good things (opened china) but ultimately was a crook (the "checkers" incident was great, watergate a disaster).... Carter was a weakling.... Reagan was a fanatic but had some ideas.... G.H.W. Bush was another religion-crazy president but less fanatic than the current atrocity.... Clinton a great president...I don't care if he had a girl under the desk, HE CREATED JOBS, HAD A SURPLUS.... now when "religion" starts feeding people and stops wars INSTEAD OF CREATING THEM, I'll be all for fanatics.
And Vietnam was not only Kennedy's miscalculation, but Eisenhower's, too.
None remembers good president L.B.Johnson who made incredible reform towards integration and destruction of the segregationist system. He was pressured by society to do so, but he DID IT. Now the "moralists" Bush and Co. are so incredible "righteous", they have scandal after scandal every week. I live in the US, I think you have to live here to have a better perspective of what this idiot is doing. |
ahhh.. just noticed the thread.. so a day late and a dollar short. But have to say ^ Most intelligent post hands down hahhaha. especially the shout out to LBJ... my vote. as much as I think Bush has set this country back decades..... Nixon. He sought to undermine the whole basis of the Constitution. Unlike Reagan... he got caught....
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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markosherrera
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 01 2006
Location: World
Status: Offline
Points: 3252
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 16:41 |
).
. Well Bush ought to pay for deaths ,going to jailL But the JUSTICE OUGHT TO do something with CLINTON too
Edited by markosherrera - January 05 2007 at 19:28
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OpethGuitarist
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 25 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1655
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 16:47 |
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^^^
le sigh
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back from the dead, i will begin posting reviews again and musing through the forums
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19535
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 16:55 |
E-Dub wrote:
Aahh, another thread against America. Keep it up and it'll overtake progressive music as the most talked about subject on this site. 
I wonder if Daniel Gildenlow has anything to do with this.
E |
Except for some people with an own agenda, most of us give our opinion because like it or not, USA rules the destiny of all our countries, if you have read my previous posts you will notice that I prefer USA than any Nationalist, Socialist or Communist Government but this doesn't make me blind.
I don't think Bush is the worst President ever, it's too soon to say that but his acts cause repercusions in all our countries, when he started the war, Bush came to visit Perú (We didn't had terrorism for almost a decade) but the night before he came, somebody placed a bomb at 50 mts of the USA Embassy, no USA citizen or functionary died because the Embassy is a bunker with no windows and 100 Mts away from the external walls, but 9 innocent Peruvians who were near died.
If USA Presidents want to be the world Sheriff and decide the destiny of our countries directly or indirectly, well, they must accept the ctitics, and I'm one of the person who always makes comments in favour of USA system because I feel more comfortable with a nation in which democracy (Despite the problems) has an impeccable record, a country where you can write in a newspaper that you disagree with the President without the fear of vanishing in the air, but this respect and this lead role has a price to pay and it's the critics, something very cheap in comparison with all the power a USA President has in and outside their country.
Iván
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Chus
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 16 2006
Location: Venezuela
Status: Offline
Points: 1991
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 17:12 |
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Is there a reason why USA under Bush's administration removed their signature from the Roman Statute that aproved the International Penal Court?
I'm talking about the Government obviously.. nothing against the northamericans
Edited by Chus - January 01 2007 at 17:13
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Jesus Gabriel
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:38 |
darksinger wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
It is a near-sighted poll though, but can't we all just predict how Bush will be viewed? I see two options:
1) Most likely (and most harsh): Took advantage of 9/11 paranoia to lead us into an unnecessary war which the true motives of will be revealed or at least apparent later down the timeline. Brought down barriers to open up drilling for oil in the US for mixed motives: tried to reduce foreign dependence on oil...by f**king up our national wildlife reserves, when stricter taxes on pollution and greener energy could have been developed, admittedly with a setback to the economy, but not everything is about the economy (if you ask me, we need to just take a breather for a bit.  ) Overall: the hard-line neo-con, a visionary with the means to carry out his vision, and who will go down with it rather than give it up.
2) Less likely (basically if the whole Iraq debacle rectifies itself...somehow): He will be seen as an aggressor who took out a dictator. The leader who cared less about the means to an end rather than the ultimate end. If by some miracle iraq does turn into a beacon for democracy and the tackling of Islamic extremism in the region, I suppose he'll be seen as the guy who was stubborn in a good way, or at least good for the American Way of Life. Speaking of...a win in Iraq will likely embolden our country into thinking it has the continued right to do this sort of thing again. Shudder to think of that *brrrrr*
You've got to be one hell of an optimist to think that the US will come out of the Bush presidency even half as respected/admired as before. |
of course we are alot less respected now in the eyes of the world. they don't get fox news international or another counterpoint to all the bashing cnn, the bbc and whatnot has inflicted. it's the usa haters getting all the press and tearing up the usa and all. if i lived in europe or asia or anyplace else and saw the sh*t being broadcast and "reported", i'd hate the usa too. it does not matter what the truth is now anyway, does it? |
But this wouldn't be such a one-sided thing for no reason. The reason the US is being brought down is because these countries want it to be brought down. face up to it (not saying anyone was denying it) but the US is clearly in the spotlight globally and has been for many years. If I was in another country, I would get sick of seeing crap about the US all the time, regardless of whether it is good or bad. Perhaps they think that if enough bad crap happens to the US, it will just exit stage left and let somebody else take center stage. Do the people in these countries really hate the USA? You'd have to ask them, but I'd wager they don't.
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:40 |
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Wow, hardly any votes for Tricky Dicky.
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Philéas
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 14 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 6419
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:46 |
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I still can't see the point of this thread...
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:48 |
Philéas wrote:
I still can't see the point of this thread...
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To bash US presidents with no mercy. Not a very good topic in my opinion.
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:50 |
 Melodrama...
Take this as a lesson. Why do people feel the need to bash US presidents? Maybe... CAUSE WE ELECT TERRIBLE ONES.
Edited by stonebeard - January 01 2007 at 19:50
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:53 |
stonebeard wrote:
Melodrama...
Take this as a lesson. Why do people feel the need to bash US presidents? Maybe... CAUSE WE ELECT TERRIBLE ONES. |
The choice between two bad choices. And USA always picks the worse one.
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 19:57 |
progismylife wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
Melodrama...
Take this as a lesson. Why do people feel the need to bash US presidents? Maybe... CAUSE WE ELECT TERRIBLE ONES. |
The choice between two bad choices. And USA always picks the worse one.
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Meh, Clinton wasn't bad. Can't remember his opponents. Seems the only peopel who don't think so are ruffled up because he either got a blow job (probably not the best moral choice to make, but W ain't the most moral of us all anyway) or he didn't follow the coservative agenda, which is logical because the guy wasn't conservative. He was a likeable person (something Bush will never be able to regain) and if anything, he made the US more favorable in the world's eye, a lot more than we can say for....well you know by now.
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:00 |
stonebeard wrote:
progismylife wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
Melodrama...
Take this as a lesson. Why do people feel the need to bash US presidents? Maybe... CAUSE WE ELECT TERRIBLE ONES. |
The choice between two bad choices. And USA always picks the worse one.
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Meh, Clinton wasn't bad. Can't remember his opponents. Seems the only peopel who don't think so are ruffled up because he either got a blow job (probably not the best moral choice to make, but W ain't the most moral of us all anyway) or he didn't follow the coservative agenda, which is logical because the guy wasn't conservative. He was a likeable person (something Bush will never be able to regain) and if anything, he made the US more favorable in the world's eye, a lot more than we can say for....well you know by now. |
I think his opponent was Bob Dole. Yes he did make USA more favorable. I think the USA needs another president like Clinton. But not Hilary.
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:04 |
Tell me about it. 
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:08 |
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Where are all the good US Presidents? It seems all the ones in the past century have been horrible except FDR.
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:10 |
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Indeed, I quite liked Clinton too, but when will the US have another President even close to his standard?
I thought Jimmy Carter was held in high esteem? I don't know anything about him or his policies, but people seem to say he was the last "good" President the US had.
Edited by Geck0 - January 01 2007 at 20:12
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:11 |
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The USA will have another good president when they have someone who can kep a budget in order instead of spending tons of money.
Edited by progismylife - January 01 2007 at 20:17
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E-Dub
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 24 2006
Location: Elkhorn, WI
Status: Offline
Points: 7910
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:12 |
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To be honest, I'm saddened whenever I hear about another soldier being blown up by a car bomb and I'm ready to get them out of there. That being said, what should the United States have done after 9/11? I mean we had to do something and it was proven that Hussein was working with Bin Laden. My biggest concern is he's still on the loose. It just all seems to be a vicious cycle, though. As I've said before, there are a lot of psychotics who simply enjoy blowing stuff up. Say what you will about the Japanese, but at least they had enough guts to come after our military and not innocent civilians.
E
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:12 |
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I can't see Hillary getting one (for obvious reasons).
Anyhow, keep it clean guys!
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E-Dub
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: February 24 2006
Location: Elkhorn, WI
Status: Offline
Points: 7910
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Posted: January 01 2007 at 20:14 |
progismylife wrote:
Where are all the good US Presidents? It seems all the ones in the past century have been horrible except FDR.
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Although it was the mid 1800's, there will never be another president like Lincoln. You want to study a man of integrity and pure honesty, he was the blueprint.
E
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