Worst USA President

It seems to me that no president or prime minister really cares about their legacy. There is a school of thought that says he (or she) who really wants that top job is probably the least suitable for it, simply because it's their ambition. While I think it would be counter productive to elect someone who didn't want the post, I think it's fact that most are in it for the life that follows presidency, rather than what they achieve during their terms. Bill Clinton done his two terms and while I'm sure 'Lewinsky-gate' didn't do him any favours, his post presidential existence has been very profitable. Former presidnets and PM's are always compared to their successors, and Clintons intellect and sophistication makes him look like a God compared to Bush jr.

Using Iraq as an obvious example; how is it that most of the planet seemed to be saying - in 2003 - this war would be unwinnable, and would be 'another Vietnam' etc. This claim was dismissed by Washington, and all who supported her, and yet to everyone else it seemed obvious. Then, three years later it turned out that we were all right! I assume, that despite Bush's lunacy, those who surround and advise him and far from stupid. One has to conclude, therefore, that they always knew the war would be a disaster, but that it would be worth the cost, for whatever dark and selfish agenda was behind going there in the first place. Blair has always known that Iraq was not going to win him votes, but the deed is done. Our relationship with the US is solid, we have a military presence in the ME, one by one de-stabilising these countries, and plundering their resources. I dont think Blair is going to lose any sleep when Cameron picks up the keys to number 10; his place in history confirmed.

Sorry to waffle. I just think there is a little more to political leadership than we think. Anyone who thinks these men are here for the benefit of us all are sadly mistaken. They aims are achieving power, being remembered in history, while massaging and scratching the backs of the super-rich, who are complicit in ensuring that legacy.

it was a toss up between carter (do nothing) and clinton (do anything so long as it flooded the dnc with contributions).

Drew wrote: In all Honesty- I dont care- I get tired of people on this site bashing the USA.

darksinger wrote: it was a toss up between carter (do nothing) and clinton (do anything so long as it flooded the dnc with contributions).   it is odd that ford got no votes-is it because many do not remember his presidency or are folks just being polite concerning his death? i'm not bashing the guy-he seemed pleasant enough-but it seems every other president has at least one vote, which is curious to me...

I think Ford was an OK President. I think where people really disapprove of him as a leader is when he pardoned Nixon.

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The T wrote: E-Dub wrote: Aahh, another thread against America. Keep it up and it'll overtake progressive music as the most talked about subject on this site. [IMG]http://www.progarchives.com/forum/smileys/smiley1.gif" align=middle> I wonder if Daniel Gildenlow has anything to do with this. E   I don´t understand how people can think that judging a country´s presidents has anything to do with attacking the country itself. In fact, I think it´s because some people care for the US that we´re sick of an idiot running the land. I think people with "i don´t give a damn" attitude do a lot more damage to the country than people that exercize their right to criticism. It´s just plain ignorance.   And, as a footnote, Gildenlow actually has some of us in his payroll....[IMG]height=17 alt="Big smile" src="http://www.progarchives.com/forum/smileys/smiley4.gif" width=17 align=absMiddle>

Just sick and tired of it all, T. I went through the same thing on a Marillion Yahoogroups that I belonged to. Anti-American propaganda was an every day occurence.

And if you think GWB is a moron, take a look at who he was running up against in 2000. Gore isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, either. Remember the video of Gore and Clinton touring Monticello, and Gore looking at the bust of George Washington and asking, "Whose this guy?" The look on Clinton's face spoke volumes.

Well, if it wasn't for guys like me buying their CD's, PoS couldn't have people as fortunate as you on their payroll.

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darksinger wrote: E-Dub wrote: darksinger wrote: it was a toss up between carter (do nothing) and clinton (do anything so long as it flooded the dnc with contributions).   it is odd that ford got no votes-is it because many do not remember his presidency or are folks just being polite concerning his death? i'm not bashing the guy-he seemed pleasant enough-but it seems every other president has at least one vote, which is curious to me... I think Ford was an OK President. I think where people really disapprove of him as a leader is when he pardoned Nixon. E        i can see that. but if you want to get technical about such matters, why did clinton pardon rich before any charges were drawn up on the guy?

But I don't want to get technical. You may be mixing up posts because I think you and I are on the same side. Sick of the USA bashing, too? Maybe I'm confusing them all.

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E-Dub wrote: And if you think GWB is a moron, take a look at who he was running up against in 2000. Gore isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, either. Remember the video of Gore and Clinton touring Monticello, and Gore looking at the bust of George Washington and asking, "Whose this guy?" The look on Clinton's face spoke volumes. Well, if it wasn't for guys like me buying their CD's, PoS couldn't have people as fortunate as you on their payroll. E

darksinger wrote: E-Dub wrote: And if you think GWB is a moron, take a look at who he was running up against in 2000. Gore isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, either. Remember the video of Gore and Clinton touring Monticello, and Gore looking at the bust of George Washington and asking, "Whose this guy?" The look on Clinton's face spoke volumes. Well, if it wasn't for guys like me buying their CD's, PoS couldn't have people as fortunate as you on their payroll. [IMG]smileys/smiley4.gif" align=middle> E   i forgot about that! man, that was even ragged on on a tv show...i forget which one. but the look was hilarious!!   in 2004, kerry was no prize either-the guy was such a waffle he belonged in a pancake house!

One of the more disgusting displays I've ever seen was during the 2004 elections. I worked for an ad agency located in (what used to be) Kansas City's main airport just north of downtown. Today it's just used for a hub for private jets to fly in and out of, but other businesses occupy the main terminal. The candidates would use the airport all of the time, and one day the Bush/Cheney plane landed and was taxiing closer. One of the art directors stands up against the window and waves the bird. I just about came unglued, though. I would never even consider doing that to the President of the United States.

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It is a near-sighted poll though, but can't we all just predict how Bush will be viewed? I see two options:

Edited by stonebeard - January 01 2007 at 14:12

stonebeard wrote: It is a near-sighted poll though, but can't we all just predict how Bush will be viewed? I see two options:   1) Most likely (and most harsh): Took advantage of 9/11 paranoia to lead us into an unnecessary war which the true motives of will be revealed or at least apparent later down the timeline. Brought down barriers to open up drilling for oil in the US for mixed motives: tried to reduce foreign dependence on oil...by f**king up our national wildlife reserves, when stricter taxes on pollution and greener energy could have been developed, admittedly with a setback to the economy, but not everything is about the economy (if you ask me, we need to just take a breather for a bit. ) Overall: the hard-line neo-con, a visionary with the means to carry out his vision, and who will go down with it rather than give it up.   2) Less likely (basically if the whole Iraq debacle rectifies itself...somehow): He will be seen as an aggressor who took out a dictator. The leader who cared less about the means to an end rather than the ultimate end. If by some miracle iraq does turn into a beacon for democracy and the tackling of Islamic extremism in the region, I suppose he'll be seen as the guy who was stubborn in a good way, or at least good for the American Way of Life. Speaking of...a win in Iraq will likely embolden our country into thinking it has the continued right to do this sort of thing again. Shudder to think of that *brrrrr*   You've got to be one hell of an optimist to think that the US will come out of the Bush presidency even half as respected/admired as before.

Edited by darksinger - January 01 2007 at 14:21