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VanderGraafKommandöh 
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
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Points: 89372
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 Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:48 |
I've found many Christians do get a wee bit flustered with us Aetheists. 
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
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Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:49 |
 Geck0 wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
For me, I believe it's pointless to assert that it's impossible for a God to exist. Again going by the widely-held idea of God to be "not human" or on such a higher level of existence, it would be foolish to dismiss it completely. Sure, in the reality that surrounds our human life, it seems hard to logically accept, but our immediate human reality may not be close to the actual reality of existence. |
Well, for me, I'd have expected God to not be hiding and to have shown itself in whatever way it can. There has been no proof of a God existing.Of course, logically speaking, it's not impossible to think a God could exist, but without any proof, I will happily lean towards the view that there is no God of any description.By the way, this isn't an anti-religion attitude, I do believe there was a martyr called Jesus (or maybe he had a different name), but he wasn't divine in the sense the Bible portrays him. He was probably what I'd call a cleric of some sort. |
God has shown himself. Nature for one. Look at the complexity of it. Also your conscience is another way of God showing himself. I could go on about this but I don't have any more ideas on this.
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
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Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:50 |
Geck0 wrote:
I've found many Christians do get a wee bit flustered with us Aetheists. [/IMG]
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Well patience is a virtue. And really hard to come by.
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:54 |
progismylife wrote:
Geck0 wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
For me, I believe it's pointless to assert that it's impossible for a God to exist. Again going by the widely-held idea of God to be "not human" or on such a higher level of existence, it would be foolish to dismiss it completely. Sure, in the reality that surrounds our human life, it seems hard to logically accept, but our immediate human reality may not be close to the actual reality of existence. |
Well, for me, I'd have expected God to not be hiding and to have shown itself in whatever way it can. There has been no proof of a God existing.Of course, logically speaking, it's not impossible to think a God could exist, but without any proof, I will happily lean towards the view that there is no God of any description.By the way, this isn't an anti-religion attitude, I do believe there was a martyr called Jesus (or maybe he had a different name), but he wasn't divine in the sense the Bible portrays him. He was probably what I'd call a cleric of some sort. |
God has shown himself. Nature for one. Look at the complexity of it. Also your conscience is another way of God showing himself. I could go on about this but I don't have any more ideas on this. |
Who's to say nature couldn't have developed that way without the aid of a diety? Same goes with one's conscience.
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:55 |
stonebeard wrote:
progismylife wrote:
Geck0 wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
For me, I believe it's pointless to assert that it's impossible for a God to exist. Again going by the widely-held idea of God to be "not human" or on such a higher level of existence, it would be foolish to dismiss it completely. Sure, in the reality that surrounds our human life, it seems hard to logically accept, but our immediate human reality may not be close to the actual reality of existence. |
Well, for me, I'd have expected God to not be hiding and to have shown itself in whatever way it can. There has been no proof of a God existing.Of course, logically speaking, it's not impossible to think a God could exist, but without any proof, I will happily lean towards the view that there is no God of any description.By the way, this isn't an anti-religion attitude, I do believe there was a martyr called Jesus (or maybe he had a different name), but he wasn't divine in the sense the Bible portrays him. He was probably what I'd call a cleric of some sort. |
God has shown himself. Nature for one. Look at the complexity of it. Also your conscience is another way of God showing himself. I could go on about this but I don't have any more ideas on this. |
Who's to say nature couldn't have developed that way without the aid of a diety? Same goes with one's conscience. |
But who defines what is right and what is wrong?
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The Miracle
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 29 2005
Location: hell
Status: Offline
Points: 28427
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:57 |
progismylife wrote:
But who defines what is right and what is wrong?
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The Supreme Court 
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:57 |
progismylife wrote:
But who defines what is right and what is wrong? |
Everyone does, based on their belief system.
Whether it really is right or wrong, we only know when it doesn't matter anymore. 
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 15:58 |
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
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Points: 89372
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:00 |
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We do as homosapiens.
Besides, why would a deity (thanks Stonie, I prefer that word) create war, pestilence, disease, drought, flooding and other similar problems?
It makes no sense.
The world has grown the way it has, precisely because there is no deity.
Edited by Geck0 - December 28 2006 at 16:01
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The Miracle
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 29 2005
Location: hell
Status: Offline
Points: 28427
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:00 |
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The Miracle
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 29 2005
Location: hell
Status: Offline
Points: 28427
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:01 |
Geck0 wrote:
We do as homosapiens.
Besides, why would a deity (thanks Stonie, I prefer that word) create war, pestilence, disease, drought, flooding and other similar problems?
It makes no sense.
The world has grown the way it has, precisely because there is no deity.
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"To test our faith" - the #1 excuse 
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:05 |
Geck0 wrote:
Besides, why would a deity (thanks Stonie, I prefer that word) create war, pestilence, disease, drought, flooding and other similar problems? |
While it may seem an unloving thing if it is the case, again trying to figure out the motives of a divine, all-powerful being, who can see a much grander picture of the universe than we, is futile. For all we know, he could have invented those things to make the humanity that would survive them over the course of thousands of years stronger. Don't you think we're stronger and better suited to survive the world now than 2,000 years ago? Chaulk it up to our ingenuity, but is our ingenuity the source of random occurance, or a divine plan? Who knows?
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:05 |
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:07 |
Geck0 wrote:
We do as homosapiens.Besides, why would a deity (thanks Stonie, I prefer that word) create war, pestilence, disease, drought, flooding and other similar problems?It makes no sense.The world has grown the way it has, precisely because there is no deity.
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Does the word original sin mean anything to you? Adam and Eve sinned and because they sinned death was introduced to the world. THey ate of the fruit tht had the knowledge of good and evil. So they let evil into the world, through their free will.
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The Miracle
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 29 2005
Location: hell
Status: Offline
Points: 28427
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:09 |
progismylife wrote:
Edit out the original? God was put in the pledge in the 1960's because Eisenhower wanted to show that the US was different than the USSR. |
Really? I thought it came form the deginning, along with "In God We Trust" on money  My guess is that they didn't want the religious people to start complaining so they specified that you don't have to say it but left it as is. The supreme court remark was a joke anyway.
Edited by The Miracle - December 28 2006 at 16:09
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The Miracle
Prog Reviewer
Joined: May 29 2005
Location: hell
Status: Offline
Points: 28427
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:11 |
progismylife wrote:
Geck0 wrote:
We do as homosapiens.Besides, why would a deity (thanks Stonie, I prefer that word) create war, pestilence, disease, drought, flooding and other similar problems?It makes no sense.The world has grown the way it has, precisely because there is no deity.
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Does the word original sin mean anything to you? Adam and Eve sinned and because they sinned death was introduced to the world. THey ate of the fruit tht had the knowledge of good and evil. So they let evil into the world, through their free will. |
There's no proof that that happened... we donlt believe in it you do, and this debate will not change anything.
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:13 |
stonebeard wrote:
Geck0 wrote:
Besides, why would a deity (thanks Stonie, I prefer that word) create war, pestilence, disease, drought, flooding and other similar problems? |
While it may seem an unloving thing if it is the case, again trying to figure out the motives of a divine, all-powerful being, who can see a much grander picture of the universe than we, is futile. For all we know, he could have invented those things to make the humanity that would survive them over the course of thousands of years stronger. Don't you think we're stronger and better suited to survive the world now than 2,000 years ago? Chaulk it up to our ingenuity, but is our ingenuity the source of random occurance, or a divine plan? Who knows? |
Random occurance.
Actually, I think we're worse off in many respects, to 2000 years ago. Sure, we're healthier, we live longer and things such as slavery have been abolished, but the underlying problems are worse.
1. Crime is more violent, more disturbing and ever on the increase.
2. There seems to be a clearer gap between classes structure occurring again - the poor get poorer, 3. the rich get richer
3. Intelligence seems to be slowly disappearing
4. Global Warming is destroying the Earth
5. Prog died in the '70s.
6. There existed the 1980s, the worst decade known to humankind
There's much more besides.
Ben: Like Ansen said, we believe in different things. We evolved from Apes, so to me, Adam & Eve are just a myth.
Edited by Geck0 - December 28 2006 at 16:15
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:17 |
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Whatever. I can't force you guys to agree with me. Thats not what Christians are supposed to do. They preach the message God does the working in the heart. Not the Christian.
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progismylife
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2006
Location: ibreathehelium
Status: Offline
Points: 15535
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:18 |
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Global Warming isn't going to destroy the earth. It has been happening for ages. In fact it has been getting colder and now has been getting warmer. England used to grow grapes that rivalled Frances in the 1600's.
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chamberry
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 24 2005
Location: Puerto Rico
Status: Offline
Points: 9008
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Posted: December 28 2006 at 16:19 |
People. People. Settle down. All of the answers to our fraustrated questions can be found here :  Watch and be amased! 
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The Atheist Thread
