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Yukorin View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2006 at 22:41


Proto-Zeuhl

Proto-Zeuhl definition

Zeuhl Bands in existence prior to Magma that influenced the development of Zeuhl. The early 20th Century was a predominately experimental period for music. These bands were moving in a stream that eventually led to Zeuhl. These bands were a mixture of musical genres like Neoclassicism, Romanticism, Modernism, and Fusion. Some of these bands became Zeuhl bands themselves others did not.

Proto-Zeuhl bands/artists list


Coltrane,John
Stravinsky,Igor
Orff,Carl
Stockhausen,Karl-Heinz
Bartok,Bela
Satie,Erik
Zorgones,The


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2006 at 22:51


             (John Lydon interview http://www.johnlydon.com/interviews/pil04.html) :


PiL always seemed interested in musical technology. You’ve said before that you would treat the studio as an instrument.

Yeah, but now it’s fashionable to say that we copied Can. Well listen to Can and Kraftwerk and you’re talking sh*t! (laughs). It’s nothing like it, it’s like saying the Pistols copied The Ramones, what the f**k are you talking about! Have you no ears (laughs). It’s just not understanding... Can were a band nobody tolerated then, or Magma, or NEU, but you know, I wasn’t going with that because I was fashionably weird, it‘s just what I liked.

John Lydon, circa 1983 © unknown Can were one of the few bands you ever admitted to liking at the time, it was the only reference they had! It’s just lazy journalism.

Yeah, Can, along with 20,000 others! And if you want to know how I first found out about Can, it was from Sid! And I don’t mind telling anyone that ‘cos that’s the truth, that’s how we were with music.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2006 at 23:17

            Nice critical review of MDK found here http://starling.rinet.ru/music/magma.htm


Magma is one weird, weird, weird band. Nowhere near as weird as some would tell you, though. Here are some preliminary facts you need to know: 1) Magma were a French band, one of the very few to achieve fame in a rock background; 2) Magma had different lineups for practically every album, but were always centered around drummer Christian Vander, who had the 'vision' for the band; 3) in their prime, Magma wrote exclusively on their whacked sci-fi themes, namely, their music was centered around the legendary planet Kobaia, settled by people fleeing the Earth's wickedness, and upon further Kobaian relationships with Earth; 4) here's the real kick: the singing for these records is done entirely in 'Kobaian', a crazyass artificial language made up by Vander and Co. and sounding like an irrational hybrid between German, Hungarian and God knows what else (on paper - vocally it's just gibberish); 5) the music itself is vastly pretentious - naturally, as it's supposed to reflect the kind of music that'd be played in a far, far removed future - and significantly varies in style from album to album, though admittedly not within the limits of any given album; 6) you need anything else? Wait until I give these guys a proper page. They deserve it. Oh, wait, the closest analogy to the band I can think of is Gong, of course, another band that was French-based and had an equally demented leader and a strong "self-mythological" background, but Magma definitely beat Gong out in the 'far-out' department. Except that they don't seem to grasp Gong's sense of humour.
Now that's out of the way, let's concentrate on Magma's Mekanik Destruktiw Kommandoh album, from 1973. (Please excuse me the lack of umlauts - I don't want to f**k up the encoding). First, the background. It is subtitled as 'Third movement of Theusz Hamtaahk' ('Time Of Hatred'); the problem is, chronologically it was the first movement, and as for the other two, one of them only came out as a Christian Vander solo project some years later and the other one, though regularly performed live, was not captured on record until many years later. Not that this kind of development should surprise you if you know anything about Magma. In any case, MDK is, like its predecessors, a concise 'rock opera' of sorts, and here's the plotline retold in brief: a guy called Nebehr Gudahtt, subtitled The Great Prophet, has a vision that the Earth is cursed forever and destined to perish, and the only way for the people to save themselves is to unite themselves and sacrifice their lives on Earth in order to achieve proper enlightenment. The people naturally rebel and march against him (a little inconsistency here - why they didn't just send the Alpha Group to kick his balls is beyond me). As they march, they are, however, one by one seized by doubt, and at last one of the marchers turns around and says that the Angel of Light has smiled upon him and that he understood the guy is not a tyrant, but a sage, and then the people repent and pay homage to the Gudahtt fellow, and they all begin chanting hymns which take them to the state of grace. In the end they all die and achieve salvation, or whatever. The liner notes tell all these things in a far more elaborate fashion, of course, but who cares? Magma's mythology is all a jet of bilgewater anyway.
What is not a jet of bilgewater is the music, which rules immensely. Too good they're all singing in Kobaian, as required, and nobody but the most diehard fans with extra linguistic experience can decode the stuff they're chanting; any direct meaning would only spoil the picture. MDK is often called Magma's musical peak, and it's definitely like no other record ever made... well, it does have some Amon Düül II parallels, though. This is perhaps the most convincing mix of rock and opera I've ever heard. It's pretty useless to dissect the album into individual tracks (I couldn't even be guaranteed to spell their names right, not to mention the umlauts!); they often flow into each other so that you don't notice the transition at all. They're also more or less all produced in the same style.
The basic pattern of the melody is jazzy, although at times I can smell poppy and even Broadway-ish overtones. However, it's not really the instrumental melody that matters the most; none of them are particularly memorable, and there's next to no blistering instrumental passages - not a jaw-dropping guitar or organ solo in sight. It is the vocals/instruments interplay that's the meat of the album. The singing, done mainly by Klaus Blasquiz (male) and Stella Vander (female), is structured in fine Wagnerian tradition, with 'arias' rather than 'songs' offered to your ear, and lengthy, mesmerizing, pompous passages that slowly amount to tremendous, occasionally hysterical choruses. At times, you could say that the music isn't progressing at all, with 'loops' of harmonies hanging out there in the air forever, and yet there is a subtle, subconsciously evident movement, and then hoopla, the 'loop' suddenly explodes in a whole torrent of sound, with keyboards, horns, drums, bass, and miriads of chorale overdubs flowing out in every direction... turned out loud, it's pure, pure magic.
What is perhaps the most wonderful characteristic of the album is how dang accessible it sounds, for my ears, at least. There's next to no dissonance at all, in fact, if you've heard just a wee bit opera, you're in for a fully enjoyable ride. Music that nobody had ever dreamt of composing until then, complex and adventurous as hell, and yet totally understandable. I could care less about the idiotic plotline - all I know is how dang optimistic and uplifting this sounds, just like a nice little six-hour Wagner opera should. The keyboards and brass sound fresh and exciting, the multi-layered harmonies are energetic and (sometimes) hilarious, and unlike, say, Freddie Mercury singing operatic, these guys almost sound adequate (can't believe I'm saying this!). It all comes together in the blistering, triumphal conclusion (singing celestial hymns to Kreuhn Kohrmahn the Supreme Being, no doubt?), which is just the right finale for this kind of thing, but believe me, these sections all qualify. The only serious complaint is that it all sounds the same, but I guess it doesn't sound the same any more than an opera sounds the same; a more serious complaint would state that occasionally, the 'harmony loops' get a bit too long, to the point of becoming annoyingly repetitive, but it's not like any of them go on for ten minutes or anything, and like I said, the 'resolution' of each loop is always brilliant.
So give it a try! A grizzly old snubby reviewer like me, who doesn't really get his mind blown away any more no matter what kind of weird music he might have heard (and is Magma really any more weird than the Residents or Captain Beefheart or Throbbing Gristle?), won't probably appreciate this stuff as much as some of the more innocent Magma fanatics, but I tell you: this is goddamn worthy. Why doesn't this band get any more recognition? Just because any DJ who'd like to play one of their tunes on the radio would twist his tongue trying to pronounce the title? sh*t, did all these DJs sleep through their Kobaian lessons at school?


















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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2006 at 23:34


      BV ! The french beat us to it...



Année 1975 | Note 4 | Tous les chroniqueurs

résultats 1 à 30 sur un total de 33 • page 1 sur 2

AREA - Are%28a%29zione

AREA - Are(a)zione

Par Progmonster - jazz / progressif

ARTI+MESTIERI - Giro di valzer per domani

ARTI+MESTIERI - Giro di valzer per domani

Par Progmonster - jazz / progressif > jazz rock > fusion

CAN - Landed

CAN - Landed

Par Progmonster - progressif > psychédélique > kraut rock

CLEARLIGHT - Forever blowing bubbles

CLEARLIGHT - Forever blowing bubbles

Par Progmonster - progressif > symphonique > fusion

Brian ENO - Discreet music

Brian ENO - Discreet music

Par Progmonster - classique / ambient

FRIPP & ENO - Evening star

FRIPP & ENO - Evening star

Par Progmonster - progressif / ambient > Frippertronics

Olivier GREIF %281950-2000%29 - Sonate de guerre

Olivier GREIF (1950-2000) - Sonate de guerre

Par Trimalcion - classique > contemporain/piano

Keith JARRETT - Back hand

Keith JARRETT - Back hand

Par Progmonster - jazz > free form > post bop

JETHRO TULL - Minstrel in the gallery

JETHRO TULL - Minstrel in the gallery

Par Progmonster - folk / progressif > hard rock > médiéval

Fela KUTI - Expensive sh*t

Fela KUTI - Expensive sh*t

Par Progmonster - jazz / world music > afro-beat

LIBRA - Musica & parole

LIBRA - Musica & parole

Par Progmonster - jazz / progressif > fusion

Dave LIEBMAN - Drum ode

Dave LIEBMAN - Drum ode

Par Progmonster - jazz > jazz électrique > kozmigroov'

NEU! - 1975

NEU! - 1975

Par Progmonster - progressif > psychédélique > kraut rock

Bernard PARMEGIANI %28b27%29 - De natura sonorum

Bernard PARMEGIANI (b. 1927) - De natura sonorum

Par Trimalcion - classique / electro > contemporain/électro-acoustique

PHOENIX - Cantafabule

PHOENIX - Cantafabule

Par Progmonster - folk / progressif

PIIRPAUKE - S/T

PIIRPAUKE - S/T

Par Progmonster - jazz / progressif / world music / folk

RAINBOW THEATRE - The armada

RAINBOW THEATRE - The armada

Par Progmonster - progressif > symphonique

Wayne SHORTER - The soothsayer

Wayne SHORTER - The soothsayer

Par Progmonster - jazz > post bop > modal

Chris SQUIRE - Fish out of water

Chris SQUIRE - Fish out of water

Par Progmonster - progressif > symphonique

VORTEX - S/t

VORTEX - S/t

Par Progmonster - progressif > proto zeuhl



http://www.gutsofdarkness.com/god/selection.php?annee=1975&note=4&membre=&session_new=f06ae213fcbe911f019e82a587668754


                                                           


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 00:10


         mildly amusing news-group discussion:


http://www.newsbackup.com/about369022-0-asc-0.html
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 02:29
Wow, some very interesting stuff Yuko!

Cept when i click on the links in the Proto Zeuhl part.. I go straight to the beatles Archive page.

Which i s a bummer cause i wanna find out more about Mr. Carl Orff.

Oh well. To Google!!



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 04:30

Bands and artists in the Zeuhl family so far mentioned on this thread:



Magma
Vortex
Pataphonie
Archaia
Eider Stellaire
Dun
Koenji Hyakkei
Shub Niggurath
Weidorje
Ruins
Pseu
Eskaton
Runaway Totem
Guapo
Universal Totem Orchestra
Zao
Happy Family
Patrick Gauthier
Bondage Fruit
Yog Sothoth
Kultivator
Evohe
Univers Zero
Art Zoyd
Heldon
Lacrymosa
Metabolist
Strawberry Song Orchestra
Cicala Mvta
Triple Zero
Uppsala
Olive Mess
St. Erhart
Hiatus
Bedjabetch
Verto
Noa
Honeyelk
Xaal
Ex Vitae
Resonance II
Hellebore
Cortex
Anaid
Yoch'ko Seffer
Troll
Musique Noise
Jacques Thollot
Tipographica
Abus Dangereux
Altais
Serge Bringolf
Couer Magique
Cruciferius
The Zorgones
Nyl
Paga
Perception
Jean-Paul Prat
Speed Limit









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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 06:46



          Helluva great Japanese Magma/Zeuhl fansite. Check the URL !



http://zeuhlab.unofficial.jp/



                                                         すっげぇ〜!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 06:51


       you can always rely on the Japanese to agonise over something like this:




        


















Edited by Yukorin - September 17 2006 at 06:58
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 06:54




















Edited by Yukorin - September 17 2006 at 06:58
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 06:59

















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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 07:00
















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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 07:02




                                 et voila!  Looks wrong to me but who am I to argue?!:


















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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 07:15



          Great review (albeit in Japanese) and pictures of Magma's sensational gig at Shibuya Quattro last year:





(performing 'Wurdah Itah' with solo piano)



                                          http://smashingmag.com/tour/05tr/050917magma_nob1.html












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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 07:32


            A review of the gig a day previously where they showcased KA and also the upcoming Ementeht-Re and encored with a stunnin' extended 'Kobaia'





                                                         http://smashingmag.com/tour/05tr/050916magma_tod.html

















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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 11:22



                                                    it can't be...can it ? !






         













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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 11:50



                                                If it is Stella was she rivals with...








                                                                                       ...?






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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 12:01

Famous MM article from the early days:


Melody Maker (Mar 11th, 1974)

It was five years ago that, in the face of local apathy, Christian Vander set about forming Magma. Vander, initially a jazz drummer, and one with a pedigree as long as your arm, had become scornful of the abilities of his jazz improvising contemporaries.

He could find no one that shared his passion for the musical and spiritual path adopted by the late John Coltrane, and, somewhat disillusioned, he ultimately abandoned the jazz scene and took whatever commercial gigs were available.

Thus it was that at one point in 1969, Christian found himself laying down a half-hearted off-beat behind Arthur Conley on a tour of Italy.

On returning to France, he found that a number of French rock groups had sprung into existence, possibly motivated by the lack of visiting talent. Amongst these bands were Triangle and Martin Circus, unknown over here, but for a while fantastically successful in France.

"The audience were on their knees before these bands," recalls Vander, "and everyone was telling me that they were tremendous. I knew differently. There was nothing there at all."

So Vander decided that he'd alter the listening habits of France by forming his own band.

His dream was to realize this by playing music that was spiritually as well as physically satisfying.

The problem was finding the right musicians. There were initially no virtuoso jazz players that were prepared to attempt Christian's experiment, so Vander looked instead for people who were not necessarily great players, but who had character and imagination and energy.

Surprisingly, the first musicians that wanted to play with him were the horn players from Johnny Halliday's band, who were honking and riffing themselves to sleep every night, playing music in which they had neither faith nor interest.

Thus it was that the first inception of Magma was by Vander's own admission, "Musically atrocious."

A twelve-piece band, it incorporated the Halliday fornt-line, a free jazz double bass player, Laurent Thibault on electric bass, who was later to produce the first album ("a lovely guy, but he couldn't play in time"), Eddy Rabbin on keyboards, the excellent Claude Engel on guitar, and Rene Garber on vocals.

Rene, who rejoined the band last year as a contrabass clarinettist, suffered from an inability to sing in tune, and has since returned to music college to study pipe organ.

But from shaky beginnings, Magma gradually took off, having picked up Klaus Blasquiz at a demo studio, when Garber had failed to turn up for the recording.

Vander had decided that the band shouldn't sing in French as the language is weak sounding one, and as he couldn't speak any other language, he invented his own, full of gutteral noises, and strange Teutonic syllables, perhaps instinctively reflecting Vander's own background, for his roots are not in France, but rather in Poland and the Baltic forests - his grandfather was a nomadic gypsy violinist.

But to make the new language functional, Vander sketched out a kind of outer-space morality play, a continuing rock cantata entitled "Theusz Hamtaahk," being a multiple-part story of relationships between Earth and an imaginary Earth-colonised planet named Kobaia.

Using this unlikely plot, Vander has created a sci-fic microcosm that bulges with all manner of contradictions and controversies, using the theme to propose all manner of arguable points.

Among these, that tyrants are, or can be, guides for civilazation, and that wisdom and enlightenment can only be achieved via punishment.

Strong stuff, and the recorded tales of Kobaia so far center around damnation than salvation, with multiple cyclic disasters much in evidence.

To date they've been three Magma albums: "Magma"(French Phillips 63595.001/2 - a double album), "1001 Degrees Centigrades"(French Phillips 6397.031), and "Mekanik Destruktiw Kommandoh" (A&M SP-4397).

Of these, only A&M record is widely available in this country, although the first two may be obtained from better import shops.

It has to be emphasized. however, that it's not just in lyric content that Magma are a force apart from the rest of rock.

Musically, they're more far-reaching than any other band I can think of, and they absorb influences from literally every music form, taking in elements of Bartok, Stockhausen, Carl Orff, Wagner, Coltrane, Ellington, fragments of European folk musics, oriental drones, yet all the time retaining rock'n'roll vitality, with explosive use of dynamics.

They breeze effortlessly through crippling time changes, yet without sounding overtly "intellectual" or "tricky." Indeed, at recent English Magma gigs, idiot dancers have been observed happily getting it on in 7/4 and 9/4, something unthinkable at, say, a Soft Machine concert.

And speaking of the Softs, it's interesting to recall that their "Third" was hailed as a masterpiece of invigorating invention, and we were told that the band's "crucial importance in the future of popular music cannot be denied."

That's as maybe, but it's fascinating to observe that Magma's first album is exactly contemporary with "Third", and in compositional and instrumental terms, it far outstrips the Softs' record, although the two bands at this period shared a certain unity in their use of horns.

The principal reed player on all of Magma's recordings has been Teddy Lasry, who's no longer with the group, but is far too important to leave out of any history. Lasry's departure has not been one of choice, but the saxist/flautist is only partially-sighted and cannot take the strain of life on the road. Nontheless, lasry helped shape the direction of the band, and contributed saveral compositions, notably "Sohia" and "Iss Lansei Doia", to Magma's repertoire. Lasry still performs with the band occasionally in France, where the group play six-hour long sets, a somewhat daunting prospect, since the two-hour concerts they've given in England have proved to be the ultimate sensory overload.

Even now, Magma continues its unstoppable path through Britain leaving behind a string of standing ovations, and a legion of new believers.

Magma's self-styled "Zeuhl Music" is like nothing else ever heard by English audiences, and yet it's met with an open, positive response almost everywhere the band has played.

Christian Vander has been drumming for more years than he cares to remember, but it looks as though his time is finally at hand.




















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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 12:03


from The Independent 2005/10/27:



With fans ranging from snooker champion Steve Davis to Condé Nast director James Truman, Magma is certifiably the only French rock group with a cult following outside the Gallic hexagon.

This cult has been exacerbated by their virtual disappearance in the last decade. Founded in 1969 by Christian Vander, a ferouciously mascular drummer, Magma had all the aura of a clandestine religious or political organization. Vander invented his own language, "Kobaian", in whose gutteral, umlaut-littered syllables all Magma songs were sung and their live shows, with enough spotlights and synchronization to make Leni Riefenstahl envious, resembled New Age Nurembergs. In keeping with their underground mystique, Magma recently reappeared in Epinay-sur-Seine, a sad suburb half an hour outside Paris (in the news for legalising homosexual couples) where their record label lingers.

Here in the Espace Lumiere, 100 school-children were gathered to sing the music of Vander. Considering his reputation, a musician's musician thought too extreme, fanatical and violent by his own brotherhood of drummers and that Magma have been accused of everything from proto-Facism (their cryptic-mystic logo) to Satanism (Vander's fondness for massive chord changes round the "Devil's Seventh"), a chorus of suburban kids would not seem appropriate. In fact, the application of these innocent crystalline voices to Vander's seminal "Mekanik Destruktiw Kommandoh", was altogether astonishing, an hour of pure vocal pulse whose soaring clarity redeemed it from any threat of the cutes.

If Magma have long been stuck in the Progressive Rock rack between embarassing names like Mona Lisa and Magna Carta, this concert made clear Vander's roots are nothing but jazz. From his father Maurice, a respected pianist, to his own Coltrane fixation, Vander's legacy is one of incredible tonal complexity. Here that complexity was, paradoxically, made paramount by the simplicity of means. If they now seem irredeemably Seventies, Magma were part of the courageous musical experimentation and innovation of that decade often overlooked at the expense of sartorial revivals. Even if their producer Giorgio Gomelsky also promoted the Rolling Stones and their superb bassist Jannick Top is now musical director for Johnny Hollyday, Magma's ambitions were always structural and spiritual rather than commercial, and this integrity is their most important, well-guarded asset.

If the new Magma is altogether more discreet, pubescent trills in the place of bombastic drum batteries, and even more evidently a personal quest by Vander, they remain an awesome sonic experience beyond the anecdotal vageries of cult status. To become an internationally revered French rock band has always been too improbable but Magma, more than any one, have tested the limits of that possibility over the last 25 years.













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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 17 2006 at 12:08



         a great, great site with some sound samples


http://stevehegede.tripod.com/france.htm


                                    (an' always nice to see Serge Gainsbourg get a mention)








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