Gentle Giant HAS BEEN HIP-HOP SAMPLED!!!

ivan_2068 wrote: The problem is that I find nothing challenging in Rap or Hip Hop, the lyrics provided by Nobody on a recent post, despite his freak interpretation, are a prove of that.

Interesting that no effort beyond this puerile accusation is made to rebut, or even to marginally contradict, my "freak" interpretation.  Clearly the accuser cares not for intellectual debate based on substantive analysis of the material at hand,

Face it, you've never heard good hip-hop because you've made no effort whatsoever to do so, having as you do a fixed, opinion of what is "legitimate" musical material and what is not.  The idea that you would make the assertion that "legitimate" music must always emphasize melody above anything else is further proof, were it needed, of your unfounded, ill-advised biases.

Quote edited by Admin

ivan_2068 wrote: [ Hey you I disagree with you

No, sir, you do not disagree with me, at least in the classical concept of someone in "disagreement" being available to offer any ideological or analytical substance with which to lend creedence to their opposing viewpoint.

Yes I disagree, because the lyrics you provided say nothing to me, I believe their artistic value is equal to zero, and I believe I'm entitled to that.

Calling someone a "freak" because you are unavailable to meaningfully refute or contradict their exactly-stated, carefully- and accurately-referenced analysis of the subject matter in question doesn't qualify as "argument," your infantile protestations to the contrary notwithstanding.

Hey you kid, when did I called you freak?  The fact that i find nio value in the lyrics you provided is sonmething personal.

If you do not wish to be called "names," you might consider not initiating that tone of discourse in your rude and insubstantive quasi-analyses of the things being discussed in this thread.

I'm not trying to make an analysis or quasi analysis, because i can't care less for Rap or Hip Hop, I believe it's a free Forum and I'm entitled to like or dislike whatever I want.

As a fact I believe those genres don't have a place in a Progressive Rock Forum, you can agree or disagree, it's your right, but this doesn't give you the right to insult me, after you started this calling racists to all those who don't like Hip Hop, which if I'm not wrong are a vast majority here.

Iván

I am certainly many things, but "music newbie" ain't on the list, bro', regardless of the quantity of posts next to my name.

A banned troll?  Nope, never even been to this board until about 2 weeks ago.

I doubt it,m because you have talked about an issue that was talked sevetral ,months before

As for Curtis, that was a nice try Googling him, picking an album at random and dismissing his music after 1971's Roots, as if you've ever listened to him before in your life. 

And since about a few minutes Groupie, if you check past posts about soul or Jazz you'll find that Curtis Myfield was mentioned in at least a couple of older threads by me.

I suppose gems like "Right On for the Darkness" and "Hard Times," themselves as good as any music ever made by anyone, ever (from Back to the World and There's No Place Like America Today, 1973 and 1975 respectively) just don't measure up to the seminal effect his earlier albums with the Impressions have had on shaping your (admittedly egalitarian and well-informed) worldview.

As I said, his music is not my cup of tea, I usually go deeper in the issues that interest me more, I don't need to have listened all his music to respect him.

Still waiting for a factually-based (as opposed to the right-wing proclivity you display for reaction-based) refutation - or even a modicum of challenge - to my earlier comments on sampling and detournement.

I only  reacted to your attack   to any person who doesn't like Rap or Hip Hop calling them racists, before that I hadn't even mentioned you or cared about any of your posts (As a fact I didn't even knew about your existence), as I won't probably care for any later one you write.

I don't pretend to be an expert on Rap or Hip Hop and all genres of music, but I believe I heard enough Rap and Hip Hop to know what I like and what I don't like.

Iván

These lyrics are full of hate and violence, because the communities they come from are often, for many reasons, decimated by the endless cycle of hate and violence.  In other words, these lyrics are real.  What's fantastic about the Geto Boys in general and this song in particular is that they inject a psychological analysis and vulnerability all-too-inevident in what is commonly referred to as "gangsta rap".  "Trigga Happy N*gga" is interesting because although on the surface it seems to characterize an individual wrought of conscienceless violence bent on total annihilation of all he surveys, in the actual resolution of Bushwick Bill's verse he lets the people he is robbing live and doesn't kill or even injure them:

It's fascinating the guilt complex of some people in USA, they excuse a  couple of criminals who always managed to get money, first selling drugs to their own people

Bushwick Bill Born in the South Acres area of southeast Houston, Scarface, AKA Mr. Scarface, managed to find trouble quite frequently. At an early age he was put out of his mother's house, moved into his grandparent's home that was full of nieces and nephews, and he started selling drugs.

Then they got a juicy contract with Geffen and Giant Records and he managed to get money selling this violence and hate to their own people and to stupid white kids who love to listen insults.

Yesterday I was watching a Rap Special on A&E and one of the guys (Who's name I don't know or care, all covered with gold chains enough to feed a whole neiborhood  shouted " Do you want more music you Mother Fu**ers" and the stupid crowd (Mostly white kids and girls looking very cute) cheered them. For God's sake, what a bunch of loosers!!!!

This is false, this is a lie, there's poverty everywhere, but this guys are using this discourse because it's profitable, sounds at least phony.

"Gimme the money, I'm gettin' tired of this waitin' sh*t
She said 'The box is empty...'
I said 'Ain't that a b*tch?'
Back to the safe, you better open it fast
I'm gettin' tired, I'm about to melt a cap in your ass
I got all their money, let 'em live, how you figure?
I'll forever be a trigga happy n*gga..."

Yeap, he got the money, first selling drugs and then selling violence.

Not trigger-happy enough to actually pull the trigger, apparently.   It's these distinctions, like the self-doubting anguish expressed in "Life In the Fast Lane," "Mind Playin' Tricks On Me" and countless other songs, that make the Geto Boys worth listening to, IMO.  I in no way disagree with the assertion that the vast, vast majority of this subgenre of hip-hop is in fact utterly worthless, misogynist crap, but there are exceptions and in these exceptions true, valuable and lasting art can and has taken place.

I believe we're talking about the general rule, it's violent misogynist, always people manage to mention one or two examples of suposedly good rappers (First was inmortal Technique who spoke crap in favour of violence in Perú, a country he left to live in USA and about which hel knows absolutely nothing,

I live here and I know what is to leave your house without knowing if you were going back in the afternoon At the end it was easy to find that he was the problem, because jhe ended in jail...he was the violent.

Anyway, Mayfield's words may seem more elegant to you because they are from a less vulgar, profane age (perhaps),

No, because real protest is more subtle, Mayfield uses his brain, Mayfield is honest he touches a problem without the irrational hate of this ex-criminals, he doesn't exploit the problem to recieve a huge amount if money while their lyrics make the violence problem even worst.

but they are absolutely reflective of the same reality and character: the inner-city ghetto street-level drug dealer, and the two songs from then and now are united (as in a continuum) by much, much more than a shared musical content.

What reality? This music is written by guys who earn million dollars from albums  being sold to white kids who use daddy's Master Card to buy them. People in ghettos don't buy albums, Social Security doesn't cover that, their target audience is formed by white middle class kids who want to be Revolutionary in High school while they hook cheerleaders. All this is fake

  I appreciate you finally speaking to the details of the music in question and how they make you feel... this was my goal all along, thank you for that.

BTW: Still I'm waiting for an apologize.

Iván