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thefalafelking
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 28 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 130
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Topic: Progs bad name: whos responsible? Posted: December 08 2005 at 07:51 |
Rick Wakeman without any doubt.
cheers
flfkng
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Trotsky
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: October 25 2004
Location: Malaysia
Status: Offline
Points: 2771
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 07:55 |
A lot of factors played their part ... but for me the music press is highest on this list ...
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"Death to Utopia! Death to faith! Death to love! Death to hope?" thunders the 20th century. "Surrender, you pathetic dreamer.”
"No" replies the unhumbled optimist "You are only the present."
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chopper
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 20030
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 08:04 |
The music press who decided punk was in and prog was out. Mind you, the excesses of Wakeman and ELP probably didn't help.
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iguana
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 01 2005
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 825
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 08:34 |
i shan't go into bashing the music press – one must
always be nice & considerate to people who are just
plain DEAF. besides, most of them have their heads
so far up each others' backsides that they must at
best be ignored at any time.
my choice of scapegoat would be jon anderson and
steve howe, who completely lost the plot in 1973 and
created "tales from topographic oceans", IMHO the
biggest turd ever released under the prog rock
banner and largely responsible why everyone else
screamed "enough already!" in the aftermath. both
have redeemed themselves very quickly since but
the genre and music in general have never quite
recovered...
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progressive rock and rural tranquility don't match. true or false?
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Atkingani
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: October 21 2005
Location: Terra Brasilis
Status: Offline
Points: 12288
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 08:34 |
Here in Brazil prog hasn't a BAD name... but it is normally ignored by the media with few exceptions.
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Guigo
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Space Dimentia
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 25 2005
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 440
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 08:58 |
Well Iv voted the Music press beacuse they did play their part but also I beleive Rick Wakeman, ELP (even thoiugh I love thei works) especially Greg Lake and Phil Collins all have a big part to blame beaucse they either went pop or it all got really silly and overly pomp they caused it to become cheesy and a parody of itself.
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Prog is music for the mind
Hear your Orphaned child!
Check out my bands myspace site: www.myspace.com/equinox17
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 10:00 |
Sounds like a Bon Jovi song:
"Shot through the heart, and you're to blame,
Darling, you give prog a bad name"
But who's to blame? The music press in the first place, definitely!
But to be honest: also some proggers who acted like they were a bit too big for their boots: ELP for instance. Don't get me wrong, I love lots of the music they did! But their attitude in the early days... I can't watch some of their earlier video footage without some "vicarious shame".
Edited by Moogtron III
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PaHa
Forum Newbie
Joined: October 28 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 22
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 10:18 |
I voted for the punk rock bands.
Because everywhere I go and say that I like Progressive Rock everybody says: "Ah, so you go to concerts like *insert punkband here*, don't you get a head ache of all the headbanging?"
When you say that you're a progrock-fan people think you jump and scream and act like a stupid fool when listening to music.
Damn punk.
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StyLaZyn
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 22 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4079
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 10:32 |
Although the media is to blame, it's important to recognize that listeners of Prog can think for themselves. They know what type of music can be appreciated. Prog is not for the unthinking, non-appreciative masses. Do I blame the general public? Not really. Look how easily they are swayed. (i.e. in the USA, Bush is President and STILL in office) The inability to think for oneself is such a tragedy of the human being.
I've mentioned before that the reason pop works and Prog doesn't could be rooted in simplicity. Does not Progressive Rock take time to digest? Pop must have the quality of immediate satisfaction. This is what the music critics go after. One the music becomes difficult to understand, it is treated less favorably.
Another thing to consider is what do the lyrics of Prog convey? Typically not "boy meets girl" topics, yet this is a fundamental understanding we all have. Once heavier ideas or fantasy topics are sung about, it becomes an immediate turn off to the general public. They either can't relate or just don't have time.
The quality of the musician is expected to be high and doesn't matter what they are playing. So for one to point to Prog musicians being above standard is inconsequential to the average listener. Very fine musicians are found in pop music, they just aren't showing their prowess. I don't believe the general public wants to listen to odd meters or incredible chops song after song.
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Phil
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 17 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 1881
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 11:10 |
Inverted snobbery from the music press.
Granted prog maybe didn't help itself by e.g. putting on silly shows on ice (sorry Rick, I'm a big fan y'know!)
As for moogtron's comments about watching early ELP and suffering
vicarious shame..hhm yes I see what you mean but sadly (for me) I
really enjoyed that kind of stuff!!
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 27 2004
Location: Peru
Status: Offline
Points: 19557
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 11:59 |
Critics who dare to talk about Prog' without understanding a note and sheeps who believe what this ignorant critics and DJ's say.
Don't blame musicians, most of them are doing ttheir best, and all have merits in different degrees, blame the status quo that priviledges easy music for idiots rather than intelligent music with good taste.
Iván
Edited by ivan_2068
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Empathy
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 30 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1864
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 12:08 |
I gotta go with Wakeman here. From Rock to ice ballet? C'mon, man.
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Pure Brilliance:
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Sean Trane
Special Collaborator
Prog Folk
Joined: April 29 2004
Location: Heart of Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 20338
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 12:29 |
I am tired of always pointing out ELP or its parts!
So I will pick on the man with the stardust-sprikled cape eating Bami Goreng during his bassist's solo!! Shame on him!!! Him and his stupid rock ballet on ice or his ridiculous Journey to the centre of our planet! More like he was looking up his own arse!!
The man came to epitomize what was wrong with prog!!
The music press ios the obvious answer and Punk just needed the publicity stunt!!
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let's just stay above the moral melee prefer the sink to the gutter keep our sand-castle virtues content to be a doer as well as a thinker, prefer lifting our pen rather than un-sheath our sword
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sleeper
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 09 2005
Location: Entropia
Status: Offline
Points: 16449
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 12:37 |
My main votes go to the music press for putting prog down and the music industry for keeping it there
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Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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A'swepe
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 08 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 590
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Posted: December 08 2005 at 18:26 |
I don't think is so much a bad name as a simply misunderstood genre. There's not much airplay except for the classics (Roundabout, Lucky Man, etc.), not that airplay is all that appealing to a large number of Proggers.
It does take a certain sophistication (I'm NOT talking about snobbery!) to appreciate prog, therefore, the audience is smaller, & consequently, much more appreciative of the music.
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David - Never doubt in the dark that which you believe to be true in the light.
http://www.myspace.com/aardvarktxusa - Instrumental rock
http://www.soundclick.com/aardvarktxusa
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Norbert
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 20 2005
Location: Hungary
Status: Offline
Points: 2506
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Posted: December 09 2005 at 03:04 |
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lunaticviolist
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 17 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 478
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Posted: December 09 2005 at 03:12 |
I have to say the music press.
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My recent purchases:
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lunaticviolist
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 17 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 478
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Posted: December 09 2005 at 03:13 |
Hmmm...I'm surprised no one has voted for EL and/or P yet.
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My recent purchases:
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NutterAlert
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 07 2005
Location: In transition
Status: Offline
Points: 2808
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Posted: December 09 2005 at 04:15 |
The British class system and the unequal distribution of wealth, power and opportunities...maybe?
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Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
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Posted: December 09 2005 at 06:38 |
Well, I dont remember. I was only about 7 years old when punk was happening, but I would imagine it was mainly the music press. One thing I know about music journos is that they dont actually know anything about music, and are therefore not qualified to write intelligently about it. Music journos are concerned only with whats 'cool' If their editors say 'This band is in this week. Promote them' then thats what they have to do in order to keep working for that paper.
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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