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Tauhd Zaïa View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Zeuhl Definition
    Posted: July 04 2004 at 02:28

I'm curious, always curious...

For those (I hope not only french people) who know MAGMA, ESKATON, WEIDORJE, DÜN, and so many others :

"What is your definition for ZEUHL MUSIC"

(I think it is the real first step to work on this category of music)

 

For me who have no words for the moment I only suggest this picture of the "Old Master Vander" (my old portly gentleman with a little hair but always his wonderfull eyes)

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philippe View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 04 2004 at 03:47
Check this page for the official definition http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/8366/MAGMA-ARTICL ES-option-Jan-1988.html

Edited by philippe
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Tauhd Zaïa View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 04 2004 at 03:57

Originally posted by philippe philippe wrote:

Check this page for the official definition http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Alley/8366/MAGMA-ARTICL ES-option-Jan-1988.html

yessssssss I know it

but pleeeeeease, forget what it is said about Zeuhl by professionnals and official definitions (mainly wrong or inexact for me)

It is your OWN definition which represents an interrest for me and I hope the work of MAX. Think by yourself

Is it possible ????

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 04 2004 at 04:19

je crois qu'il n'y a pas de meilleur définition que celle de l'intéréssé lui même, non?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 04 2004 at 04:51

bon laisse béton, c'est vraiment sans espoirs

NB : Christian VANDER a donné de très nombreuses définitions différentes qu'il serait inutile pour le moment d'évoquer ici.

J'en ai même une qu'il m'a donné de visu lors d'une discussion que j'ai eu avec lui il y a bien longtemps.

Toujours est-il que ces définitions s'adressent plus à MAGMA qu'au mouvement Zeuhl en général et il me semble difficile dans l'état actuel des choses qu'elles correspondent par exemple à RUINS, DÜN ou autres avatars.

 

Je sens poindre une immense fatigue

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 04 2004 at 13:35

A thread launched by a french woman for french people only. 

Zeuhl : a really unique kind of music that blends elements of hard-bop (John Coltrane), opera, rock, some dissonance and a language understandable only by them (kobaïa), plus judging by their album artworks [I never got into their lyrics] and their album titles [Mekanikh destruktiw kommandoh], the musical world they created seems very gloomy .  My top three Magma albums are : MDK, Kohntarkosz, 1001 ° centigrades but I admit I am not very fond of their music and of zeuhl in general.

"Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 04 2004 at 14:01
Originally posted by lucas lucas wrote:

A thread launched by a french woman for french people only. 

Unfortunately yes

But the reason of this thread is MAX....

He suggested me to work on Zeuhl and as I am not alone

Maybe we have to cancel all Zeuhl music here and to swich to a french (or european) site

I hope no !

Pls wake up american people (and some european members...)

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 04:15
 Zheul music created by the frenchies of Magma is a particuar form of fusion jazz including vocals, innovative elements of composition borrowed from classical contemporary music. A kind of Avant-garde jazz with unlimited possibilities of orchestration.

Edited by philippe
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 05:04

I only have ONE Zeuhl album (MDK by Magma). I love it, but not always. I have to be in the mood for it, because sometimes I find it very inaccessible.

For me, the album is very special.  It sounds like a little rock, a little jazz and A LOT OF modern classical music. It sounds very much like minimal music to me (you know, like Steve Reich).

Am I right?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 06:49
Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

I only have ONE Zeuhl album (MDK by Magma). I love it, but not always. I have to be in the mood for it, because sometimes I find it very inaccessible.

This don't surprise me and I feel the same thing.

As Zeuhl needs a spiritual approach we have to find good state of mind to ear this music and to appreciate it  (not possible when I wash table-service)

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

For me, the album is very special.  It sounds like a little rock, a little jazz and A LOT OF modern classical music. It sounds very much like minimal music to me (you know, like Steve Reich).

Some people said "Chamber-rock" but I don't have the musical knowledge and competences to discuss this term.

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

Am I right?

Nobody is right or wrong in music (it is my own opinion)

Everybody has the right to feel what he wants by himself, it is very personal

Playing music and to speak about music is another problem...sometimes a great responsability...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 06:55
Art Zoyd and Present belong to this genre, right?
 
I have
 
Art Zoyd: Symphinie pour le jour on bruleront les cites, Muique puor 'Odyssee, Generation sans futur and Archieves 1
 
Present: High Infidelity
 
I really like it but it's very hard to get, it's a shame. Maybe there should be more remasters for this genre. 
If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear...
George Orwell
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 07:02
Originally posted by diddy diddy wrote:

Art Zoyd and Present belong to this genre, right?
 
For some people yes, other no...
For me Art Zoyd (and even Univers Zero) is not typical Zeuhl
In this case what is the category of this music ????
 
Originally posted by diddy diddy wrote:

I really like it but it's very hard to get, it's a shame. Maybe there should be more remasters for this genre. 

I have all the records of this band but I really don't know if it is possible to propose you my help here as illegal copies are forbidden

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 07:30
Originally posted by Tauhd Zaïa Tauhd Zaïa wrote:

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

I only have ONE Zeuhl album (MDK by Magma). I love it, but not always. I have to be in the mood for it, because sometimes I find it very inaccessible.

This don't surprise me and I feel the same thing.

As Zeuhl needs a spiritual approach we have to find good state of mind to ear this music and to appreciate it  (not possible when I wash table-service)

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

For me, the album is very special.  It sounds like a little rock, a little jazz and A LOT OF modern classical music. It sounds very much like minimal music to me (you know, like Steve Reich).

Some people said "Chamber-rock" but I don't have the musical knowledge and competences to discuss this term.

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

Am I right?

Nobody is right or wrong in music (it is my own opinion)

Everybody has the right to feel what he wants by himself, it is very personal

Playing music and to speak about music is another problem...sometimes a great responsability...

By saying "Am I right?" I meant: "Is Magma influenced by minimal music?" or "does anyone else hear what I mean?"

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 07:36
Originally posted by Tauhd Zaïa Tauhd Zaïa wrote:

I have all the records of this band but I really don't know if it is possible to propose you my help here as illegal copies are forbidden
 
Yes, it's forbidden but just imagine how rare the albums are. I think that a band like Art Zoyd would be happy to have more fans and listeners. All there albums are sold out and people discovering this band have no chance to get these albums. Sometimes I see one on eBay but it always gets so  expensive that I don't buy it because I really can't afford it, I'm a student, I was a student...but yet I have no real income. And btw, buying an album on eBay doesn't help the band because they don't get money from it.
I discovered Art Zoyd and Present, as wel as Magma but don't get their albums so I stopped to expand this kind of music because the albums are very rare and expensive ...
 
 
If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear...
George Orwell
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 08:29

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

By saying "Am I right?" I meant: "Is Magma influenced by minimal music?" or "does anyone else hear what I mean?"

Vander himself says that he was mainly influenced by John Coltrane he has even learned drums with the drummer of John Coltrane.

But this influence is not musical but spiritual : the way to play music (any kind of music).

I would like just to add this :

Most of white people use to ear music with the intellect, brain but Zeuhl music has to be eared with his eart and spiritual mind like black people. That makes all difference

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 08:32
Originally posted by diddy diddy wrote:

Yes, it's forbidden but just imagine how rare the albums are. I think that a band like Art Zoyd would be happy to have more fans and listeners. All there albums are sold out and people discovering this band have no chance to get these albums. Sometimes I see one on eBay but it always gets so  expensive that I don't buy it because I really can't afford it, I'm a student, I was a student...but yet I have no real income. And btw, buying an album on eBay doesn't help the band because they don't get money from it.
I discovered Art Zoyd and Present, as wel as Magma but don't get their albums so I stopped to expand this kind of music because the albums are very rare and expensive ...

So you don't belong to the people responsible of the decreasing of the CD sales

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 08:38
Originally posted by Tauhd Zaïa Tauhd Zaïa wrote:

So you don't belong to the people responsible of the decreasing of the CD sales
 
No  I'm the oppisite. I buy about 8 CDs a Month. Almost my whole money goes out to the record companies
OK some of them are bought on eBay but the rest...
If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 09:07
Originally posted by Tauhd Zaïa Tauhd Zaïa wrote:

Originally posted by Joren Joren wrote:

By saying "Am I right?" I meant: "Is Magma influenced by minimal music?" or "does anyone else hear what I mean?"

Vander himself says that he was mainly influenced by John Coltrane he has even learned drums with the drummer of John Coltrane.

But this influence is not musical but spiritual : the way to play music (any kind of music).

I would like just to add this :

Most of white people use to ear music with the intellect, brain but Zeuhl music has to be eared with his eart and spiritual mind like black people. That makes all difference

I'm not always in a spiritual mood...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 15:59

J'ai eu un mauvais experience avec le Zeuhl, et a cette moment je croie que c'est pas vraiment un style de musique qui m'interesse.  Je ne sais pas pourqoi j'ai pris le temps pour dire cela, mais peut-etre je voulais un excuse pour parler le francais

Et je m'excuse, mon francais n'est pas tres bon...



Edited by Useful_Idiot
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 05 2004 at 16:03
Originally posted by Useful_Idiot Useful_Idiot wrote:

Et je m'excuse, mon francais n'est pas tres bon...

Si, il est plutôt bon !

"Magma was the very first gothic rock band" (Didier Lockwood)
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